History Main / FanDumb

2nd Dec '16 11:09:23 AM HasturHasturHastur
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The opposite of the Fandom Moral Guardian (as seen below), these fans demand that a work go DarkerAndEdgier, even when it would be to the detriment of the work. Furthermore, their idea of a darker turn is usually exceedingly puerile, devoid of nuance, and overall sophomoric and immature; instead of more complex and difficult themes, they would be ''far'' happier with unfunny anti-PC humor, gratuitous violence and bloodshed, oversexualization and adolescent-level depictions of sexuality, and [[{{Wangst}} overwrought melodrama and blind pessimism and nihilism]]. In short, they don't actually want a truly DarkerAndEdgier work, they want one that caters to their own underdeveloped, childish tastes. In practice, they are most commonly the purveyors of cringeworthy fanfics and fanart; if you spot a fanwork that has the above characteristics, you're probably witnessing one of these in action. Overly edgy and one-dimensional [[OriginalCharacter OCs]] is another dead giveaway; on the rare occasions where they make themselves known to the creators, they're probably bitching about the "pussification" of a work or trying to insinuate that it hasn't been keeping up with the times (in spite of the fact that most of their suggestions will ''instantly'' date a work if taken seriously).

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The opposite of the Fandom Moral Guardian (as seen below), these fans demand that a work go DarkerAndEdgier, even when it would be to the detriment of the work. Furthermore, their idea of a darker turn is usually exceedingly puerile, devoid of nuance, and overall sophomoric and immature; instead of more complex and difficult themes, they would be ''far'' happier with unfunny anti-PC humor, gratuitous violence and bloodshed, oversexualization and adolescent-level depictions of sexuality, and [[{{Wangst}} overwrought melodrama and blind pessimism and nihilism]]. In short, they don't actually want a truly DarkerAndEdgier work, they want one that caters to their own underdeveloped, childish tastes. In practice, they are most commonly the purveyors of cringeworthy fanfics and fanart; if you spot a fanwork that has the above characteristics, you're probably witnessing one of these in action. Overly edgy and one-dimensional [[OriginalCharacter OCs]] is are another dead giveaway; on the rare occasions where they make themselves known to the creators, they're probably bitching complaining about the "pussification" "kiddification" of a work or trying to insinuate that it hasn't been keeping up with the times (in spite of the fact that most of their suggestions will ''instantly'' date a work if taken seriously).
27th Nov '16 1:39:43 PM WillBGood
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This fan refuses to see any faults in the object of her/his love at all, even if they're staring him/her right in the face. Tends to go beyond merely liking something to an irrational state of mind where his/her appreciation of it means that it cannot possibly have any faults at all. They will also [[OpinionMyopia not realize how other people could possibly not like it]], and will likewise [[ComplainingAboutPeopleNotLikingTheShow tell them they're worthless for not finding it the best thing since sliced bread]] even though this mentality can lead to ''massive'' HypeBacklash. The Willfully Blind are fond of the QualityByPopularVote and ReviewsAreTheGospel lines of argument, often insistently referring to reviews, ratings or sales figures to support this assertion. If they encounter evidence of a flaw that even they cannot ignore, they are then likely to rationalize it with the excuse that "It's still better than [optionally, [[SturgeonsLaw ninety percent]] of] everything else" or "The rest will make up for it'. When encountered here on ''Wiki/TVTropes'', these people tend to be fond of attributing any and all criticisms to an alleged UnpleasableFanbase, as if that automatically invalidates them.

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This fan refuses to see any faults in the object of her/his love at all, even if they're staring him/her right in the face. Tends to go beyond merely liking something to an irrational state of mind where his/her appreciation of it means that it cannot possibly have any faults at all. They will also [[OpinionMyopia not realize how other people could possibly not like it]], and will likewise [[ComplainingAboutPeopleNotLikingTheShow tell them they're worthless worthless]] for not finding it the best thing since sliced bread]] bread even though this mentality can lead to ''massive'' HypeBacklash. The Willfully Blind are fond of the QualityByPopularVote and ReviewsAreTheGospel lines of argument, often insistently referring to reviews, ratings or sales figures to support this assertion. If they encounter evidence of a flaw that even they cannot ignore, they are then likely to rationalize it with the excuse that "It's still better than [optionally, [[SturgeonsLaw ninety percent]] of] everything else" or "The rest will make up for it'. it." When encountered here on ''Wiki/TVTropes'', Wiki/TVTropes, these people tend to be fond of attributing any and all criticisms to an alleged UnpleasableFanbase, as if that automatically invalidates them.
27th Nov '16 1:38:48 PM WillBGood
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This type of fan is someone who complains about a flaw or something in the work, only, when it's remedied, to find something else to complain about, pull one of the ItSucks cards on it, or simply insist that the improved version or a sequel that fixes the flaws is "not a true entry" '''''ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked because''''' [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked it fixed the flaw(s)]]. This form of Fan Dumb is so prevalent that it got its very own trope — see UnpleasableFanbase. Especially commonly overlaps with the '''Old-Timer'''.

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This type of fan is someone who complains about a flaw or something in the work, only, when it's remedied, to find something else to complain about, pull one of the ItSucks cards on it, or simply insist that the improved version or a sequel that fixes the flaws is "not a true entry" '''''ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked because''''' '''''because''''' [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked it fixed the flaw(s)]]. This form of Fan Dumb is so prevalent that it got its very own trope — see UnpleasableFanbase. Especially commonly overlaps with the '''Old-Timer'''.
27th Nov '16 1:38:28 PM WillBGood
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This type of fan is someone who complains about a flaw or something in the work, only, when it's remedied, to find something else to complain about, pull one of the ItSucks cards on it, or simply [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked insist that the improved version or a sequel that fixes the flaws is "not a true entry"]] '''''[[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked because]]''''' [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked it fixed the flaw(s)]]. This form of Fan Dumb is so prevalent that it got its very own trope — see UnpleasableFanbase. Especially commonly overlaps with the '''Old-Timer'''.

