History Main / FakeBalance

25th Jun '17 6:36:49 PM MBG159
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** This is not helped by D&D's spell list being filled with options that an experienced player will have notice work well, as opposed to things which sound awesome but really aren't that great in practice. At level 1, there's things like Color Spray and Entangle, spells which will remove groups of enemies from being able to contribute unless the enemy can succeed a difficult (for the level they're at) die roll. At level 5, you get such staples as Fireball and Lightning bolt. The problem is, Fireball is a much more effective spell than Lightning Bolt, because Fireball affects a 40-foot sphere and Lightning Bolt happens to go on a four-hundred foot straight line--cool, but enemies are more likely to take some sort of spread formation than single-file themselves. And this is just at the low levels. At high levels, you have Polar Ray (You get Fireball at level 5, it does damage to multiple targets. You get Polar Ray at level 15, it does ''slightly more'' damage to one target in less range and you have to hit the enemy to succeed) vs stuff like Plane Shift (normally used to move the party to one plane or another, including the various afterlives. A sub-use is to send an enemy to a plane of your choice. So you can literally ''send someone to Hell'' to remove them from combat). Ironically, the game works ''better' using the stronger effects, because monsters/other encounters tend to have them and if you tone down the casting classes, you'd better remember to tone down all many hundred of pages of monsters, too.

to:

** This is not helped by D&D's spell list being filled with options that an experienced player will have notice work well, as opposed to things which sound awesome but really aren't that great in practice. At level 1, there's things like Color Spray and Entangle, spells which will remove groups of enemies from being able to contribute unless the enemy can succeed a difficult (for the level they're at) die roll. At level 5, you get such staples as Fireball and Lightning bolt. The problem is, Fireball is a much more effective spell than Lightning Bolt, because Fireball affects a 40-foot sphere and Lightning Bolt happens to go on a four-hundred foot straight line--cool, but enemies are more likely to take some sort of spread formation than single-file themselves. And this is just at the low levels. At high levels, you have Polar Ray (You get Fireball at level 5, it does damage to multiple targets. You get Polar Ray at level 15, it does ''slightly more'' damage to one target in less range and you have to hit the enemy to succeed) vs stuff like Plane Shift (normally used to move the party to one plane or another, including the various afterlives. A sub-use is to send an enemy to a plane of your choice. So you can literally ''send someone to Hell'' to remove them from combat). Ironically, the game works ''better' using the stronger effects, because monsters/other encounters tend to have them and if you tone down the casting classes, you'd better remember to tone down all many hundred of pages of monsters, too.


Added DiffLines:

** For a perfect microcosm of FakeBalance in 2e, we have the Bladesinger. A MagicKnight kit [[OurElvesAreBetter exclusive to elves,]] it gave a number of bonuses while using a longsword, as well as a number of other abilities, at the price of not being able to use any other weapons or any armor heavier than elven chain. The problem was that you were already using a longsword due to the elven natural bonuses and it being an extremely common weapon and therefore easy to replace if you got disarmed, not being able to use a bow was a minor setback at worst when you could toss around fireballs, and as a caster, you shouldn't be wearing anything heavier than elven chain anyway. The class also had the roleplay requirement of a code requiring you to rescue elves whenever possible... which had the swashbuckler problem above of actually being an entirely voluntary plot hook (and one that, unlike the paladin code, didn't impact you if you broke it). To cap it off, it had very high stat requirements... but this just meant that players who rolled well, on top of having better stats than their comrades, also got access to stronger abilities. And that's not even getting into the players who "rolled at home", and showed up to the table with a bladesinger whose lowest stat was 13...
7th Jun '17 8:06:53 PM DocSharp
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* ''VideoGame/{{Hearthstone}}'' isn't generally considered a "serious competitive" CCG, with the massive number of [[RandomNumberGod RNG]]-based effects making it clearly more of a "for fun" game, so people are generally more easy-going on its balance deficiencies. However, the developers have repeatedly shown that they have absolutely NO idea how to properly evaluate power when designing new cards. Probably the most infamous example came in the Grand Tournament expansion which featured two class 6-drop minions- the Paladin epic Mysterious Challenger and the Shaman legendary The Mistcaller. The former was something they thought might be kind of interesting (a 6/6 minion which, when played, searches your deck for a copy of every Secret in it and puts it into play automatically), while they assumed the latter (a 4/4 which, when played, gives a permanent +1/+1 bonus to ''every minion still in your hand and deck'') would be an extremely powerful and desirable card. Shortly after the expansion launched, the playerbase rapidly deduced that Mysterious Challenger was ''nauseatingly broken beyond measure'' (since in a Paladin deck using every Secret available to them -which are individually weak but, pivotally, ''extremely powerful when used in combination-'' it effectively let you draw up to five cards and play them all for ''free,'' giving it an effective value of nearly ''twenty mana'' when you added its 6/6 body) and it became the centerpiece of the most powerful deck in the game, while The Mistcaller was immediately derided as utterly worthless, so bad that merely playing it would effectively ''lose you the game immediately'' (since ''Hearthstone'' is incredibly tempo-based and playing a pathetic 4/4 which has NO immediate impact on the board on your 6th turn would put you so far behind that you were basically kneecapping yourself). The basic issue is that the developer seem incapable of grasping that THE most important aspects of a useful card are [[GiantMook cost-effectiveness]] and [[ZergRush tempo]]; ''everything'' else (especially the mythical "fun factor") is a secondary concern at ''best.'' Don't even ''ask'' about [[GameBreaker Dr. Boom]] aka. [[FanNickname "Dr. Balanced", "Dr. Broken", "Dr. 7-drop" etc etc]]...

