History Main / MoreThanMindControl

4th Feb '16 1:40:27 PM Luigifan
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MindControl is an effective weapon, but your garden-variety [[{{Brainwashed}} brainwashing]] or hypnosis is too mundane for some viewers, too predictable for some plots, too weak for some [[HeroicWillPower heroes]], and too unambitious for some villains.
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MindControl is an effective weapon, but your garden-variety [[{{Brainwashed}} brainwashing]] or hypnosis is too mundane for some viewers, too predictable for some plots, too weak for some [[HeroicWillPower heroes]], and too unambitious for some villains. villains. Also, outright controlling someone's mind tends to require either magic or technology, and depending on the nature of the story, the villain might not have access to either of those.

[[TheDarkSide Magic forces may be at work]], but it's really the despair, trickery, lies, and sometimes even [[ExactWords carefully-selected]] [[MetaphoricallyTrue truths]], that are thrown in that successfully break the victim's spirit. Instead of the villain forcing a victim to do something against their will, the villain ''changes'' the victim's will. It's DealWithTheDevil [[XMeetsY meets]] BreakThemByTalking.
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What makes this "more than mind control" rather than simple [[ManipulativeBastard manipulation]] is that this can still be ''assisted'' by magic or technology. [[TheDarkSide Magic forces may be at work]], but it's really the despair, trickery, lies, and sometimes even [[ExactWords carefully-selected]] [[MetaphoricallyTrue truths]], that are thrown in that successfully break the victim's spirit. Instead of the villain forcing a victim to do something against their will, the villain ''changes'' the victim's will. It's DealWithTheDevil [[XMeetsY meets]] BreakThemByTalking.

More Than Mind Control requires [[TheCharmer charisma]], finesse and a lot of patience, but villains usually don't mind because they find it so much more satisfying. They also get a great deal of amusement out of telling the victim's friends, "[[NotBrainwashed I didn't force him to do anything he didn't want to do]]." It's also more resistant to the powers of [[ThePowerOfFriendship friendship]] and [[ThePowerOfLove love]]. Plus, it's just a lot cooler to watch. Villains don't even necessarily need special powers to do it, if they can goad the hero into doing something they'll regret by pushing the right buttons. TheCorrupter in particular is a master of the art. Sometimes, the villain will try this on the whole team at once; they're usually saved by the BadassNormal, TheChick / TheHeart or AllLovingHero, who will point out the ways that the villain is distorting the truth. Usually accompanied by a KirkSummation to the culprit, [[ShutUpHannibal or something more violent]].
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More Than Mind Control requires [[TheCharmer charisma]], finesse finesse, and a lot of patience, but villains usually don't mind because they find it so much more satisfying. They also get a great deal of amusement out of telling the victim's friends, "[[NotBrainwashed I didn't force him to do anything he didn't want to do]]." It's also more resistant to the powers of [[ThePowerOfFriendship friendship]] and [[ThePowerOfLove love]]. Plus, it's just a lot cooler to watch. Villains don't even necessarily need special powers to do it, if they can goad the hero into doing something they'll regret by pushing the right buttons. TheCorrupter in particular is a master of the art. Sometimes, the villain will try this on the whole team at once; they're usually saved by the BadassNormal, TheChick / TheHeart TheHeart, or the AllLovingHero, who will point out the ways that the villain is distorting the truth. Usually accompanied by a KirkSummation to the culprit, [[ShutUpHannibal or something more violent]].

See also: BlankSlate, ConditionedToAcceptHorror, NurtureOverNature, RousseauWasRight, StockholmSyndrome and ThenLetMeBeEvil
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See also: BlankSlate, ConditionedToAcceptHorror, NurtureOverNature, RousseauWasRight, StockholmSyndrome StockholmSyndrome, and ThenLetMeBeEvilThenLetMeBeEvil.
1st Feb '16 7:49:04 AM ChaoticNovelist
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* ''Literature/JourneyToChaos'': Prince Lunas Latrot proves the adage "the best ordercrafters don't need ordercraft". He can use charisma and personal insight to control others just as well.
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* ''Literature/JourneyToChaos'': Prince Lunas Latrot proves the adage "the best ordercrafters don't need ordercraft". He can use charisma and personal insight to control others just as well. Once he's in, the ordercraft merely enhances and reinforces the control.
1st Feb '16 7:47:25 AM ChaoticNovelist
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Sometimes, the villain will try this on the whole team at once; they're usually saved by the BadassNormal, TheChick / TheHeart or AllLovingHero, who will point out the ways that the villain is distorting the truth. Usually accompanied by a ShutUpHannibal speech to the culprit. This is a favorite technique of {{Manipulative Bastard}}s and {{anime}} villains. Victims may or may not exhibit MindControlEyes. It also frequently comes with a [[EvilSoundsDeep creepy voice change]], probably as a ShoutOut to Darth Vader of ''StarWars''. It's common in the West, too. Indeed, it's been around much longer than television. This form of mind manipulation was, for example, a standard talent of personifications of despair in [[OlderThanSteam Renaissance British literature]] like ''TheFaerieQueene'' and ''Literature/PilgrimsProgress''.
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Sometimes, the villain will try this on the whole team at once; they're usually saved by the BadassNormal, TheChick / TheHeart or AllLovingHero, who will point out the ways that the villain is distorting the truth. Usually accompanied by a ShutUpHannibal speech KirkSummation to the culprit. culprit, [[ShutUpHannibal or something more violent]]. This is a favorite technique of {{Manipulative Bastard}}s and {{anime}} villains.Bastard}}s. Victims may or may not exhibit MindControlEyes. It also frequently comes with a [[EvilSoundsDeep creepy voice change]], which is probably as a ShoutOut to Darth Vader of ''StarWars''. It's common popular with {{anime}} villains and in the West, too. Indeed, it's been around much longer than television. This form of mind manipulation was, for example, a standard talent of personifications of despair in [[OlderThanSteam Renaissance British literature]] like ''TheFaerieQueene'' and ''Literature/PilgrimsProgress''.

