History Main / MoralDissonance

26th Aug '16 12:03:57 PM Sapphirea2
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** In deposing Harriet Jones, the Doctor is violating his own often stated moral standards of not interfering with major historical events or "fixed points in time" as they're called in this series. We had it on no less authority than the Doctor himself that Harriet Jones was supposed to have three successful terms as Prime Minister and lead Britain into a Golden Age. That sure as Hell sounded like a "fixed point in time" if there ever was one. Furthermore, everything that's happened since then in the Franchise/{{Whoniverse}} in regards to the British premiership-such as ''Series/{{Torchwood}}'''s Brian Green-that the Doctor didn't just change history, [[NiceJobBreakingItHero he also changed history for the worse.]]
*** Then again, years later the ''Twelfth'' Doctor decides '''not''' to interfere with a point in time that's in flux in "Kill the Moon", and let humanity decide its own fate -- leaving his companion Clara in charge, believing that she/humanity can and will make the best choice under the circumstances. She does, but then chews out and temporarily abandons him (leaving him ''friendless'') for not just taking care of things himself! So much for not sticking his nose in where it doesn't belong.
** The aliens have already shown that at least their leader was not above being forced to surrender but instead trying to stab his enemy in the back when they lower their guard, which greatly weakens the Doctor's argument about attacking a retreating species whom was already more than willing to hold a planet at ransom.
** Another example is when 10 gets furious at his clone for wiping out the Daleks in "[[Recap/DoctorWhoS30E13JourneysEnd Journey's End]]". Despite the fact that earlier in that series he had wiped out the Pyroviles, a much less objectionable species, to save humanity and in the process killed 20,000 innocent people, though this was a fixed point in time. Even more ridiculous as the Daleks had come close to destroying entire Universe, had only temporarily been beaten, and were the only ones destroyed by the clone.

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** In deposing Harriet Jones, the Doctor is violating his own often stated often-stated moral standards of not interfering with major historical events or "fixed points in time" as they're called in this series. We had it on no less authority than the ''the Doctor himself himself'' that Harriet Jones was supposed to have three successful terms as Prime Minister and lead Britain into a Golden Age. Age. That sure as Hell sounded like a "fixed point in time" if there ever was one. But then she decided to have the retreating Sycorax killed in "The Christmas Invasion", and Ten got mad. Keep in mind that the aliens had already shown that at least their leader was not above being forced to surrender but instead trying to stab his enemy in the back when they lower their guard, which greatly weakens the Doctor's argument about attacking a retreating species whom was already more than willing to hold a planet at ransom. Furthermore, everything that's happened since then in the Franchise/{{Whoniverse}} in regards to the British premiership-such premiership -- such as ''Series/{{Torchwood}}'''s Brian Green-that Green -- that the Doctor didn't just change history, [[NiceJobBreakingItHero he also changed history for the worse.]]
***
worse!]]
** Another example is when Ten gets furious at his clone for wiping out the Daleks in "[[Recap/DoctorWhoS30E13JourneysEnd Journey's End]]". Despite the fact that earlier in that series he had wiped out the Pyroviles, a much less objectionable species, to save humanity and in the process killed 20,000 innocent people, though this ''was'' a fixed point in time. Even more ridiculous as the Daleks had come close to destroying the entire universe, had only temporarily been beaten, and were the only ones destroyed by the clone!
**
Then again, years later the ''Twelfth'' Doctor decides '''not''' to interfere with a point in time that's in flux in "Kill the Moon", and let humanity decide its own fate -- leaving his companion Clara in charge, believing that she/humanity can and will make the best choice under the circumstances. She does, but then chews out and temporarily abandons him, leaving him (leaving him ''friendless'') ''friendless'', for not just taking care of things himself! So much for not sticking his nose in where it doesn't belong.
** The aliens have already shown that at least their leader was not above being forced to surrender but instead trying to stab his enemy in the back when they lower their guard, which greatly weakens the Doctor's argument about attacking
belong. (In general, Twelve [[WhatTheHellHero gets called out a retreating species whom was already lot more often for his more morally dubious actions and attitudes than willing to hold a planet at ransom.
** Another example is when 10 gets furious at
his clone for wiping out the Daleks in "[[Recap/DoctorWhoS30E13JourneysEnd Journey's End]]". Despite the fact that earlier in that series he had wiped out the Pyroviles, a much less objectionable species, to save humanity and in the process killed 20,000 innocent people, though this was a fixed point in time. Even more ridiculous as the Daleks had come close to destroying entire Universe, had only temporarily been beaten, and were the only ones destroyed by the clone. predecessors]].)
19th Aug '16 10:24:24 PM EvilKid
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Compare ValuesDissonance, where the cause is cultural. Compare also FamilyUnfriendlyAesop, where the hero's actions line up with morals that the reader might not agree with. Also compare FelonyMisdemeanor. Contrast NotSoDifferent, where the double standard is noticed; WhatTheHellHero, where they are expressly called out ([[StrawmanHasAPoint though particularly infuriating if the person calling the hero out is treated as being wrong]]) and can even be a driving force of the plot; ItsAllAboutMe, where the villain actively holds this kind of double standard, and it's noticed; TautologicalTemplar, where another character also actively thinks he can do no wrong. For TheRival holding a grudge, it's DisproportionateRetribution. See also ProtagonistCenteredMorality.