to:

* ''VideoGame/{{Hearthstone}}'' isn't generally considered a "serious competitive" CCG, with the massive number of [[RandomNumberGod RNG]]-based effects making it clearly more of a "for fun" game, so people are generally more easy-going on its balance deficiencies. However, Additionally, the developers have repeatedly shown game is much younger than its aforementioned competitors, so it at least makes sense for the creators to screw up every now and then. Not that they have absolutely NO idea how to properly evaluate it's gonna stop us from listing notable screw-ups:
** The reason why ''Blackrock Mountain'' and ''The Grand Tournament'' were so hated is partially because of this trope. Blizzard massively overestimated the
power when designing new cards. Probably the level of most infamous example of the cards from these sets due to the sheer power of the sets that came before them, and in the Grand Tournament expansion which featured end a total of maybe ''20 cards'' between the two class 6-drop minions- the Paladin epic ended up being used - and even then, only Emperor Thaurissan, Grim Patron, Tuskarr Totemic, and Mysterious Challenger and were good enough to be listed on the Shaman legendary The Mistcaller. The former was something they thought might be kind of interesting (a 6/6 minion which, when played, searches your deck for a copy of every Secret in it and puts it into play automatically), while they assumed game's GameBreaker page. Even with the latter (a 4/4 which, when played, gives a permanent +1/+1 bonus to ''every minion still in your hand and deck'') would be an extremely powerful and desirable card. Shortly after introduction of rotations, the expansion launched, the playerbase rapidly deduced that Mysterious Challenger was ''nauseatingly broken beyond measure'' (since in a Paladin deck using every Secret available to them -which are individually weak but, pivotally, ''extremely powerful when used in combination-'' it effectively let you draw number wasn't bumped up to five cards and play them all for ''free,'' giving it an effective value of nearly ''twenty mana'' when you added its 6/6 body) and it became the centerpiece of the most powerful deck in the game, while The Mistcaller was immediately derided as utterly worthless, so bad that merely playing it would effectively ''lose you by ''that'' much.
** A major complaint about
the game immediately'' (since ''Hearthstone'' is how randomness is used as a balancing factor. While the idea is that it opens up design space for some cool new cards, in practice it leads to some frustrating coin-flip scenarios that leave at least one player flustered. In particular, Yogg-Saron was meant to be an incredibly tempo-based and playing goofy showstopper who's competitive viability was limited, but in a pathetic 4/4 which has NO immediate impact on serious environment he ended up being outrageously overpowered because his randomness rarely actually ''hurt'' the board on your 6th turn would put you so far behind that you were basically kneecapping yourself). The basic issue is that person using him. A surprisingly swift nerf ended up turning him into the developer seem incapable of grasping that THE most important aspects of a useful card are [[GiantMook cost-effectiveness]] and [[ZergRush tempo]]; ''everything'' else (especially he was ''supposed'' to be. There was also Barnes, a card of limited competitive use who was nonetheless despised because, despite his effect requiring the mythical "fun factor") is a secondary concern at ''best.'' Don't even ''ask'' deck be built around him, he could slapped into just about [[GameBreaker Dr. Boom]] aka. [[FanNickname "Dr. Balanced", "Dr. Broken", "Dr. 7-drop" etc etc]]...anything in the hopes he cheesed out a win.
4th Jun '17 1:17:46 PM Kadorhal
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* As far as most of the classic ''VideoGame/{{Doom}}'' modding community is concerned, "spawn a million more Revenants" is the answer to all problems, from populating the map to setting up an ambush when the player grabs an important item. This basically turns any given mod into ''Mercenaries 2'', with explosives constantly flying at you from all directions.

to:

* As far as most of the classic ''VideoGame/{{Doom}}'' modding community is concerned, "spawn a million more Revenants" is the answer to all problems, from populating the map to setting up an ambush when the player grabs an important item. This basically turns any given mod into ''Mercenaries 2'', with explosives constantly flying at you from all directions. Taking this further are the maps that spawn Cyberdemons in every corner of the map. Usually these are "joke" levels that are meant to be played in co-op and expect you to die multiple times chipping away at the Cyberdemons - but "usually" is the key word here, and sometimes they are completely serious. The key is to note how many are spawned at a time, how much space you're given to dodge their attacks, and how much ammo you have available to burn through, as when Cyberdemons are on their own it ''is'' possible to kill them even with the starting shotguns - it just takes forever. This also has an odd effect where some maps that deliberately go overboard with Cyberdemon spawns will often be easier than "serious" maps by forgetting how big they really are and end up spawning them in areas where they can't do anything to you, spawning them stuck partway in a wall and clipping into two or three other Cyberdemons so as to prevent any of them from doing much more than angrily stomping in place, unable to fire at you until you clear the area a bit.