This is an example of TruthInTelevision, because real-life hypnosis requires that the person subconsciously want to do whatever they're doing. And even more so in that there does not appear to be any true [[{{Brainwashed}} mind control]] that works in real life, only more and more extreme versions of More Than Mind Control that can in extreme cases appear like straight brainwashing to third parties. The general term for this is coercive persuasion, and it is used by most cults, including the ChurchOfHappyology. [[TheSvengali Svengali mentors]] will use this.
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This is an example of TruthInTelevision, because real-life hypnosis requires that the person subconsciously want to do whatever they're doing. And even Even more so in that there does not appear to be any true [[{{Brainwashed}} mind control]] that works in real life, only more and more extreme versions of More Than Mind Control that can in extreme cases appear like straight brainwashing to third parties. The general term for this is coercive persuasion, and it is used by most cults, including the ChurchOfHappyology. [[TheSvengali Svengali mentors]] will use this.

* The Horcrux locket in ''Literature/HarryPotterAndTheDeathlyHallows'' did this, to Ron in particular. When wearing it, it basically turns people depressed and messes with their heads a bit, eventually causing Ron to [[spoiler:leave Harry and Hermione for a while]]. Just before [[spoiler:Ron destroyed it]], the locket tries to do this again to Ron via HannibalLecture.
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* The Horcrux locket in ''Literature/HarryPotterAndTheDeathlyHallows'' did this, to Ron in particular. When wearing it, it basically turns people depressed and messes with their heads a bit, eventually causing Ron to [[spoiler:leave Harry and Hermione for a while]]. Just before [[spoiler:Ron destroyed it]], the locket tries to do this again to Ron via HannibalLecture.TheReasonYouSuckSpeech.

