History Main / PointDefenseless

27th Sep '16 10:40:21 PM Codefreak5
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* In the final battle of ''VideoGame/HalfLife2'' ''Episode Two'', Gordon faces several groups comprised of a single Strider and several Hunters, and has several bombs that can destroy Striders in one hit at his disposal. However, if he tries to attach the bomb to the Strider, the Hunters will shoot it down before it can do any damage.
9th Sep '16 3:14:41 AM LinTaylor
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** Garrod Ran of ''[[Anime/AfterWarGundamX Gundam X]]'' managed to defeat a MonsterOfTheWeek mobile suit with his Gundam's head vulcans, but only because it was the most fragile of {{Fragile Speedster}}s[[note]]The pilot, whose preferred combat style was DeathByAThousandCuts, ordered the mechanics to strip it of any and all excess weight -- which included all the armor except for the bare minimum required to cover up the internal machinery[[/note]].
6th Sep '16 3:27:39 PM Ferot_Dreadnaught
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* In the first ''VideoGame/{{Crysis}}'' game, the US fleet isn't the least bit able to defend itself against the slow moving hordes of alien ships. Worse, the fleet gets only a 5 second warning about the approaching ships before they wreck the carrier's flight deck by simply crashing into it. A later cutscene shows many more alien craft in the background, and a nuclear warhead had just been detonated, so [[TheyJustDidntCare they could've easily told us]] the aliens did a ZergRush and 99% were shot down before getting close and have the damage done by the remaining 1%, or that the systems were blinded by the nuke's EMP waves.

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* In the first ''VideoGame/{{Crysis}}'' game, the US fleet isn't the least bit able to defend itself against the slow moving hordes of alien ships. Worse, the fleet gets only a 5 second warning about the approaching ships before they wreck the carrier's flight deck by simply crashing into it. A later cutscene shows many more alien craft in the background, and a nuclear warhead had just been detonated, so [[TheyJustDidntCare they could've easily told us]] us the aliens did a ZergRush and 99% were shot down before getting close and have the damage done by the remaining 1%, or that the systems were blinded by the nuke's EMP waves.
7th Aug '16 1:20:47 PM erforce
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* Mostly averted in ''Privateer 2'', in which even cargo freighters are at GunshipRescue level thanks to their relentless, targeted, and high-powered turret fire. Either you're constantly evading, you get out of range, or you get shredded. Depending on the ship, you might be able to take it out by getting into that blind spot.

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* Mostly averted in ''Privateer 2'', ''VideoGame/Privateer2TheDarkening'', in which even cargo freighters are at GunshipRescue level thanks to their relentless, targeted, and high-powered turret fire. Either you're constantly evading, you get out of range, or you get shredded. Depending on the ship, you might be able to take it out by getting into that blind spot.



* Ships in ''NexusTheJupiterIncident'' can be equipped with rapid-fire flak lasers that can destroy enemy fighters and incoming missiles (but not torpedoes, they are too fast) -- though you're better off with fighter escort since they break off and intercept threats automatically.

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* Ships in ''NexusTheJupiterIncident'' ''VideoGame/NexusTheJupiterIncident'' can be equipped with rapid-fire flak lasers that can destroy enemy fighters and incoming missiles (but not torpedoes, they are too fast) -- though you're better off with fighter escort since they break off and intercept threats automatically.
20th Jul '16 5:40:24 PM Kadorhal
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** In ''VideoGame/AceCombat5TheUnsungWar'', the heroes' aircraft carrier is damaged by a sea-skimming anti-ship missile [[CutsceneIncompetence during a cutscene]], despite its CIWS's attempts to shoot it down. This is actually fairly realistic -- see RealLife, below. Also PlayedForLaughs in an early mission, where you hear over the radar a ship crewman ordering Phalanx fire in response to enemy missiles, a second or two of it firing, and then "No! Stop! You're firing on the docks!"

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** In ''VideoGame/AceCombat5TheUnsungWar'', the heroes' aircraft carrier is damaged by a sea-skimming anti-ship missile [[CutsceneIncompetence during a cutscene]], despite its CIWS's attempts to shoot it down. This is actually fairly realistic -- see RealLife, below. Also PlayedForLaughs in an early mission, where you hear over the radar a ship crewman ordering Phalanx fire in response to enemy missiles, a second or two of it firing, and then "No! Stop! You're firing on the docks!"docks!" There is likewise one mission where the player is able to imitate the real-world Wild Weasel role (see the real-life folder) - the enemy's air defense for that mission primarily consists of shoulder-fired [=SAMs=] that don't show up on radar and can't be targeted, but if you bait one into firing and then dodge the missile, you can then lob a bomb or dumb-fire a missile at its position to destroy it anyway, [[OhCrap prompting a bit of a freak-out from them]].