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Compare ValuesDissonance, where the cause is cultural. Compare also FamilyUnfriendlyAesop, where the hero's actions line up with morals that the reader might not agree with. Also compare FelonyMisdemeanor. Contrast NotSoDifferent, where the double standard is noticed; WhatTheHellHero, where they are expressly called out ([[StrawmanHasAPoint though particularly infuriating if the person calling the hero out is treated as being wrong]]) and can even be a driving force of the plot; ItsAllAboutMe, where the villain actively holds this kind of double standard, and it's noticed; TautologicalTemplar, where another character also actively thinks he can do no wrong. Also compare with MoralMyopia if DoubleStandard is portrayed as wrong in-universe. For TheRival holding a grudge, it's DisproportionateRetribution. See also ProtagonistCenteredMorality.
17th Jul '16 7:32:54 AM Sapphirea2
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** In deposing Harriet Jones, the Doctor is violating his own often stated moral standards of not interfering with major historical events or "fixed points in time" as they're called in this series. We had it on no less authority than the Doctor himself that Harriet Jones was supposed to have three successful terms as Prime Minister and lead Britain into a Golden Age. That sure as Hell sounded like a "fixed point in time" if there ever was one. Furthermore, everything that's happened since then in the Franchise/{{Whoniverse}} in regards to the British premiership-such as Series/{{Torchwood}}'s Brian Green-that the Doctor didn't just change history, [[NiceJobBreakingItHero he also changed history for the worse.]]

to:

** In deposing Harriet Jones, the Doctor is violating his own often stated moral standards of not interfering with major historical events or "fixed points in time" as they're called in this series. We had it on no less authority than the Doctor himself that Harriet Jones was supposed to have three successful terms as Prime Minister and lead Britain into a Golden Age. That sure as Hell sounded like a "fixed point in time" if there ever was one. Furthermore, everything that's happened since then in the Franchise/{{Whoniverse}} in regards to the British premiership-such as Series/{{Torchwood}}'s ''Series/{{Torchwood}}'''s Brian Green-that the Doctor didn't just change history, [[NiceJobBreakingItHero he also changed history for the worse.]]]]
*** Then again, years later the ''Twelfth'' Doctor decides '''not''' to interfere with a point in time that's in flux in "Kill the Moon", and let humanity decide its own fate -- leaving his companion Clara in charge, believing that she/humanity can and will make the best choice under the circumstances. She does, but then chews out and temporarily abandons him (leaving him ''friendless'') for not just taking care of things himself! So much for not sticking his nose in where it doesn't belong.
1st Jul '16 12:34:06 AM PaulA
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* In Creator/DavidEddings' ''Literature/TheElenium'' and the sequel books ''The Tamuli'', we meet Kring, chief of the Peloi, a tribe of savage horsemen. In his first appearance, his troops have joined an allied army to fight a joint enemy. He asks about the army's policy on raping. He is told that it is not allowed and he sighs, saying it will be hard to explain to his men that they can't. Later, his fiancée talks about how she murdered men who attempted to rape her. He clearly shows how he thinks rape is wrong and he is glad they died. No one in the story seems to recall or mention that he was unhappy that his men weren't allowed to rape women earlier. Considering the time period ''The Elenium'' is set in, Kring might see a difference between taking a woman as a war trophy (as was commonly done long ago) and men simply setting upon a woman in the night, however. It could also be a case of MoralMyopia where he thinks it's wrong if a woman he cares about is involved, versus the anonymous strangers who he was asking about previously.