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This type of fan is someone who complains about a flaw or something in the work, only, when it's remedied, to find something else to complain about, pull one of the ItSucks cards on it, or simply [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked insist that the improved version or a sequel that fixes the flaws is "not a true entry"]] '''''[[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked because]]''''' entry" '''''ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked because''''' [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked it fixed the flaw(s)]]. This form of Fan Dumb is so prevalent that it got its very own trope — see UnpleasableFanbase. Especially commonly overlaps with the '''Old-Timer'''.



This fan loves something to such a powerful extreme that they constantly feel that it's threatened by a franchise [[DuelingShows competing]] [[DuelingMovies against it]]. Thus, they feel they ''must'' defend it at all costs, even if it means starting a war. Even if the other franchise has a friendly [[FandomRivalry rivalry]] with it (and even if the two franchises overlap in some way), the two franchises being compared with each other at all is simply too much for the warmonger. They will go out of their way to bash the competing franchise and attack its fans, using their passionate love for a certain franchise as a weapon by citing how much more successful/popular/well-reviewed/enduring it is in comparison (they will then [[HypocriticalFandom hypocritically take offence to being fired back at by the opposing fandom]]). They will also push away any fans that happen to like both the franchise they like and the competing one simultaneously, because they regard that as betrayal. [[SarcasmMode How dare they like both! You can't like Thing X and Thing Y at the same time! They should be enemies!]]

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This fan loves something to such a powerful extreme that they constantly feel that it's threatened by a franchise [[DuelingShows competing]] [[DuelingMovies against it]]. Thus, they feel they ''must'' defend it at all costs, even if it means starting a war. Even if the other franchise has a friendly [[FandomRivalry rivalry]] with it (and even if the two franchises overlap in some way), the two franchises being compared with each other at all is simply too much for the warmonger. They will go out of their way to bash the competing franchise and attack its fans, using their passionate love for a certain franchise as a weapon by citing how much more successful/popular/well-reviewed/enduring it is in comparison (they will then [[HypocriticalFandom hypocritically take offence offense to being fired back at by the opposing fandom]]). They will also push away any fans that happen to like both the franchise they like and the competing one simultaneously, because they regard that as betrayal. [[SarcasmMode How dare they like both! You can't like Thing X and Thing Y at the same time! They should be enemies!]]
27th Nov '16 1:37:11 PM WillBGood
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This type of fan is someone who complains about a flaw or something in the work, only, when it's remedied, to find something else to complain about, pull one of the ItSucks cards on it, or simply [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked insist that the improved version or a sequel that fixes the flaws is "not a true entry']] '''''[[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked because]]''''' [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked it fixed the flaw(s)]]. This form of Fan Dumb is so prevalent that it got its very own trope — see UnpleasableFanbase. Especially commonly overlaps with the '''Old-Timer'''.

to:

This type of fan is someone who complains about a flaw or something in the work, only, when it's remedied, to find something else to complain about, pull one of the ItSucks cards on it, or simply [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked insist that the improved version or a sequel that fixes the flaws is "not a true entry']] entry"]] '''''[[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked because]]''''' [[ILikedItBetterWhenItSucked it fixed the flaw(s)]]. This form of Fan Dumb is so prevalent that it got its very own trope — see UnpleasableFanbase. Especially commonly overlaps with the '''Old-Timer'''.
27th Nov '16 1:36:43 PM WillBGood
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"Fandom — love it or leave it!" Usually a supportive variant, this fan gets a bit too confrontational when it comes to criticism of the object of their fandom. However mild or gentle the criticism. However valid or reasonable the criticism. Regardless, in some cases, of how ''even the WordOfGod'' may agree with the criticism. They feel that anyone who considers a work flawed is nothing more than a {{Troll}} or a misguided fanboy and needs to be set straight and see the work is perfectly fine. The minute someone doesn't like something in a work or finds something in the work that bugs them, you can bet that the Misplaced Champion will show up like lightning and try their hardest to squash these criticisms simply because (in their mind) the work is just so good that there cannot be any legitimate criticism for it. The number one culprits of ComplainingAboutPeopleNotLikingTheShow, tied with the Willfully Blind; a common line of argument is something along the lines of "why don't you go and watch something else if you hate [the show] so much?", even if the critic has made perfectly clear that they ''don't'' hate the show ''at all''. If a new installment in a series involves any sort of change, you can also expect them to respond to ''any'' criticism of the changes (however reasonable) with accusations of closed-mindedness and"just wanting the same thing again and again'. Attempt to assert your case, and they'll likely accuse you of being the reason why the series will die.