** ''VideoGame/AceCombatInfinity'' includes drones which carry highly-effective anti-missile lasers. They also show up on the strongest variant of ''VideoGame/{{Ace Combat 6|FiresOfLiberation}}''[='=]s Aigaion, though they have rather easy to abuse blind spots, especially if you've managed to take care of the AAM's and other guns first. Naval Fleet Assault mode also somewhat averts this, as Aegis ships have a set of respawning point-defense guns that can shoot down missiles aimed at themselves or other ships in their fleet... but if you're within a decent distance they won't have time to shoot down the missiles (no matter how much your AWACS insists they were intercepted). Not to mention as well that missiles are apparently the ''only'' weapons they can intercept.

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** ''VideoGame/AceCombatInfinity'' includes drones which carry highly-effective anti-missile lasers. They also show up on the strongest variant of ''VideoGame/{{Ace Combat 6|FiresOfLiberation}}''[='=]s Aigaion, though they have rather easy to abuse blind spots, especially if you've managed to take care of the AAM's and other guns first. Naval Fleet Assault mode also somewhat averts this, as Aegis ships have a set of respawning point-defense guns that can shoot down missiles aimed at themselves or other ships in their fleet... but if you're within a decent distance they won't have time to shoot down the missiles (no matter how much your AWACS insists they were intercepted). Not to mention as well that missiles are apparently the ''only'' weapons they can intercept.intercept - all manner of bombs and other ground munitions, even ones like [[RecursiveAmmo stand-off dispensers]] that essentially work exactly ''like'' a missile without actually being one, are entirely untouchable.



* Averted in the ''Meta Knight's Revenge'' from ''VideoGame/KirbySuperStar'': The Halberd's gun batteries are able to shoot down Kirby's Warp Star and swat him off the bridge, forcing him to assault it again with Dyna Blade. Even then, she gets shot down almost instantly and barely manages to get Kirby on board.

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* Averted in the ''Meta Knight's Revenge'' from ''VideoGame/KirbySuperStar'': The Halberd's gun batteries are able to shoot down Kirby's Warp Star and swat him off the bridge, forcing him to assault it again with Dyna Blade. Even then, she gets shot down almost instantly and barely manages to get Kirby on board.



* In ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosBrawl'', The Subspace Gunship has enough auto-turrets to literally fill the sky with projectiles.... yet they can't hit the broad side of a barn door. The destruction of the Halberd was implied to be a deliberate action on part of the heroes; once the smaller ships are released, the Gunship's turrets are suddenly slightly less accurate than your average Imperial Stormtrooper. Even Olimar's ship (shown later as barely capable of keeping up with the other ships) has little trouble avoiding the enemy fire.

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* In ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBrosBrawl'', The Subspace Gunship has enough auto-turrets to literally fill the sky with projectiles.... yet they can't hit the broad side of a barn door. The destruction of the Halberd was implied to be a deliberate action on part of the heroes; once the smaller ships are released, the Gunship's turrets are suddenly slightly less accurate than your average Imperial Stormtrooper. Even Olimar's ship (shown later as [[TheAllegedCar barely capable of keeping up with the other ships) ships]]) has little trouble avoiding the enemy fire.



* The [[http://deusex.wikia.com/wiki/Aggressive_Defense_System aggressive defence]] augmentation of ''VideoGame/DeusEx'' destroys missiles before they can hit you, at higher levels it can actually hurt enemies by making their rockets explode near them.

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* The [[http://deusex.wikia.com/wiki/Aggressive_Defense_System aggressive defence]] augmentation of ''VideoGame/DeusEx'' destroys missiles before they can hit you, at you. At higher levels it can actually hurt enemies by making their rockets explode near them.



* Averted in ''VideoGame/{{Earth2150}}'' where Morphidian aliens can breed a type of airship fitted with dozens of lasers able to shoot down any amount of missiles.
* Averted in ''Franchise/MassEffect''. Ships mount GARDIAN laser turrets to destroy incoming ordnance and fighters. At close range they double as an offensive weapon, since kinetic barriers are useless against energy weapons. One of the many reasons humanity scares the galaxy is because only humans thought to build capital ships armed with nothing but fighters.

