History Main / NoPointsForNeutrality

18th Jan '16 10:51:45 AM thatother1dude
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* Averted in the ''Franchise/ShinMegamiTensei'' series, where the Neutral path is usually the only way to avoid humanity's annihilation or enslavement. Of course, [[HumansAreBastards depending on your viewpoint]], this may not qualify as the ''best'' ending...
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* Averted in the ''Franchise/ShinMegamiTensei'' series, where the Neutral path is usually the hardest to obtain but [[EarnYourHappyEnding the only way to avoid humanity's annihilation or enslavement.enslavement]]. Of course, [[HumansAreBastards depending on your viewpoint]], this may not qualify as the ''best'' ending...
6th Jan '16 3:50:47 PM WanderingBrowser
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* In ''BaldursGate'', you can play a neutral alignment, but most quest rewards are based on a good/evil option, and rewards are biased towards good, [[EvilPaysBetter subverting the normal temptation for players.]] Neutral-aligned party members will stay with a group with saintly reputation despite occasionally complaining, and even evil companions will only leave at the highest (19-20) reputation levels.
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* In ''BaldursGate'', ''Franchise/BaldursGate'', you can play a neutral alignment, but most quest rewards are based on a good/evil option, and rewards are biased towards good, [[EvilPaysBetter subverting the normal temptation for players.]] Neutral-aligned party members will stay with a group with saintly reputation despite occasionally complaining, and even evil companions will only leave at the highest (19-20) reputation levels.

