History Main / NoConservationOfEnergy

7th Jul '16 4:01:37 PM FordPrefect
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* While violations of conservation of energy do not occur in classic physic, it is worth noting that there are ways around various other laws regarding energy usage, and getting as close to 100% energy efficiency as physically possible is a long-standing engineering goal:

to:

* While violations of conservation of energy do not occur in classic physic, physics, it is worth noting that there are ways around various other laws regarding energy usage, and getting as close to 100% energy efficiency as physically possible is a long-standing engineering goal:
7th Jul '16 4:00:59 PM FordPrefect
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Averted by ZPMs in ''SG-1'' and ''Series/StargateAtlantis'', as they draw energy from subspace, and so don't need to follow the conservation of energy law. And yet, this is the one form of AppliedPhlebotinum on the show for which running out of energy (after performing some truly amazing feat) ''is'' often portrayed as an issue.

to:

** Averted by ZPMs [=ZPMs=] in ''SG-1'' and ''Series/StargateAtlantis'', as they draw energy from subspace, and so don't need to follow the conservation of energy law. And yet, this is the one form of AppliedPhlebotinum on the show for which running out of energy (after performing some truly amazing feat) ''is'' often portrayed as an issue.
7th Jul '16 6:44:05 AM hullflyer
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

* ''Literature/{{Carrie}}'' at least mentions energy. When Carrie is exercising her telekinetic abilities, it is stated that her body is burning a ''lot'' of energy, which seems to be going nowhere.
28th Jun '16 4:18:28 AM Morgenthaler
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* The titular character of ''TheChroniclesOfProfessorJackBaling'' wonders about this one, both as it applies to the perpetual motion machine created by his student and his own disintegrator ray. Using the latter in quick succession does end up blowing a fuse, but the amount of energy involved in powering the thing in the first place is staggering. He shouldn’t be able to get that much juice at once in the first place.

to:

* The titular character of ''TheChroniclesOfProfessorJackBaling'' ''Literature/TheChroniclesOfProfessorJackBaling'' wonders about this one, both as it applies to the perpetual motion machine created by his student and his own disintegrator ray. Using the latter in quick succession does end up blowing a fuse, but the amount of energy involved in powering the thing in the first place is staggering. He shouldn’t be able to get that much juice at once in the first place.
25th Jun '16 1:23:20 PM TheGreatSkrond
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** The worst offender is actually probably the in-system warp drives. In a game full of arithmetic, it's only a matter of time before the player takes the mass of their ship (over two), multiplies by the square of warp speed (a couple thousand times light speed, but that's a standard scifi suspension of disbelief deal) and compare it to the amount of energy the ship draws from the capacitor to go into warp (a few Gj). At which point he'll facepalm so hard his forehead will be purple for days.
25th Jun '16 1:01:54 PM Ferot_Dreadnaught
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Even in this case, there's a [[CriticalResearchFailure Critical Research Failure]]. When preparing to enter the Hadarac, Eragon, as an experiment, attempts to convert a small quantity of sand to water. In this universe, a spell cannot be aborted once started unless specifically phrased to allow that. This troper did the calculations based upon the packing fraction curve and determined that the energy required to turn 30 grams of sand (determined by the mention of a "thimblefull" of water as the final product) into water would require more than 300 times the daily intake of energy in a 3000-calorie diet (2000 per day is typical - it's increased here because of Eragon's strenuous lifestyle at the time). Even Saphira couldn't have provided that much energy. He should have died then and there.

to:

** Even in this case, there's a [[CriticalResearchFailure Critical Research Failure]].CriticalResearchFailure. When preparing to enter the Hadarac, Eragon, as an experiment, attempts to convert a small quantity of sand to water. In this universe, a spell cannot be aborted once started unless specifically phrased to allow that. This troper did the The calculations based upon the packing fraction curve and determined that the energy required to turn 30 grams of sand (determined by the mention of a "thimblefull" of water as the final product) into water would require more than 300 times the daily intake of energy in a 3000-calorie diet (2000 per day is typical - it's increased here because of Eragon's strenuous lifestyle at the time). Even Saphira couldn't have provided that much energy. He should have died then and there.
25th Jun '16 12:59:17 PM TheGreatSkrond
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