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"Fandom — love it or leave it!" Usually a supportive variant, this fan gets a bit too confrontational when it comes to criticism of the object of their fandom. However mild or gentle the criticism. However valid or reasonable the criticism. Regardless, in some cases, of how ''even the WordOfGod'' may agree with the criticism. They feel that anyone who considers a work flawed is nothing more than a {{Troll}} or a misguided fanboy and needs to be set straight and see the work is perfectly fine. The minute someone doesn't like something in a work or finds something in the work that bugs them, you can bet that the Misplaced Champion will show up like lightning and try their hardest to squash these criticisms simply because (in their mind) the work is just so good that there cannot be any legitimate criticism for it. The number one culprits of ComplainingAboutPeopleNotLikingTheShow, tied with the Willfully Blind; a common line of argument is something along the lines of "why don't you go and watch something else if you hate [the show] so much?", even if the critic has made perfectly clear that they ''don't'' hate the show ''at all''. If a new installment in a series involves any sort of change, you can also expect them to respond to ''any'' criticism of the changes (however reasonable) with accusations of closed-mindedness and"just and "just wanting the same thing again and again'. again." Attempt to assert your case, and they'll likely accuse you of being the reason why the series will die.
27th Nov '16 1:36:22 PM WillBGood
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A fan who takes WordOfGod to its logical extreme. While some fans take the DeathOfTheAuthor and FanonDiscontinuity concepts too far and call out the creator for things in canon they don't like, some fans simply like to dabble in the occasional bit of FanonDiscontinuity or perhaps pen an AlternateUniverseFic. This is something which does not sit well with the Theocrat, who will demand that all "true fans" adhere to WordOfGod to the letter. Things such as [[ShipToShipCombat expressing support for a non-canon couple]] or casually stating that you don't consider a statement a creator made at a convention about a plot point in the series finale to be part of your personal canon will get you stoned or burned at the stake by these fans, and if you dare write a fanfic that deviates from canon even a tiny bit, expect this fan to bombard you with flames in your review section or endlessly nitpick"what you got wrong", even if the fic itself is well-written and compelling. They might even go so far as to flame you for speculation on the series that later gets {{Jossed}}, demanding that you go back and delete your own posts if later story revelations contradict what you wrote.

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A fan who takes WordOfGod to its logical extreme. While some fans take the DeathOfTheAuthor and FanonDiscontinuity concepts too far and call out the creator for things in canon they don't like, some fans simply like to dabble in the occasional bit of FanonDiscontinuity or perhaps pen an AlternateUniverseFic. This is something which does not sit well with the Theocrat, who will demand that all "true fans" adhere to WordOfGod to the letter. Things such as [[ShipToShipCombat expressing support for a non-canon couple]] or casually stating that you don't consider a statement a creator made at a convention about a plot point in the series finale to be part of your personal canon will get you stoned or burned at the stake by these fans, and if you dare write a fanfic that deviates from canon even a tiny bit, expect this fan to bombard you with flames in your review section or endlessly nitpick"what nitpick "what you got wrong", even if the fic itself is well-written and compelling. They might even go so far as to flame you for speculation on the series that later gets {{Jossed}}, demanding that you go back and delete your own posts if later story revelations contradict what you wrote.
27th Nov '16 1:34:32 PM WillBGood
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Sadly, every fandom has to and/or has had to deal with this and all of its variations … no matter how much they deny it and how much they wish this problem didn't exist. Trust us, these people even annoy the makers of the shows that you like as much as they annoy the rest of us. We admit that even ''Wiki/TVTropes'' has its problems with Fan Dumb of its own. Don't worry, Fan Dumb are usually just a VocalMinority. Keep that in mind if you decide to put this as an example to any media or see this in any media here. [[SilentMajority Most of them]], including yourself (unless you actually do fit this and you know if you are), are not complete and utter morons and just want to enjoy it like everyone else. And on the same flip of the coin, ''everyone'' (yes, including ''you'') has probably been guilty of at least one Fan Dumb moment at some point in their lives if they're being honest; the key thing is being grown-up enough to be able to recognize, acknowledge, and correct it and move on rather than getting locked near-permanently into that mindset.

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Sadly, every fandom has to and/or has had to deal with this and all of its variations … variations ... no matter how much they deny it and how much they wish this problem didn't exist. Trust us, these people even annoy the makers of the shows that you like as much as they annoy the rest of us. We admit that even ''Wiki/TVTropes'' has its problems with Fan Dumb of its own. Don't worry, Fan Dumb are usually just a VocalMinority. Keep that in mind if you decide to put this as an example to any media or see this in any media here. [[SilentMajority Most of them]], including yourself (unless you actually do fit this and you know if you are), are not complete and utter morons and just want to enjoy it like everyone else. And on the same flip of the coin, ''everyone'' (yes, including ''you'') has probably been guilty of at least one Fan Dumb moment at some point in their lives if they're being honest; the key thing is being grown-up enough to be able to recognize, acknowledge, and correct it and move on rather than getting locked near-permanently into that mindset.



The opposite of the Theocrat (see below), and often veering into HateDumb territory as well, these are fans who, above all else, prefer ''only'' the fanon explanations, or, even better, their own explanations of canon events and characters. Often found twisting a character's personality into a DracoInLeatherPants[=/=]RonTheDeathEater and saying that those should be the true characters, heaping scorn on the [[OneTruePairing canon pairing]] and propagating DieForOurShip, taking WordOfDante over WordOfGod and declaring the latter as a result of {{bad writing|Index}}, erasing any and all clarifications of {{Plot Hole}}s to fit their own personal canons, the list goes on and on.
When dealing with this kind of Fan, it may be helpful to construct an analogy of a student taking an exam who insists on only giving answers that she herself and/or her classmates came up with, even when they contradict answers the teacher himself has provided, and she even argues with the teacher after getting her "incorrect" paper back. Then, ask the Anarchist "Now, considering that this is in fact [insert creator's name]'s story and not ''your'' story, how are you any different from this bizarre student?"