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* Averted in ''VideoGame/{{Earth2150}}'' ''VideoGame/{{Earth 2150}}'' where Morphidian aliens can breed a type of airship fitted with dozens of lasers able to shoot down any amount of missiles.
* Averted in ''Franchise/MassEffect''. Ships mount GARDIAN laser turrets to destroy incoming ordnance and fighters. At close range they double as an offensive weapon, since kinetic barriers are useless against energy weapons. One of the many reasons humanity scares the rest of the galaxy is because only humans thought to build capital ships armed with nothing but fighters.



* [[ZigzaggingTrope Zigzaged]] in ''Videogame/BattlefleetGothicArmada, where the usefulness of interception fire varies a great deal. Every ship in the game has in built turrets that attempt to stop incoming bombers, torpedo's and boarding parties, usualy with a decent degree of success, and the turrets of two friendly ships in close proximity will cover each other. However, there are many factors that may reduce the effectiveness of turrets, from increasing the speed of your torpedoes (so they spend less time in range of the turrets), to giving all your fighters and bombers a chance to dodge destruction (with the Eldar faction's bombers having an insane 50% dodge chance) to the fact that ships lose one turret for every 100 health they lose.

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* [[ZigzaggingTrope Zigzaged]] in ''Videogame/BattlefleetGothicArmada, ''Videogame/BattlefleetGothicArmada'', where the usefulness of interception fire varies a great deal. Every ship in the game has in built turrets that attempt to stop incoming bombers, torpedo's and boarding parties, usualy with a decent degree of success, and the turrets of two friendly ships in close proximity will cover each other. However, there are many factors that may reduce the effectiveness of turrets, from increasing the speed of your torpedoes (so they spend less time in range of the turrets), to giving all your fighters and bombers a chance to dodge destruction (with the Eldar faction's bombers having an insane 50% dodge chance) to the fact that ships lose one turret for every 100 health they lose.



* Averted in Disney's ''WesternAnimation/TaleSpin'', the only entrance to Cape Suzette by air or sea is through a long, narrow canyon cut into a sheer cliff. To protect the city against invasion, the top of the cliff, as well as the canyon walls, are littered with dozens of manned anti-air flak guns. Although individually they're not very accurate, the sheer ''[[MoreDakka number]]'' of them makes their barrage is so fearsome even the Air Pirates in their flying fortress would rather turn tail than face them.

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* Averted in Disney's ''WesternAnimation/TaleSpin'', the only entrance to Cape Suzette by air or sea is through a long, narrow canyon cut into a sheer cliff. To protect the city against invasion, the top of the cliff, as well as the canyon walls, are littered with dozens of manned anti-air flak guns. Although individually they're not very accurate, the sheer ''[[MoreDakka number]]'' of them makes their barrage is so fearsome even the Air Pirates in their flying fortress would rather turn tail than face them.



* In reality, modern point defense systems are last-ditch desperation weapons primarily intended for use against incoming missiles; a missile only gets close enough to be engaged by point defenses if someone else has already screwed up. Given the difficulty of hitting a relatively small target hurtling toward you at multiple times the speed of sound in the few seconds between when you can first detect it and when it hits you, even modern anti-missile systems are far from foolproof, though they certainly aren't useless.

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* In reality, modern point defense systems are last-ditch desperation weapons primarily intended for use against incoming missiles; a missile only gets close enough to be engaged by point defenses if someone else has already screwed up.up and let that missile be launched in the first place. Given the difficulty of hitting a relatively small target hurtling toward you at multiple times the speed of sound in the few seconds between when you can first detect it and when it hits you, even modern anti-missile systems are far from foolproof, though they certainly aren't useless.