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* In Creator/DavidEddings' ''Literature/TheElenium'' and the sequel books ''The Tamuli'', ''Literature/TheTamuli'', we meet Kring, chief of the Peloi, a tribe of savage horsemen. In his first appearance, his troops have joined an allied army to fight a joint enemy. He asks about the army's policy on raping. He is told that it is not allowed and he sighs, saying it will be hard to explain to his men that they can't. Later, his fiancée talks about how she murdered men who attempted to rape her. He clearly shows how he thinks rape is wrong and he is glad they died. No one in the story seems to recall or mention that he was unhappy that his men weren't allowed to rape women earlier. Considering the time period ''The Elenium'' is set in, Kring might see a difference between taking a woman as a war trophy (as was commonly done long ago) and men simply setting upon a woman in the night, however. It could also be a case of MoralMyopia where he thinks it's wrong if a woman he cares about is involved, versus the anonymous strangers who he was asking about previously.
28th Jun '16 2:37:50 AM superkid761
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additionally as bulk and skull grow as characters they are treated worse by the 'heroes' who laugh at them all the time
28th Jun '16 2:36:11 AM superkid761
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additionally as bulk and skull grow as characters they are treated worse by the 'heroes' who laugh at them all the time
17th Jun '16 5:13:11 AM CelestialDraco
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* Admittedly, not THAT much dissonance in Pichas adult comedy "The Big Bang" when the intergalactic hero who was sent out to stop nuclear war on Earth pushes the red button himself for scorned love. Since that "hero" is a complete twit, we almost expected something like that coming...

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* Admittedly, not THAT much dissonance in Pichas adult comedy "The Big Bang" Franchise/TheBigBang when the intergalactic hero who was sent out to stop nuclear war on Earth pushes the red button himself for scorned love. Since that "hero" is a complete twit, we almost expected something like that coming...
30th May '16 12:19:24 AM starkitty93
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* ''Fanfic/ThePrayerWarriors'' could very well be the poster children of this trope alongside ProtagonistCenteredMorality. Throughout the fic, they repeatedly condemn actions that the "Satanists" do only to turn around and immediately do just that. For example, in The Battle With the Witches they condemn science as "corrupting the young" but later use chemistry to take out poisonous plants that the Hogwarts students were planning to use against Christians. Another example is GoodGirlsAvoidAbortion is emphasized a great deal in the story but it clashes heavily with the fact that the Prayer Warriors at one point wished that Osama bin Laden was killed at birth and then later wished that Molly Weasley would have a miscarriage.

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* ''Fanfic/ThePrayerWarriors'' could very well be the poster children of this trope alongside ProtagonistCenteredMorality. Throughout the fic, they repeatedly condemn actions that the "Satanists" do only to turn around and immediately do just that. For example, in The Battle With the Witches they condemn science as "corrupting the young" but later use chemistry to take out poisonous plants that the Hogwarts students were planning to use against Christians. Another example is GoodGirlsAvoidAbortion is emphasized a great deal in the story story, but it clashes heavily with the fact that the Prayer Warriors at one point wished that Osama bin Laden was killed at birth and then later wished that Molly Weasley would have a miscarriage.
30th May '16 12:18:11 AM starkitty93
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Added DiffLines:

* ''Fanfic/ThePrayerWarriors'' could very well be the poster children of this trope alongside ProtagonistCenteredMorality. Throughout the fic, they repeatedly condemn actions that the "Satanists" do only to turn around and immediately do just that. For example, in The Battle With the Witches they condemn science as "corrupting the young" but later use chemistry to take out poisonous plants that the Hogwarts students were planning to use against Christians. Another example is GoodGirlsAvoidAbortion is emphasized a great deal in the story but it clashes heavily with the fact that the Prayer Warriors at one point wished that Osama bin Laden was killed at birth and then later wished that Molly Weasley would have a miscarriage.
23rd May '16 6:18:28 PM CrashDavis
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* The quote at the top comes from a playthrough of the reboot of the VideoGame/DeadToRights franchise, ''Dead To Rights: Retribution,'' where the protagonist, Jack Slate, is decrying his new enemy, the militaristic GAC police squad, as monsters for not doing arrests or interrogations and just running in, shooting everyone and everything. Only one problem: that completely describes Jack. Even when Jack towards the end of the game decides he is going to play by the book and arrest his enemy, he does so by mowing through dozens of attackers in ludicrous fashion just to get to him.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Main.MoralDissonance