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The opposite of the Theocrat (see below), and often veering into HateDumb territory as well, these are fans who, above all else, prefer ''only'' the fanon explanations, or, even better, their own explanations of canon events and characters. Often found twisting a character's personality into a DracoInLeatherPants[=/=]RonTheDeathEater and saying that those should be the true characters, heaping scorn on the [[OneTruePairing canon pairing]] and propagating DieForOurShip, taking WordOfDante over WordOfGod and declaring the latter as a result of {{bad writing|Index}}, erasing any and all clarifications of {{Plot Hole}}s to fit their own personal canons, the list goes on and on.
on. When dealing with this kind of Fan, it may be helpful to construct an analogy of a student taking an exam who insists on only giving answers that she herself and/or her classmates came up with, even when they contradict answers the teacher himself has provided, and she even argues with the teacher after getting her "incorrect" paper back. Then, ask the Anarchist "Now, considering that this is in fact [insert creator's name]'s story and not ''your'' story, how are you any different from this bizarre student?"



* '''Insane Avatar''': A fan who associates themselves with a single character and hates any who criticize that character. This fan will idolize, nay, ''see themselves'' as a character from something they love. Everything associated with said character is something they would or should do. Everyone who has a slightly different opinion other than that the character in question is "awesome" is wrong. "''Those people'' cannot understand why <Character X> does those things! How could they?! Only ''I'' understand them!" is a common mantra for this fan, who will also reduce all sorts of questions to "WhatWouldXDo" This fan will also fight tooth and nail when defending any ships this character is in. The insane Avatar should be asked one simple question: "Why on Earth should we all be forced to place character X on such a high pedestal solely because ''you'' have so much in common with them? Fact and opinion are not the same thing." It's also worth noting that the sheer amount of utter blind zeal that the insane avatar feels is normally only ever felt by religious extremists towards their religion's founder. In fact, come to think of it, how often do you see a Fundamentalist Christian or Muslim outright proclaim to see ''themselves'' as Jesus or Mohammad?

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* '''Insane Avatar''': A fan who associates themselves with a single character and hates any who criticize that character. This fan will idolize, nay, ''see themselves'' see ''themselves'' as a character from something they love. Everything associated with said character is something they would or should do. Everyone who has a slightly different opinion other than that the character in question is "awesome" is wrong. "''Those people'' cannot understand why <Character X> [Character X] does those things! How could they?! Only ''I'' understand them!" is a common mantra for this fan, who will also reduce all sorts of questions to "WhatWouldXDo" This fan will also fight tooth and nail when defending any ships this character is in. The insane Avatar should be asked one simple question: "Why on Earth should we all be forced to place character X on such a high pedestal solely because ''you'' have so much in common with them? Fact and opinion are not the same thing." It's also worth noting that the sheer amount of utter blind zeal that the insane avatar feels is normally only ever felt by religious extremists towards their religion's founder. In fact, come to think of it, how often do you see a Fundamentalist Christian or Muslim outright proclaim to see ''themselves'' as Jesus or Mohammad?



These fans tend to spring up when the show goes from being a cult favorite to the mainstream. They are often prone to "I judge you if you like…" or "I judge people based on whether they have seen…" They tend to resent the influx of new fans as "plebeians" and "Johnny-come-latelys" who are infiltrating and bringing down the tone of their previously exclusive, niche little club. As an [[SmallNameBigEgo ego-stroking exercise]], they might actually try to set themselves up as an elite and attract any lickspittles and [[InternetMimic mimics]] they can find; alternatively, expect to hear a lot of whining about how the show has [[ItsPopularNowItSucks "Sold Out" or "Gone Commercial"]], whether it's true or false. Ask this person why on Earth their enjoyment of a show should be affected by the fact that some guy 2,000 miles away is also enjoying the show but without being of group X.

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These fans tend to spring up when the show goes from being a cult favorite to the mainstream. They are often prone to "I judge you if you like…" like..." or "I judge people based on whether they have seen…" seen..." They tend to resent the influx of new fans as "plebeians" and "Johnny-come-latelys" who are infiltrating and bringing down the tone of their previously exclusive, niche little club. As an [[SmallNameBigEgo ego-stroking exercise]], they might actually try to set themselves up as an elite and attract any lickspittles and [[InternetMimic mimics]] they can find; alternatively, expect to hear a lot of whining about how the show has [[ItsPopularNowItSucks "Sold Out" or "Gone Commercial"]], whether it's true or false. Ask this person why on Earth their enjoyment of a show should be affected by the fact that some guy 2,000 miles away is also enjoying the show but without being of group X.



This kind of fan is very concerned with the morality of their chosen series. While they may be part of the target audience themselves, the Fandom Moral Guardian focuses their attention on criticising adult- or teen-oriented books or programmes [[ThinkOfTheChildren for being inappropriate for children]], even though younger audiences clearly aren't what the creators had in mind. The Fandom Moral Guardian sees a lot of fiction in terms of [[BlackAndWhiteMorality black and white]]; there are "dark" works that only adults can enjoy and there are "light" works which are only appropriate for children. However, if creators working in the latter category decide that they'd like to make their work even a little bit darker — maybe they want the work to age alongside its original audience or hope they'll have greater story opportunities — the Fandom Moral Guardian is convinced that the work is irretrievably shifted into the "dark" category, so they'll be there to [[ContractualPurity complain about the creator "betraying" them]] and berate other fans for continuing to enjoy such [[TheNewRockAndRoll immoral material]]. Accordingly, expect this type of fan to be a little bit oversensitive about tropes like {{What Do You Mean Its For Kids}}/[[WhatDoYouMeanItsNotForKids Not for Kids]] and the AnimationAgeGhetto.