** Because they were originally designed to engage planes, Patriot missiles tended to detonate too slowly when fired at SCUD missiles (which travel much ''faster'' than manned aircraft), resulting in actual performance falling short of test results until a later software update. In fact, Coalition propaganda aside, the Patriot missiles were proving so useless in stopping the [=SCUDs=] from hitting Israeli targets that Israel was preparing its own military retaliation over the pleas of the US Government to hold back and only called it off when Saddam Hussein admitted defeat and pulled out of Kuwait.
** Another big problem the Patriots had wasn't that they were failing to hit the [=SCUDs=]. Not only did the Patriot's warheads detonate too slowly, they are also indiscriminate about what part of the SCUD they hit - as mentioned they were designed to hit planes where the point is largely moot. Many [=SCUDs=] were hit by Patriots, but only the rocket was destroyed. The SCUD's warhead remained intact, and would then fall to Earth. If that plummeting warhead happened to land on a populated area, it may as well have not been intercepted at all. Later updates to the system designed specifically to intercept ballistic missiles were made to ensure that the interceptor exploded ahead of the missile it was intercepting, thus maximizing the odds of destroying the warhead.
** In the Falklands War a number of British [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_42_destroyer Type 42 destroyers]] got hit by not only guided anti-ship missiles but also Argentine aircraft lobbing unguided munitions at them. The early iterations of the class were fitted with [=GWS30=] Sea Dart surface-to-air missile system for anti-air defense; problem was, if aircraft or missiles managed to close to within a certain range, software issues with the SAM system caused them to be unable to properly track and fire at targets because they were too close. This limitation was the reason why the class was latter fitted with two Mk.15 Phalanx CIWS.
** The newer Sea Wolf SAM fitted to a few ships in the fleet had a problem with its fire-control software that most likely inspired the example in ''Literature/RedStormRising'' described above; when multiple Argentine fighter-bombers approached in line-abreast formation, the program threw a fit because it was supposed to target the closest threat first.
*** On the other hand, when the Sea Wolf's automated system worked properly, it was often so effective that the first inkling British sailors had of an Argentine attack was when the enemy planes started blowing up.

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** Because they were originally designed to engage planes, Patriot missiles tended to detonate too slowly when fired at SCUD missiles (which travel much ''faster'' than manned aircraft), resulting in actual performance falling short of test results until a later software update. In fact, Coalition propaganda aside, the Patriot missiles were proving so useless in stopping the [=SCUDs=] from hitting Israeli targets that Israel was preparing its own military retaliation over the pleas of the US Government to hold back back, and managed to stay out of the fighting only called it off when because Saddam Hussein admitted defeat and pulled out of Kuwait.
Kuwait before they were ready.
** Another big problem the Patriots had wasn't that they were failing to hit the [=SCUDs=]. Not only did the Patriot's warheads detonate too slowly, they are were also indiscriminate about what part of the SCUD they hit - as mentioned they were designed to hit planes where [[FragileSpeedster the point is largely moot. moot]]. Many [=SCUDs=] were ''were'' hit by Patriots, but only the rocket was destroyed. The SCUD's warhead remained intact, and would then fall to Earth. If that plummeting warhead happened to land on a populated area, it may as well have not been intercepted at all. Later updates to the system designed specifically to intercept ballistic missiles were made to ensure that the interceptor exploded ahead of the missile it was intercepting, thus maximizing the odds of destroying the warhead.
** In the Falklands War a number of British [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_42_destroyer Type 42 destroyers]] got hit by not only guided anti-ship missiles but also Argentine aircraft lobbing unguided munitions at them. The early iterations of the class were fitted with [=GWS30=] Sea Dart surface-to-air missile system for anti-air defense; problem was, if aircraft or missiles managed to close to within a certain range, software issues with the SAM system caused them to be unable to properly track and fire at targets [[ArbitraryMinimumRange because they were too close.close]]. This limitation was the reason why the class was latter fitted with two Mk.15 Phalanx CIWS.
** The newer Sea Wolf SAM fitted to a few ships in the fleet had a problem with its fire-control software that most likely inspired the example in ''Literature/RedStormRising'' described above; when multiple Argentine fighter-bombers approached in line-abreast formation, the program threw a fit because it was supposed to target the closest threat first.
***
first. On the other hand, when the Sea Wolf's automated system worked ''did'' work properly, it was often so effective that the first inkling British sailors had of an Argentine attack was when the enemy planes they weren't yet aware of started blowing up.
18th Jul '16 8:33:01 PM Kadorhal
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** ''VideoGame/AceCombatInfinity'' includes drones which carry highly-effective anti-missile lasers. They also show up on the strongest variant of ''VideoGame/{{Ace Combat 6|FiresOfLiberation}}''[='=]s Aigaion, though they have rather easy to abuse blind spots, especially if you've managed to take care of the AAM's and other guns first.

to:

