History Main / KlingonScientistsGetNoRespect

23rd Aug '17 7:34:04 PM Amahn
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*** Constantly zig-zagged between playing this trope straight and inverting it with B'Elanna Torres herself in ''Series/StarTrekVoyager.'' As a Starfleet engineer, she is quite respected. Problem is that she is half-Klingon, and her focus as a Starfleet officer leads her to being dishonored for ''not'' being a Klingon ''ANYTHING''. By not embracing her Klingon heritage and bloodline, she risks sending both herself and her mother to Gre'Thor (Klingon Hell). Sins of the Child, as they put it. So while she gets respect for being a Klingon Engineer by Starfleet, she gets no respect by Klingons for not being Klingon.

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*** Constantly zig-zagged between playing this trope straight and inverting it with B'Elanna Torres herself in ''Series/StarTrekVoyager.'' As a Starfleet engineer, she is quite respected. Problem is that she is half-Klingon, and her focus as a Starfleet officer leads her to being dishonored for ''not'' being a Klingon ''ANYTHING''. By not embracing her Klingon heritage and bloodline, she risks sending both herself and her mother to Gre'Thor (Klingon Hell). Sins of the Child, as they put it. So while she gets respect for being a Klingon Engineer by Starfleet, she gets no respect by Klingons for not being Klingon. Then late in the series a Klingon captain tells her that as the ship's engineer she keeps it in battle ready condition, so every battle the ship has ever won is her victory. Implying that at least during certain times in Klingon culture engineers are just as respected as warriors.
28th Jul '17 9:10:47 PM infernape612
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*** The video game ''VideoGame/BirthOfTheFederation'' indicates that [[AvertedTrope Klingon blacksmiths are held in high regard]], as without weapons, there is no war.
18th Jul '17 4:25:00 PM DoctorDetective
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** The krogan do at least try to subvert this trope, and the few scientists that do exist aren't exactly out of shape nerds, either. Lord High Researcher Fortack mentions how he [[KlingonPromotion killed his predecessor to get his position]] as Clan Urdnot's scientist. And Okeer, after all, ''was'' a Warlord. Krogan Shamans undergo horrific rites to gain their position, rites that kill many krogans, and so are worthy of respect. Krogan Ambassadors represent the strength of their clan and so must themselves be mighty warriors lest their clan be viewed as weak. Further, Krogan recognize that not everyone can be a great warrior. So they have a system where a krogan can seek a warrior as a sponsor (called a "krantt") to help them in the ritual.

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** The krogan do at least try to subvert this trope, and the few scientists that do exist aren't exactly out of shape nerds, either. Lord High Researcher Fortack mentions how he [[KlingonPromotion killed his predecessor to get his position]] as Clan Urdnot's scientist. And Okeer, after all, ''was'' a Warlord. Krogan Shamans undergo horrific rites to gain their position, rites that kill many krogans, and so are worthy of respect. Krogan Ambassadors represent the strength of their clan and so must themselves be mighty warriors lest their clan be viewed as weak. Further, Krogan krogan recognize that not everyone can be a great warrior. So they have warrior, so their combat rituals allow an individual to bring a system where a krogan can seek a warrior as a sponsor squad of friends (called a "krantt") to help them in "krantt"). As the ritual. krogan running Grunt's puberty rite puts it:
18th Jul '17 1:39:25 PM Linda58
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*** The [=DS9=] episode "By Inferno's Light" suggests an aversion to this trope. Worf is forced to fight several Jem'Hadar in a row, all brutal hand-to-hand fights to the death. Bashir to treat his injuries between each fight as best as he can, and Martok vows to write songs about both Worf's combat prowess ''and'' Bashir "the healer who bound the warrior's wounds so he could fight again!" While Bashir isn't a Klingon, it suggests that (medical) doctors are at least held in respect.

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*** The [=DS9=] episode "By Inferno's Light" suggests an aversion to this trope. Worf is forced to fight several Jem'Hadar in a row, all brutal hand-to-hand fights to the death. Bashir to treat treats his injuries between each fight as best as he can, and Martok vows to write songs about both Worf's combat prowess ''and'' Bashir "the healer who bound the warrior's wounds so he could fight again!" While Bashir isn't a Klingon, it suggests that (medical) doctors are at least held in respect.
16th Jul '17 10:10:12 AM DarkHunter
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** Very averted in Videogame/MassEffectAndromeda. Nakmor Kesh is an engineer who almost single-handedly kept the Nexus from falling apart before the human Pathfinder showed up, is a member of the ''de facto'' governing council and respected by almost all the others (except salarians), and makes her BadassGrandpa old warrior Drack incredibly proud. [[spoiler: Her boyfriend]] Vorn is a respected krogan botanist, and at the krogan colony one of the first people you encounter is a scientist who certainly isn't ashamed of what he is.