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This kind of fan is very concerned with the morality of their chosen series. While they may be part of the target audience themselves, the Fandom Moral Guardian focuses their attention on criticising criticizing adult- or teen-oriented books or programmes programs [[ThinkOfTheChildren for being inappropriate for children]], even though younger audiences clearly aren't what the creators had in mind. The Fandom Moral Guardian sees a lot of fiction in terms of [[BlackAndWhiteMorality black and white]]; there are "dark" works that only adults can enjoy and there are "light" works which are only appropriate for children. However, if creators working in the latter category decide that they'd like to make their work even a little bit darker — maybe they want the work to age alongside its original audience or hope they'll have greater story opportunities — the Fandom Moral Guardian is convinced that the work is irretrievably shifted into the "dark" category, so they'll be there to [[ContractualPurity complain about the creator "betraying" them]] and berate other fans for continuing to enjoy such [[TheNewRockAndRoll immoral material]]. Accordingly, expect this type of fan to be a little bit oversensitive about tropes like {{What Do You Mean Its For Kids}}/[[WhatDoYouMeanItsNotForKids Not for Kids]] and the AnimationAgeGhetto.



* '''Toxic Genius''': A fan who seems to believe that the fact that other people are disagreeing with her/his strongly held opinions is not because they have different but equally strongly held opinions, but because s/he's just so much smarter than they are that they can't recognize her/his correctness. The operative term is usually "you just don't get it" (i.e."you're much stupider than I am and thus can't see why this show is amazing/dreadful"), couched in as patronising and condescending a fashion as possible. This variant can also be found engaging in slightly pretentious (and often [[EpilepticTrees wildly off-mark]]) analysis of the show. Many times the Toxic Genius is often shown as being a single-character-interpreter blind to AlternateCharacterInterpretation, believing that only ''his/her'' interpretation of the character is correct. (Seen especially in character-heavy works like books, film, and some video games.) Likewise, s/he will [[FanHater not allow anyone to view the character any differently]].
* '''Toxic Visionary''': Like the Genius, the Toxic Visionary uses his perceived intelligence as a weapon … except s/he thinks s/he's smarter than the creators. A self-proclaimed (if falsely-humble) expert on everything, the Visionary is given to long discussions about how the creators clearly don't understand their own work as much as s/he does, often peppered with phrases such as "I don't like the direction <the creator> is taking in <insert work here>, "I'm not an expert on <X>, but…" and even, in sufficiently bare-faced examples, outright coming out and saying "I could have written it better," said completely without irony. S/He can usually be found picking over the work for nonexistent {{Subtext}}, earnestly trying to settle questions [[ShrugOfGod the creators would rather leave unanswered]] and overestimating the significance of "hard" fandom as a whole.

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* '''Toxic Genius''': A fan who seems to believe that the fact that other people are disagreeing with her/his strongly held opinions is not because they have different but equally strongly held opinions, but because s/he's just so much smarter than they are that they can't recognize her/his correctness. The operative term is usually "you just don't get it" (i.e."you're much stupider than I am and thus can't see why this show is amazing/dreadful"), couched in as patronising patronizing and condescending a fashion as possible. This variant can also be found engaging in slightly pretentious (and often [[EpilepticTrees wildly off-mark]]) analysis of the show. Many times the Toxic Genius is often shown as being a single-character-interpreter blind to AlternateCharacterInterpretation, believing that only ''his/her'' interpretation of the character is correct. (Seen especially in character-heavy works like books, film, and some video games.) Likewise, s/he will [[FanHater not allow anyone to view the character any differently]].
* '''Toxic Visionary''': Like the Genius, the Toxic Visionary uses his perceived intelligence as a weapon … weapon ... except s/he thinks s/he's smarter than the creators. A self-proclaimed (if falsely-humble) expert on everything, the Visionary is given to long discussions about how the creators clearly don't understand their own work as much as s/he does, often peppered with phrases such as "I don't like the direction <the creator> [the creator] is taking in <insert [insert work here>, here], "I'm not an expert on <X>, but…" [X], but..." and even, in sufficiently bare-faced examples, outright coming out and saying "I could have written it better," said completely without irony. S/He can usually be found picking over the work for nonexistent {{Subtext}}, earnestly trying to settle questions [[ShrugOfGod the creators would rather leave unanswered]] and overestimating the significance of "hard" fandom as a whole.



This fan is someone who is quite a fan of the show … but only as long as it's cool to be so. This is somewhat the inverse of ItsPopularNowItSucks, but it's mostly the inverse of HePannedItNowHeSucks, since many of these fans only like it because a reviewer said something good about it, so clearly, [[ReviewsAreTheGospel it must be good and]] [[ComplainingAboutPeopleNotLikingTheShow if you disagree with them]], TheComplainerIsAlwaysWrong. Overlaps ''heavily'' with PraisingShowsYouDontWatch. In some extreme cases, these fans have no will of their own, relying ''entirely'' on reviewers and sometimes QualityByPopularVote. When the inverse happens and it becomes cool to ''hate'' it instead of like it (see HateDumb), these are the people who turn their backs on the fandom and deny having ever had anything to do with it.

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This fan is someone who is quite a fan of the show … show ... but only as long as it's cool to be so. This is somewhat the inverse of ItsPopularNowItSucks, but it's mostly the inverse of HePannedItNowHeSucks, since many of these fans only like it because a reviewer said something good about it, so clearly, [[ReviewsAreTheGospel it must be good and]] [[ComplainingAboutPeopleNotLikingTheShow if you disagree with them]], TheComplainerIsAlwaysWrong. Overlaps ''heavily'' with PraisingShowsYouDontWatch. In some extreme cases, these fans have no will of their own, relying ''entirely'' on reviewers and sometimes QualityByPopularVote. When the inverse happens and it becomes cool to ''hate'' it instead of like it (see HateDumb), these are the people who turn their backs on the fandom and deny having ever had anything to do with it.