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* In ''BaldursGate'', ** This is sort of justified, however, in that the game's storyline is that you can play a neutral alignment, but most quest rewards are based on a good/evil option, and rewards are biased towards good, [[EvilPaysBetter subverting child of a resident GodOfEvil; either you're actively fighting against the normal temptation impulse to take his place, or actively embracing it. There's not a whole lot of room for players.]] Neutral-aligned party members will stay with a group with saintly reputation despite occasionally complaining, and even evil companions will only leave at the highest (19-20) reputation levels.middle ground there.
19th Dec '15 4:00:02 PM nombretomado
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** ''Fable'' is a notable aversion of this. While there are times where you have to make a flat Good or Evil decision, most of these are pretty clear-cut cases (will you spare the bandit or kill him?) and you don't recieve any penalties for staying neutral. The townsfolk will even comment on this, discussing your characters unpredictability. The ending of the Lost Chapters is pretty neutral, coming down to a straight fight between you and the villain. ** ''Fable 2'' likewise doesn't really penalise you for staying neutral, other than affecting prices, and even then you don't have to be a paragon of virtue or the scariest person alive to talk the townsfolk into giving you a better deal. There are also more neutral choices. At the start of the game, you have a chance to free some townsfolk or let them become slaves for a bribe. One of the options is to walk clean away from the situation altogether after the bandit attacks you anyway, leaving them in their cages for someone else to either let out or enslave. You've cleared the roadblock to Bowerstone, from your perspective it's [[BystanderSyndrome someone else's problem]]. And there is an explicitly neutral ending option. * Averted in ''ShadowTheHedgehog''. Going down the "neutral" path means not helping either the heroes or Black Doom, but instead going after Dr. Eggman. The main conflict still goes on, but Shadow isn't much of a factor in it. Though, individual levels, especially those on the extreme ends of the map, can sometimes play this straight if there's no neutral option. And the game ''does'' take this trope's title literally- the good and evil goals add and subtract points based on your morality, while the neutral goals ignore morality and only judge your score by speed and rings collected.
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** ''Fable'' ''{{VideoGame/Fable|I}}'' is a notable aversion of this. While there are times where you have to make a flat Good or Evil decision, most of these are pretty clear-cut cases (will you spare the bandit or kill him?) and you don't recieve any penalties for staying neutral. The townsfolk will even comment on this, discussing your characters unpredictability. The ending of the Lost Chapters is pretty neutral, coming down to a straight fight between you and the villain. ** ''Fable 2'' ''VideoGame/FableII'' likewise doesn't really penalise you for staying neutral, other than affecting prices, and even then you don't have to be a paragon of virtue or the scariest person alive to talk the townsfolk into giving you a better deal. There are also more neutral choices. At the start of the game, you have a chance to free some townsfolk or let them become slaves for a bribe. One of the options is to walk clean away from the situation altogether after the bandit attacks you anyway, leaving them in their cages for someone else to either let out or enslave. You've cleared the roadblock to Bowerstone, from your perspective it's [[BystanderSyndrome someone else's problem]]. And there is an explicitly neutral ending option. * Averted in ''ShadowTheHedgehog''.''VideoGame/ShadowTheHedgehog''. Going down the "neutral" path means not helping either the heroes or Black Doom, but instead going after Dr. Eggman. The main conflict still goes on, but Shadow isn't much of a factor in it. Though, individual levels, especially those on the extreme ends of the map, can sometimes play this straight if there's no neutral option. And the game ''does'' take this trope's title literally- the good and evil goals add and subtract points based on your morality, while the neutral goals ignore morality and only judge your score by speed and rings collected.
4th Dec '15 2:18:29 AM Ninjat126
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** In story, good!Cole comes across as a bit of an AntiHero or EverymanHero. In gameplay, you're locked into the one path except near the end of both games: a PoweredByAForsakenChild upgrade in 1, or the SadisticChoice in 2.
15th Nov '15 11:50:04 AM LentilSandEater
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* Averted in ''[[VideoGame/GalacticCivilizations Galactic Civilizations II]]'': When your civilization chooses an alignment, all three alignments (good, neutral and evil) have bonuses. Some players even argue that the Neutral choice gives the ''best'' bonuses. ** Keyword here is ''choose''. The permanent alignment selection is a ScrewTheRulesIHaveMoney event that allows you to totally ignore your KarmaMeter and set your alignment to whatever you want as long as you can pay for it. But up till then, the game plays this straight. The best bonuses from KarmaMeter actions almost exclusively favor Evil choices while having Good alignment helps you diplomatically. Neutral gets neither. *** Not entirely true... some of the evil choices also come with a drawback, frequently killing some amount of your [[strike:slaves]] citizens, while the neutral ones tend to give you a small benefit for no downside.
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* Averted in * ''[[VideoGame/GalacticCivilizations Galactic Civilizations II]]'': When II]]'': ** Averted when your civilization chooses an alignment, all three alignments (good, neutral and evil) have bonuses. Some players even argue that the Neutral choice gives the ''best'' bonuses. ** Keyword here is ''choose''. The permanent alignment selection is a ScrewTheRulesIHaveMoney event that allows you to totally ignore your KarmaMeter and set your alignment to whatever you want as long as you can pay for it. But up till then, the game plays this straight. The best bonuses from KarmaMeter actions almost exclusively favor Evil choices while having Good alignment helps you diplomatically. Neutral gets neither. *** Not entirely true... some of the evil choices also come with a drawback, frequently killing some amount of your [[strike:slaves]] citizens, while the neutral ones tend to give you a small benefit for no downside.
15th Nov '15 11:47:17 AM LentilSandEater
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Not lampshaded
* The roguelike ''Omega'' has a pantheon of religions, two pointing to each of Law, Chaos and Religion. One of the neutral gods explicitly lampshades this due to the messages saying your choice was completely useless each time you advance in that religion. However, it does give a safe path to the endgame.
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* The roguelike ''Omega'' has a pantheon of religions, two pointing to each of Law, Chaos and Religion. One of the neutral gods explicitly lampshades names this due to the messages saying your choice was completely useless each time you advance in that religion. However, it does give a safe path to the endgame.