** Even in this case, there's a [[CriticalResearchFailure Critical Research Failure]]. When preparing to enter the Hadarac, Eragon, as an experiment, attempts to convert a small quantity of sand to water. In this universe, a spell cannot be aborted once started unless specifically phrased to allow that. This troper did the calculations based upon the packing fraction curve and determined that the energy required to turn 30 grams of sand (determined by the mention of a "thimblefull" of water as the final product) into water would require more than 300 times the daily intake of energy in a 3000-calorie diet (2000 per day is typical - it's increased here because of Eragon's strenuous lifestyle at the time). Even Saphira couldn't have provided that much energy. He should have died then and there.
25th Jun '16 12:19:43 PM TheGreatSkrond
Is there an issue? Send a Message


*** Since the wizarding community doesn't believe anybody can reach the moon (not only did they not do it first, they think space travel is impossible), and they've got spells to handle the environmental problems, there probably ''is'' a limiting factor. Or some ambient planetary field all magic is powered off of.

to:

*** Since the wizarding community doesn't believe anybody can reach the moon (not only did they not do it first, they think space travel is impossible), and they've got spells to handle the environmental problems, there probably ''is'' a limiting factor. Or some ambient planetary field all magic is powered off of.by.
*** There is some limiting factor: it's mentioned in passing in Quidditch Through the Ages that some models of brooms became difficult to control or otherwise erratic at high altitudes.
*** Actually, I don't think they do have spells to handle the environmental problems. The Bubble-Head Charm may act more like a filter/compressor/gill than an oxygen tank, extracting oxygen from the environment rather than generating it. If there's no oxygen, it won't work. And there's no evidence Shield Charms prevent gas transfer, meaning you couldn't go into vacuum.
10th May '16 11:48:54 PM PaulA
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* Averted in Creator/AnneMcCaffrey's [[Literature/TowerAndTheHive Talent series]], which explains that the power necessary for the telekinetics to hurl spaceships around like toys comes from ''massive'' generators. Psychic activity (with or without a generator gestalt) also burns ''a lot'' of calories, meaning that, while a telekinetic with no generator handy can get the job done quicker, he's still doing the same amount of work as someone doing it by hand. Many of the telekinetics are shown eating some pretty high-calorie meals and snacks throughout the day to keep their strength up, and get extremely fatigued after teleporting very large objects (even with the generators helping).
** Also, it's stated that energy must be '''absorbed''' when negative work is done (for instance, teleporting an object from orbit down to ground level), although simply being the conduit for such large amounts of energy can still place enormous stress on physical systems.

to:

* Averted in Creator/AnneMcCaffrey's [[Literature/TowerAndTheHive Talent series]], 'verse (''Literature/ToRidePegasus'' trilogy and ''Literature/TowerAndTheHive'' series), which explains that the power necessary for the telekinetics to hurl spaceships around like toys comes from ''massive'' generators. Psychic activity (with or without a generator gestalt) also burns ''a lot'' of calories, meaning that, while a telekinetic with no generator handy can get the job done quicker, he's still doing the same amount of work as someone doing it by hand. Many of the telekinetics are shown eating some pretty high-calorie meals and snacks throughout the day to keep their strength up, and get extremely fatigued after teleporting very large objects (even with the generators helping).
**
helping). Also, it's stated that energy must be '''absorbed''' when negative work is done (for instance, teleporting an object from orbit down to ground level), although simply being the conduit for such large amounts of energy can still place enormous stress on physical systems.
6th May '16 12:55:22 AM PaulA
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Also averted in ''Literature/TheShipWho Won''. A brainship finds a world where magic actually works, complete with all the standard no conservation of energy tropes. Then they discover that [[spoiler:there's actually a huge generator complex powering all this, which the magicians have completely wrecked by using it for stupid things like fireballs and levitation]].

to:

** Also averted * Averted in ''Literature/TheShipWho Won''.''Literature/TheShipWhoWon''. A brainship finds a world where magic actually works, complete with all the standard no conservation of energy tropes. Then they discover that [[spoiler:there's actually a huge generator complex powering all this, which the magicians have completely wrecked by using it for stupid things like fireballs and levitation]].
This list shows the last 10 events of 328. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Main.NoConservationOfEnergy