* [[NobleDemon Crowley]] from ''Literature/GoodOmens'' uses this as part of his way of getting more souls to Hell. He doesn't lead people into ''evil'', he leads them into ''temptation'' by looking into their soul and giving them what they really, truly want. Is it really ''his'' fault [[HumansAreTheRealMonsters people want such horrible things so often]]?
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* *''Literature/GoodOmens'': [[NobleDemon Crowley]] from ''Literature/GoodOmens'' uses this as part of his way of getting more souls to Hell. He doesn't lead people into ''evil'', he leads them into ''temptation'' by looking into their soul and giving them what they really, truly want. Is it really ''his'' fault [[HumansAreTheRealMonsters people want such horrible things so often]]?often]]? *''Literature/JourneyToChaos'': Prince Lunas Latrot proves the adage "the best ordercrafters don't need ordercraft". He can use charisma and personal insight to control others just as well.
19th Jan '16 2:35:05 AM Ramona122003
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* In ''Manga/DragonBallZ'', Babidi controls his minions by finding the evil in the person's heart. He did this to Vegeta, who actually refused his orders and wished to fight Goku, as he's the [[TheOnlyOneAllowedToDefeatYou only one allowed to defeat him, in his mind]]. He later revealed ''he'' was [[UnwittingPawn using Babidi]] as he felt he needed to be reminded [[EvilFeelsGood how good evil feels]] in order to gain more power.
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* In ''Manga/DragonBallZ'', Babidi controls his minions by finding the evil in the person's heart.heart and turn them into his willing slaves by making them ''want'' to serve him. The more evil the person is, the stronger the control. He did this to Vegeta, who actually refused his orders and wished to fight Goku, as he's the [[TheOnlyOneAllowedToDefeatYou only one allowed to defeat him, in his mind]]. He later revealed ''he'' was [[UnwittingPawn using Babidi]] as he felt he needed to be reminded [[EvilFeelsGood how good evil feels]] in order to gain more power.
13th Jan '16 7:40:39 PM Kartoonkid95
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Added DiffLines:
* ''WesternAnimation/ThePowerpuffGirls'': In "All Chalked Up", a disguised HIM gives Bubbles magic chalk that allows her drawings to come to life. He manipulates her by reminding her of when Buttercup shashed her old chalk not too long ago and encouraging her to let her anger out by drawing giant monsters, which then come to life and go on a rampage. -->'''Bubbles:''' You made me do this! -->'''HIM:''' Au contraire. I just provided the chalk. It was ''you'' who drew monsters.
6th Jan '16 7:14:28 PM nombretomado
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* ''SoulCalibur V'''s Pyrrha [[spoiler: is subject to this at the hands of Tira.]] She ends up fighting [[spoiler: her own brother repeatedly because she thinks she's doing the right thing letting herself be used by Soul Edge.]]
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* ''SoulCalibur ''VideoGame/SoulCalibur V'''s Pyrrha [[spoiler: is subject to this at the hands of Tira.]] She ends up fighting [[spoiler: her own brother repeatedly because she thinks she's doing the right thing letting herself be used by Soul Edge.]]
31st Dec '15 11:41:50 AM Anddrix
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* SelfDemonstrating/{{Loki}} subtly influenced [[ComicBook/NormanOsborn Osborn's]] mind all throughout ComicBook/DarkReign. Osborn's mental state was never too stable, but Loki made him believe the Goblin personality was talking to him, and made him doubt his own mind. He even created another ComicBook/TheAvengers team to compete with Norman's and manipulated him to storm [[PhysicalGod Asgard]]. By then, [[SanitySlippage Norman has had enough]] and by the end of Siege he experienced a complete [[VillainousBreakdown mental breakdown]].
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* SelfDemonstrating/{{Loki}} Loki subtly influenced [[ComicBook/NormanOsborn Osborn's]] mind all throughout ComicBook/DarkReign. Osborn's mental state was never too stable, but Loki made him believe the Goblin personality was talking to him, and made him doubt his own mind. He even created another ComicBook/TheAvengers team to compete with Norman's and manipulated him to storm [[PhysicalGod Asgard]]. By then, [[SanitySlippage Norman has had enough]] and by the end of Siege he experienced a complete [[VillainousBreakdown mental breakdown]].
27th Dec '15 9:01:50 PM nombretomado
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* In the comic book series ''{{Sleepwalker}}'', the monstrous, AxCrazy villain Psyko has the power to drive everyone around him insane. Being a resident of the mental plane, Sleepwalker was resistant to this power, but it affected him enough for Psyko to nearly manipulate Sleepwalker into murdering one of his former enemies, which would have permanently driven him insane. * The current ''GuardiansOfTheGalaxy'' were all asked to join. But they later found out [[spoiler:They were under a ''little bit'' of mind control- just enough to make them ''want'' to join. When they found this out, most of them quit.]]
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* In the comic book series ''{{Sleepwalker}}'', ''ComicBook/{{Sleepwalker}}'', the monstrous, AxCrazy villain Psyko has the power to drive everyone around him insane. Being a resident of the mental plane, Sleepwalker was resistant to this power, but it affected him enough for Psyko to nearly manipulate Sleepwalker into murdering one of his former enemies, which would have permanently driven him insane. * The current ''GuardiansOfTheGalaxy'' ''ComicBook/GuardiansOfTheGalaxy'' were all asked to join. But they later found out [[spoiler:They were under a ''little bit'' of mind control- just enough to make them ''want'' to join. When they found this out, most of them quit.]]
22nd Dec '15 6:58:09 AM MrUnderhill
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* In the ''Franchise/MassEffect'' universe, Indoctrination can work this way. In fact, the Reapers prefer it this way, since if the individual is more fully under their control their mental processes degrade, forcing them to control their thralls more directly, making them less useful. Saren was carefully manipulated into believing what he did was for the ultimate best of the Turians, even while working for the Reapers he did feared that he had lost control. Other characters in the series get their desires warped into a way to serve while believing themselves to be autonomous.
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* In the ''Franchise/MassEffect'' universe, Indoctrination [[MindRape indoctrination]] can work range from this way. In fact, to straight-up MindControl, but the Reapers prefer it this way, since if the individual is former to the latter whenever possible. The more fully under their force the Reapers use to control their thralls, the faster their mental processes degrade, forcing them to control their thralls more directly, making them less useful. Saren was carefully manipulated into believing what he did was for the ultimate best greater good of both his people and the Turians, galaxy, and even while working for the Reapers then he did feared was aware that he had lost control. Sovereign could be indoctrinating him and was secretly afraid that might be the case, though by then it was too late. Other characters indoctrination victims in the series get have their desires warped into a way to serve the Reapers while believing themselves to be autonomous.
20th Dec '15 4:24:22 PM nombretomado
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** This was one of [[TheStarscream Saruman's]] major skills in ''Literature/LordOfTheRings'' (book version only). Doesn't work so well with diverse groups, especially when he starts to lose his cool - though he does talk Treebeard into letting him go.
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** This was one of [[TheStarscream Saruman's]] major skills in ''Literature/LordOfTheRings'' ''Literature/TheLordOfTheRings'' (book version only). Doesn't work so well with diverse groups, especially when he starts to lose his cool - though he does talk Treebeard into letting him go.

** This was also how Sauron brought down Númenor in the "Akallabêth", and Melkor suborned Fëanor in the ''TheSilmarillion''.
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** This was also how Sauron brought down Númenor in the "Akallabêth", and Melkor suborned Fëanor in the ''TheSilmarillion''.''Literature/TheSilmarillion''.
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