A fan who appears to have nothing in his/her heart but loathing towards the show … and yet still keeps coming back, often proclaiming her/his UndyingLoyalty to it in the process. Often a fan who's been burned in the past, s/he nevertheless keeps hanging around purely to complain about how s/he's been burned. The Loyalist Complainer is very fond of announcing that s/he has been burned once too often by the show and will be leaving the fandom, and yet s/he never actually seems to leave. Despite the fact that s/he just complains nonstop about it, should anything threaten the show's existence (such as a cancellation threat), hers/his will be among the loudest voices raised in protest of the cancellation. Basically, if you've worked in a business or public-service job, the Loyalist Complainer is, in summary, the type of customer who says they will not be coming back to do business with you, but comes back again and again. May be her/his {{Guilty Pleasure|s}}; in fact, s/he may proudly proclaim it as such in an effort to establish themselves as smarter than other fans.

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A fan who appears to have nothing in his/her heart but loathing towards the show … show ... and yet still keeps coming back, often proclaiming her/his UndyingLoyalty to it in the process. Often a fan who's been burned in the past, s/he nevertheless keeps hanging around purely to complain about how s/he's been burned. The Loyalist Complainer is very fond of announcing that s/he has been burned once too often by the show and will be leaving the fandom, and yet s/he never actually seems to leave. Despite the fact that s/he just complains nonstop about it, should anything threaten the show's existence (such as a cancellation threat), hers/his will be among the loudest voices raised in protest of the cancellation. Basically, if you've worked in a business or public-service job, the Loyalist Complainer is, in summary, the type of customer who says they will not be coming back to do business with you, but comes back again and again. May be her/his {{Guilty Pleasure|s}}; in fact, s/he may proudly proclaim it as such in an effort to establish themselves as smarter than other fans.



This is, although not the only type of Fan Dumb by any means, probably the most classic example of it. S/he is SeriousBusiness taken to the extreme. ''Nothing'' outside of the object of the fandom exists for this person, except perhaps the fandom itself. This means that they will attempt to discuss the object of their adoration every single chance they get, often attempting to twist or divert other discussions to this end, regardless of how awkward or nakedly inappropriate it is ("Yeah, it sucks that your father died; I felt exactly the same way when Captain Magnatron failed to defeat the Zargons in Episode 19"). This often leads them to exaggerate the actual significance of the work in a general context — [[UpToEleven and then some]] … and, naturally, leads to nothing but contempt from those who aren't quite as committed to the show as they are, or who (''gasp'') aren't part of the fandom at all and are sick of "don't they realize how ''important'' it is?" lectures. Naturally, any of the other listed types of Fan Dumb may find themselves ending up here. Unfortunately, this is how the vast majority of fandom is portrayed in the media, which is why [[StrawFan we have a trope specifically for that]].

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This is, although not the only type of Fan Dumb by any means, probably the most classic example of it. S/he is SeriousBusiness taken to the extreme. ''Nothing'' outside of the object of the fandom exists for this person, except perhaps the fandom itself. This means that they will attempt to discuss the object of their adoration every single chance they get, often attempting to twist or divert other discussions to this end, regardless of how awkward or nakedly inappropriate it is ("Yeah, it sucks that your father died; I felt exactly the same way when Captain Magnatron failed to defeat the Zargons in Episode 19"). This often leads them to exaggerate the actual significance of the work in a general context — [[UpToEleven and then some]] … some]] ... and, naturally, leads to nothing but contempt from those who aren't quite as committed to the show as they are, or who (''gasp'') aren't part of the fandom at all and are sick of "don't they realize how ''important'' it is?" lectures. Naturally, any of the other listed types of Fan Dumb may find themselves ending up here. Unfortunately, this is how the vast majority of fandom is portrayed in the media, which is why [[StrawFan we have a trope specifically for that]].



The Old-Timer has been around for a very long time, maybe even since the beginning, and they won't let you forget it. They have an overdeveloped sense of entitlement, but it's based on how much time they've invested, rather than money or devotion. Because they've stuck with it over the years, they believe that they're far more important to the franchise than these kids and "Johnny-come-latelys" who have only just arrived, and resent the show changing in any way to include them. They view the franchise through a sharp NostalgiaFilter; the show is [[NostalgiaAintLikeItUsedToBe never as good as it used to be]], and any criticisms raised of the show at/before this point will be viciously rebuffed. LongRunners especially will attract Old-Timers who will resent and attempt to get rid of younger fans who had the misfortune of being born after they were. It can also happen to works that are no longer in production (classics) — but still manages to attract [[PeripheryDemographic younger fans]]. Essentially, they're the [[GrumpyOldMan grumpy old men]] of the fandom constantly complaining about the good old days and shouting at the "young whippersnappers" to "get off their lawn", saying that they're too young to deserve it. Very commonly they may be found complaining about something that back in their day was a problem … yet they complain at the lack of it now, acting like those adults who make better lives for their children yet say "back in my day we <did unpleasant action X> and we liked it." Or alternatively, if a show (or medium) tries to get some newer fans, they complain about people who [[NoTrueScotsman are not true fans]] and act like a five-year-old upset that their newborn baby sibling is getting more attention than they are. Point out to this fan that they and the members of their group are ''old'', and that a franchise that isn't able to recruit new fans to replace the dying memebers will die.