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** Very averted in Videogame/MassEffectAndromeda. Nakmor Kesh is an engineer who almost single-handedly kept the Nexus from falling apart before the human Pathfinder showed up, is a member of the ''de facto'' governing council and respected by almost all the others (except salarians), and makes her BadassGrandpa old warrior Drack incredibly proud. [[spoiler: Her boyfriend]] Vorn is a respected krogan botanist, botanist whom the colony is devoting a considerable amount of their very limited resources toward (they understand that if there are no plants, the colony is doomed), and at the krogan colony one of the first people you encounter is a scientist geneticist who certainly isn't ashamed of what he is.is (that he's working on curing the genophage probably helps his fellow krogan's approval for him).
12th Jul '17 9:47:35 PM Linda58
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Added DiffLines:

*** The [=DS9=] episode "By Inferno's Light" suggests an aversion to this trope. Worf is forced to fight several Jem'Hadar in a row, all brutal hand-to-hand fights to the death. Bashir to treat his injuries between each fight as best as he can, and Martok vows to write songs about both Worf's combat prowess ''and'' Bashir "the healer who bound the warrior's wounds so he could fight again!" While Bashir isn't a Klingon, it suggests that (medical) doctors are at least held in respect.
12th Jul '17 8:50:49 PM Omeganian
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* In ''TabletopGame/TheGatesOfHell'', the devils of the Denomination of Research are despised for their ability to think outside the frame, although it does seem to be changing as they prove their usefulness.
12th Jul '17 6:00:59 AM jormis29
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* In the ''Palladium Books'' game ''TabletopGame/{{Rifts}}'', the Vanguard are a society of mages who secretly protect the Coalition States, a society who considers mages the enemy and generally tortures then executes them. The Vanguard pretty much accept this paranoia and protect the CS in spite of it, much along the lines of Merlin in the BBC TV series. Also in Rifts, Psi-Stalkers and Dog Boys (mutant humans and bio-engineered humanoid dogs) are the most reliable magic (and supernatural) detectors for keeping squishy human territory free of mega-threats, yet they are discriminated against as second-class citizens (as are all psychics) and viewed with great fear and paranoia. This may be slowly turning though.

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* In the ''Palladium Books'' game ''TabletopGame/{{Rifts}}'', the Vanguard are a society of mages who secretly protect the Coalition States, a society who considers mages the enemy and generally tortures then executes them. The Vanguard pretty much accept this paranoia and protect the CS in spite of it, much along the lines of Merlin in the BBC TV series. Also in Rifts, Psi-Stalkers and Dog Boys (mutant humans and bio-engineered humanoid dogs) are the most reliable magic (and supernatural) detectors for keeping squishy human territory free of mega-threats, yet they are discriminated against as second-class citizens (as are all psychics) and viewed with great fear and paranoia. This may be slowly turning though.
10th Jun '17 8:46:14 PM Fireblood
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In the real world, this is fairly common, especially in premodern times. Universities, for example, were started largely with the aim of studying theology, with the natural sciences being a vaguely complimentary supplement. Craftsmen were seen as inferior to farmers, as unlike farmers they merely "reworked" what farmers produced. Merchants were largely considered inferior to everyone since they were seen as producing literally nothing and making profit. This stigma was, in fact, one barrier to industrialization in many place, since the classes with the most potential to produce productivity gains were socially discouraged. While this has subsided, to a large extent, it is still enough to say that ''every'' society has had at least one job that is looked down upon by the culture at large while still being entirely necessary for that society to function. [[noreallife]]

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In the real world, this is fairly common, especially in premodern times. Universities, for example, were started largely with the aim of studying theology, with the natural sciences being a vaguely complimentary supplement. Craftsmen were seen as inferior to farmers, as unlike farmers they merely "reworked" what farmers produced. Merchants were largely considered inferior to everyone since they were seen as producing literally nothing and making profit. This stigma was, in fact, one barrier to industrialization in many place, places, since the classes with the most potential to produce productivity gains were socially discouraged. While this has subsided, to a large extent, it is still enough to say that ''every'' society has had at least one job that is looked down upon by the culture at large while still being entirely necessary for that society to function. [[noreallife]]
31st May '17 10:14:46 PM Discar
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--->'''Lord High Researcher Fortack''': My predecessor said no one would understand the true worth of my work. As I pulled my blade from his chest, I knew he was telling the truth.\\
'''Commander Shepard''': [[DeadpanSnarker Not exactly what I would call effective academic peer review]].



-->'''Urdnot Shaman''': Not every krogan can be the strongest warrior, but each must inspire loyalty and the will to fight in his comrades.

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-->'''Urdnot --->'''Urdnot Shaman''': Not every krogan can be the strongest warrior, but each must inspire loyalty and the will to fight in his comrades.
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