** ''VideoGame/AceCombatInfinity'' includes drones which carry highly-effective anti-missile lasers. They also show up on the strongest variant of ''VideoGame/{{Ace Combat 6|FiresOfLiberation}}''[='=]s Aigaion, though they have rather easy to abuse blind spots, especially if you've managed to take care of the AAM's and other guns first. Naval Fleet Assault mode also somewhat averts this, as Aegis ships have a set of respawning point-defense guns that can shoot down missiles aimed at themselves or other ships in their fleet... but if you're within a decent distance they won't have time to shoot down the missiles (no matter how much your AWACS insists they were intercepted). Not to mention as well that missiles are apparently the ''only'' weapons they can intercept.
28th Jun '16 3:23:05 AM morane
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*** ''HMS Repulse'' and ''HMS Prince of Wales'' were sunk in 1941 by land-based Japanese aircraft, and became the first capital ships to be sunk purely by air-power. They were operating without the support of any smaller vessels or fighter cover. The early loss of electrical power on the modern ''Prince of Wales'' didn't help, as its anti-aircraft turrets were rendered inoperative.

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*** ''HMS Repulse'' and ''HMS Prince of Wales'' were sunk in 1941 by land-based Japanese aircraft, and became the first capital ships to be sunk purely by air-power. They were operating without the support of any smaller vessels or fighter cover. The early loss of electrical power on the modern ''Prince of Wales'' didn't help, as its anti-aircraft turrets were rendered inoperative. It also helped the Japanese a lot that the 40 mm shells had suffered from heat and humidity and the [[DidntThinkThisThrough electronics and fine mechanics of the HACS anti-aircraft fire control system was designed for operating in cold and temperate climates]], such as Atlantic and Mediterranean, and was rendered inoperable in the heat and humidity tropics. Both ships could have just as well thrown rocks against the attacking Japanese. On the other hand, RN capital ships had successfully defended themself against German and Italian land-based bombers for two years at Atlantic and Mediterranean before the Force Z disaster.
13th Jun '16 11:38:21 AM Winter
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* ''Videogame/BattlefleetGothicArmada both plays this trope straight and averts it. It it averts it by the fact that every ship in the game has in built turrets that attempt to stop incoming bombers, torpedo's and boarding parties with generally a decent degree of success, and the turrets of two friendly ships in close proximity will cover each other. Played straight however by the fact that there are many, *many* ways of getting around turrets. From increasing the speed of your torpedo's (so they spend less time in range of the turrets), to giving all your fighters and bombers a chance to dodge destruction (with the Eldar faction's bombers having an insane 50% dodge chance) to the fact that ships lose one turret for every 100 health they lose.

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* ''Videogame/BattlefleetGothicArmada both plays this trope straight and averts it. It it averts it by [[ZigzaggingTrope Zigzaged]] in ''Videogame/BattlefleetGothicArmada, where the fact that every usefulness of interception fire varies a great deal. Every ship in the game has in built turrets that attempt to stop incoming bombers, torpedo's and boarding parties parties, usualy with generally a decent degree of success, and the turrets of two friendly ships in close proximity will cover each other. Played straight however by the fact that However, there are many, *many* ways many factors that may reduce the effectiveness of getting around turrets. From turrets, from increasing the speed of your torpedo's torpedoes (so they spend less time in range of the turrets), to giving all your fighters and bombers a chance to dodge destruction (with the Eldar faction's bombers having an insane 50% dodge chance) to the fact that ships lose one turret for every 100 health they lose.
13th Jun '16 12:23:32 AM Wraithsight
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* ''Videogame/BattlefleetGothicArmada both plays this trope straight and averts it. It it averts it by the fact that every ship in the game has in built turrets that attempt to stop incoming bombers, torpedo's and boarding parties with generally a decent degree of success, and the turrets of two friendly ships in close proximity will cover each other. Played straight however by the fact that there are many, *many* ways of getting around turrets. From increasing the speed of your torpedo's (so they spend less time in range of the turrets), to giving all your fighters and bombers a chance to dodge destruction (with the Eldar faction's bombers having an insane 50% dodge chance) to the fact that ships lose one turret for every 100 health they lose.
11th Jun '16 11:26:26 AM LinTaylor
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** Averted with one of the other settings, a SerialNumbersFiledOff version of ''Franchise/{{Gundam}}'', where one of the robots has multiple laser turrets all over its body coordinated by high-power sensors and can shred anyone foolish enough to get too close.
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