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The Old-Timer has been around for a very long time, maybe even since the beginning, and they won't let you forget it. They have an overdeveloped sense of entitlement, but it's based on how much time they've invested, rather than money or devotion. Because they've stuck with it over the years, they believe that they're far more important to the franchise than these kids and "Johnny-come-latelys" who have only just arrived, and resent the show changing in any way to include them. They view the franchise through a sharp NostalgiaFilter; the show is [[NostalgiaAintLikeItUsedToBe never as good as it used to be]], and any criticisms raised of the show at/before this point will be viciously rebuffed. LongRunners especially will attract Old-Timers who will resent and attempt to get rid of younger fans who had the misfortune of being born after they were. It can also happen to works that are no longer in production (classics) — but still manages to attract [[PeripheryDemographic younger fans]]. Essentially, they're the [[GrumpyOldMan grumpy old men]] of the fandom constantly complaining about the good old days and shouting at the "young whippersnappers" to "get off their lawn", saying that they're too young to deserve it. Very commonly they may be found complaining about something that back in their day was a problem … problem ... yet they complain at the lack of it now, acting like those adults who make better lives for their children yet say "back in my day we <did [did unpleasant action X> X] and we liked it." Or alternatively, if a show (or medium) tries to get some newer fans, they complain about people who [[NoTrueScotsman are not true fans]] and act like a five-year-old upset that their newborn baby sibling is getting more attention than they are. Point out to this fan that they and the members of their group are ''old'', and that a franchise that isn't able to recruit new fans to replace the dying memebers will die.



A fan who has an idealised vision of what the show should be and refuses to let anything or anyone affect or change that vision … [[FanonDiscontinuity not even the show itself]]. They tend to react to any changes made in the show's format with [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks hostility]] and suspicion. Although often a fan who's been burned one time too many by AdaptationDecay, SeasonalRot, or obvious [[MerchandiseDriven merchandise pandering gone wrong]], some just simply don't like change and respond to it with pram-shaking tantrums. They usually also hate non-canon entries in a work simply for … well, not being canon.

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A fan who has an idealised vision of what the show should be and refuses to let anything or anyone affect or change that vision … vision ... [[FanonDiscontinuity not even the show itself]]. They tend to react to any changes made in the show's format with [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks hostility]] and suspicion. Although often a fan who's been burned one time too many by AdaptationDecay, SeasonalRot, or obvious [[MerchandiseDriven merchandise pandering gone wrong]], some just simply don't like change and respond to it with pram-shaking tantrums. They usually also hate non-canon entries in a work simply for … for ... well, not being canon.



This fan thinks that money equals control; having pumped a crapload of money into merchandise related to the fandom, they believe that they now own the fandom and that all creative and executive decisions must be run through them first. This tends to translate to an insanely overdeveloped sense of entitlement; the producers must bow to his every wish, regardless of how impractical or impossible this would be. He is prone to gloating over/complaining about the amount of money he has invested in the fandom, with the idea that nobody forced or continues to force him to buy every single piece of merchandise apparently not occurring to him. Whenever exclusive sweepstakes or promotional events happen, you can bet your bottom that King Customer may be the first one complaining how it should be available to ''everyone'', which may be justified in certain cases, but not for stuff like Collector's Editions or tours. This is the same type of person who will attempt to fight a speeding ticket with the line"My taxes pay your salary!'

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This fan thinks that money equals control; having pumped a crapload of money into merchandise related to the fandom, they believe that they now own the fandom and that all creative and executive decisions must be run through them first. This tends to translate to an insanely overdeveloped sense of entitlement; the producers must bow to his every wish, regardless of how impractical or impossible this would be. He is prone to gloating over/complaining about the amount of money he has invested in the fandom, with the idea that nobody forced or continues to force him to buy every single piece of merchandise apparently not occurring to him. Whenever exclusive sweepstakes or promotional events happen, you can bet your bottom that King Customer may be the first one complaining how it should be available to ''everyone'', which may be justified in certain cases, but not for stuff like Collector's Editions or tours. This is the same type of person who will attempt to fight a speeding ticket with the line"My line "My taxes pay your salary!'salary!"



This fan might express what is a healthy amount of criticism … but ignores the chain of decay, middle management and [[ExecutiveMeddling all those who contribute to decision-making]] as an explanation to why things go poorly, instead preferring to focus his/her ire on an easily named and recognized target regardless of what their involvement in this might have actually been. This target then becomes the subject of blame for all of the things that go wrong with the show, [[MisBlamed whether they can reasonably be blamed for it or not]]. Furthermore, any failings or missteps are subsequently treated not as human error or the kind of slip-ups that any creator may encounter from time to time, but evidence that her/his target is out to spite him/her personally.

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This fan might express what is a healthy amount of criticism … criticism ... but ignores the chain of decay, middle management and [[ExecutiveMeddling all those who contribute to decision-making]] as an explanation to why things go poorly, instead preferring to focus his/her ire on an easily named and recognized target regardless of what their involvement in this might have actually been. This target then becomes the subject of blame for all of the things that go wrong with the show, [[MisBlamed whether they can reasonably be blamed for it or not]]. Furthermore, any failings or missteps are subsequently treated not as human error or the kind of slip-ups that any creator may encounter from time to time, but evidence that her/his target is out to spite him/her personally.