* Yahtzee regularly lampshades this in ''WebAnimation/ZeroPunctuation'', even providing this page's quote. His main gripes are that it feels like he's being forced to play the game twice, and that the two sides are often mutually exclusive. He even calls out games he otherwise likes on this, such as ''inFAMOUS'' and its sequel.
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* Yahtzee regularly lampshades discusses this in ''WebAnimation/ZeroPunctuation'', even providing this page's quote. His main gripes are that it feels like he's being forced to play the game twice, and that the two sides are often mutually exclusive. He even calls out games he otherwise likes on this, such as ''inFAMOUS'' and its sequel.
13th Oct '15 9:50:15 PM WillBGood
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** In ''VideoGame/FalloutNewVegas'', the karma meter has virtually no effect on any part of the game until the ending, as [[ReputationMeter your reputation with various factions]] is far more important. Morality is essentially replaced by ideology, and the way that the whole system is set up makes it impossible to take a neutral stance. By the end of the game, whatever you have done up to that point has been done for the sake of a cause.
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** In ''VideoGame/FalloutNewVegas'', the karma meter has virtually no effect on any part of the game until the ending, as [[ReputationMeter [[AllianceMeter your reputation with various factions]] is far more important. Morality is essentially replaced by ideology, and the way that the whole system is set up makes it impossible to take a neutral stance. By the end of the game, whatever you have done up to that point has been done for the sake of a cause.
17th Sep '15 9:26:55 AM MarkLungo
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-->--'''Gottfried Leibniz''', on {{Prussia}}'s neutrality in the GreatNorthernWar
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-->--'''Gottfried Leibniz''', on {{Prussia}}'s UsefulNotes/{{Prussia}}'s neutrality in the GreatNorthernWar UsefulNotes/TheGreatNorthernWar

6th Sep '15 5:29:54 AM Vir
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* ''KnightsOfTheOldRepublic'' forces you to miss out on the top range upgrades for certain force powers if you aren't the right alignment. Good characters miss out on top-range bad powers like kill, Evil characters lose the best healing-related arts, and neutral characters don't get any of the top-tier abilities.
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* ''KnightsOfTheOldRepublic'' ''VideoGame/KnightsOfTheOldRepublic'' forces you to miss out on the top range upgrades for certain force powers if you aren't the right alignment. Good characters miss out on top-range bad powers like kill, Evil characters lose the best healing-related arts, and neutral characters don't get any of the top-tier abilities.

** StarWarsTheOldRepublic: Certain relics and clothing can only be worn by people with the correct dark/light side rating; although the end-game relics are alignment neutral. In addition, all of your characters gain access to a light-side (50% reduction of damage taken for you and your companion for 12 seconds) or dark-side ([[LifeDrain feed on half of your companion's health]] instantaneously) ability at the respective maximum alignments. You only need to reach max alignment on two characters to unlock each of them for all your characters on the server however; [[GameplayandStorySegregation so a tier 5 dark-sider can use the light side ability and vice versa]]. Although the two abilities do share a cooldown.
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** StarWarsTheOldRepublic: ''VideoGame/StarWarsTheOldRepublic'': Certain relics and clothing can only be worn by people with the correct dark/light side rating; although the end-game relics are alignment neutral. In addition, all of your characters gain access to a light-side light side (50% reduction of damage taken for you and your companion for 12 seconds) or dark-side dark side ([[LifeDrain feed on half of your companion's health]] instantaneously) ability at the respective maximum alignments. You only need to reach max alignment on two characters to unlock each of them for all your characters on the server however; [[GameplayandStorySegregation [[GameplayAndStorySegregation so a tier 5 dark-sider dark sider can use the light side ability and vice versa]]. Although the The two abilities do share a cooldown.cooldown. *** In ''Shadow of Revan'' there are some uncommon-quality lightsabers that you can only equip if your alignment is neutral (by any version's level cap, this is by having 5000 points in light and 5000 points in dark), but these are usually completely useless to most players.
14th Aug '15 5:56:46 AM DaveE
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* Halfway through ''DarkSoulsII'', you can encounter two characters you've had friendly interactions with before, fighting each other to the death. If you choose to help one of them kill the other, the survivor will reward you with a key to their secret treasure stash. [[spoiler: Picking Creighton also nets you his armor set.]] If you don't do anything, one of them will kill the other (chosen randomly), and refuse to give you the key at all.
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