"Fandom — love it or leave it!" Usually a supportive variant, this fan gets a bit too confrontational when it comes to criticism of the object of their fandom. However mild or gentle the criticism. However valid or reasonable the criticism. Regardless, in some cases, of how ''even the WordOfGod'' may agree with the criticism. They feel that anyone who considers a work flawed is nothing more than a {{Troll}} or a misguided fanboy and needs to be set straight and see the work is perfectly fine. The minute someone doesn't like something in a work or finds something in the work that bugs them, you can bet that the Misplaced Champion will show up like lightning and try their hardest to squash these criticisms simply because (in their mind) the work is just so good that there cannot be any legitimate criticism for it. The number one culprits of ComplainingAboutPeopleNotLikingTheShow, tied with the Willfully Blind; a common line of argument is something along the lines of "why don't you go and watch something else if you hate <the show> so much?", even if the critic has made perfectly clear that they ''don't'' hate the show ''at all''. If a new installment in a series involves any sort of change, you can also expect them to respond to ''any'' criticism of the changes (however reasonable) with accusations of closed-mindedness and"just wanting the same thing again and again'. Attempt to assert your case, and they'll likely accuse you of being the reason why the series will die.

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"Fandom — love it or leave it!" Usually a supportive variant, this fan gets a bit too confrontational when it comes to criticism of the object of their fandom. However mild or gentle the criticism. However valid or reasonable the criticism. Regardless, in some cases, of how ''even the WordOfGod'' may agree with the criticism. They feel that anyone who considers a work flawed is nothing more than a {{Troll}} or a misguided fanboy and needs to be set straight and see the work is perfectly fine. The minute someone doesn't like something in a work or finds something in the work that bugs them, you can bet that the Misplaced Champion will show up like lightning and try their hardest to squash these criticisms simply because (in their mind) the work is just so good that there cannot be any legitimate criticism for it. The number one culprits of ComplainingAboutPeopleNotLikingTheShow, tied with the Willfully Blind; a common line of argument is something along the lines of "why don't you go and watch something else if you hate <the show> [the show] so much?", even if the critic has made perfectly clear that they ''don't'' hate the show ''at all''. If a new installment in a series involves any sort of change, you can also expect them to respond to ''any'' criticism of the changes (however reasonable) with accusations of closed-mindedness and"just wanting the same thing again and again'. Attempt to assert your case, and they'll likely accuse you of being the reason why the series will die.
27th Nov '16 1:29:56 PM WillBGood
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This is, although not the only type of Fan Dumb by any means, probably the most classic example of it. S/he is SeriousBusiness taken to the extreme. ''Nothing'' outside of the object of the fandom exists for this person, except perhaps the fandom itself. This means that they will attempt to discuss the object of their adoration every single chance they get, often attempting to twist or divert other discussions to this end, regardless of how awkward or nakedly inappropriate it is ('Yeah, it sucks that your father died; I felt exactly the same way when Captain Magnatron failed to defeat the Zargons in Episode 19"). This often leads them to exaggerate the actual significance of the work in a general context — [[UpToEleven and then some]] … and, naturally, leads to nothing but contempt from those who aren't quite as committed to the show as they are, or who (''gasp'') aren't part of the fandom at all and are sick of "don't they realise how ''important'' it is?" lectures. Naturally, any of the other listed types of Fan Dumb may find themselves ending up here. Unfortunately, this is how the vast majority of fandom is portrayed in the media, which is why [[StrawFan we have a trope specifically for that]].

to:

This is, although not the only type of Fan Dumb by any means, probably the most classic example of it. S/he is SeriousBusiness taken to the extreme. ''Nothing'' outside of the object of the fandom exists for this person, except perhaps the fandom itself. This means that they will attempt to discuss the object of their adoration every single chance they get, often attempting to twist or divert other discussions to this end, regardless of how awkward or nakedly inappropriate it is ('Yeah, ("Yeah, it sucks that your father died; I felt exactly the same way when Captain Magnatron failed to defeat the Zargons in Episode 19"). This often leads them to exaggerate the actual significance of the work in a general context — [[UpToEleven and then some]] … and, naturally, leads to nothing but contempt from those who aren't quite as committed to the show as they are, or who (''gasp'') aren't part of the fandom at all and are sick of "don't they realise realize how ''important'' it is?" lectures. Naturally, any of the other listed types of Fan Dumb may find themselves ending up here. Unfortunately, this is how the vast majority of fandom is portrayed in the media, which is why [[StrawFan we have a trope specifically for that]].
27th Nov '16 1:29:31 PM WillBGood
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Every work and fandom has its own share of in-jokes and [[MemeticMutation memes]]. In small doses and at the right time, memes can be considered amusing and even clever. The Memeist, however, overuses memes to such a degree that it becomes horribly obnoxious. Memeists often care more of the memes associated with the work than the work itself, often resurrecting old memes that are out of date by several years in order to create groan-worthy new ones (usually [[StylisticSuck deliberately]] if they're intended to be shitposts). They are also considerably more immature and crass than other fans and are easily angered when their predictable attempts at humor are met with a negative response. Thankfully, they tend to congregate on meme and shitposting pages on social media and largely avoid interaction with the parent fanbases, which makes them fairly easy to avoid even if they are still very irritating.

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Every work and fandom has its own share of in-jokes and [[MemeticMutation memes]]. In small doses and at the right time, memes can be considered amusing and even clever. The Memeist, however, overuses memes to such a degree that it becomes horribly obnoxious. Memeists often care more of about the memes associated with the work than the work itself, often resurrecting old memes that are out of date by several years in order to create groan-worthy new ones (usually [[StylisticSuck deliberately]] if they're intended to be shitposts). They are also considerably more immature and crass than other fans and are easily angered when their predictable attempts at humor are met with a negative response. Thankfully, they tend to congregate on meme and shitposting pages on social media and largely avoid interaction with the parent fanbases, which makes them fairly easy to avoid even if they are still very irritating.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Main.FanDumb