** In classic, [=PvP=] had a rule of thumb that casters would beat warriors (Whose armour didn't help with resistance and could easily be kited), warriors would beat rogues (Who could shrug off their fast attacks with their armour and attack their low defenses), and rogues would beat casters (by shredding through their nonexistent armour). The problem was that warriors could easily close the gap caused by kiting and could DPS just as bad as rogues if they were specced for [=PvP=] - since all intellect did was give casters more mana and didn't increase the damage their spells did. This meant that casters tended to be a [=PvE=] class for the most part, and paladins became more effective healers in [=PvP=] because they could take hits and throw immunity buffs. There was also no collision detection, casters had to ''see'' their targets (as in, the ''character'' has to see them) and hold still - melee attackers could attack while moving.

to:

** In classic, [=PvP=] had a rule of thumb that casters would beat warriors (Whose (whose armour didn't help with resistance and could easily be kited), warriors would beat rogues (Who could shrug off their fast attacks with their armour and attack their low defenses), and rogues would beat casters (by shredding through their nonexistent armour). The problem was that warriors could easily close the gap caused by kiting and could DPS just as bad as rogues if they were specced for [=PvP=] - since all intellect did was give casters more mana and didn't increase the damage their spells did. This meant that casters tended to be a [=PvE=] class for the most part, and paladins became more effective healers in [=PvP=] because they could take hits and throw immunity buffs. There was also no collision detection, casters had to ''see'' their targets (as in, the ''character'' has to see them) and hold still - melee attackers could attack while moving.
4th Jun '17 1:03:52 PM Kadorhal
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* As far as most of the classic ''VideoGame/{{Doom}}'' modding community is concerned, "spawn a million more Revenants" is the answer to all problems, from populating the map to setting up an ambush when the player grabs an important item. This basically turns any given mod into ''Mercenaries 2'' as above, with explosives constantly flying at you from all directions.

to:

* As far as most of the classic ''VideoGame/{{Doom}}'' modding community is concerned, "spawn a million more Revenants" is the answer to all problems, from populating the map to setting up an ambush when the player grabs an important item. This basically turns any given mod into ''Mercenaries 2'' as above, 2'', with explosives constantly flying at you from all directions.



* When ''VideoGame/CommandAndConquerRedAlert3'''s expansion was released the game creators specifically left out any programming to let it be multiplayer knowing full well that some of the units could be used in truly epic overpowering moves. At the top of the list was the Harbinger Gunship (pretty much a flying heavy tank with either a heavy gun or machine gun), the desolator (could kill anything on the ground) and the Giga Fortress, a floating island with 6 main weapons that could transform into a flying head with a ridiculously powerful WaveMotionGun.

to:

* When ''VideoGame/CommandAndConquerRedAlert3'''s expansion was released released, the game creators specifically left out any programming to let it be multiplayer multiplayer, knowing full well that some of the units could be used in truly epic overpowering moves. At the top of the list was the Harbinger Gunship (pretty much a flying heavy tank with either a heavy gun or machine gun), the desolator (could kill anything on the ground) and the Giga Fortress, a floating island with 6 main weapons that could transform into a flying head with a ridiculously powerful WaveMotionGun.



*** Sandbagged Allied GI troops. They may be immobile, but they easily overcome this when they settle down near an enemy base, pulling out their [[GameBreaker absurdly powerful machine guns]], that can destroy tanks in good numbers. A bunch of them trained well can stop any enemy player's assault because once a unit is constructed, it is already destroyed. Gets even worse in the expansion pack where the new Guardian [=GIs=] might not be much for killing infantry but when deployed, there's simply no way to force them out of their holes because while the massive firepower of massed [=GIs=] could be offset by suicide-rushing tanks at them in order to crush the immobile soldiers, deployed Guardian [=GIs=] are ''uncrushable and have anti-tank weapons''. Combining the two means certain death to the enemy.

to:

*** Sandbagged Allied GI troops. They may be immobile, but they easily overcome this when they settle down near an enemy base, pulling out their [[GameBreaker absurdly powerful machine guns]], guns]] that can destroy tanks in good numbers. A bunch of them trained well and deployed in an enemy's base can stop any enemy player's assault assault, because once a any unit is constructed, constructed or trained will be destroyed before that player can even tell it is already destroyed. to do anything. Gets even worse in the expansion pack where with the new Guardian [=GIs=] [=GIs=], who might not be much for killing infantry infantry, but when deployed, deployed there's simply no way to force them out of their holes because because, while the massive firepower of massed [=GIs=] could be offset by suicide-rushing tanks at them in order to crush the immobile soldiers, deployed Guardian [=GIs=] are ''uncrushable and have anti-tank weapons''. Combining the two means certain death to the enemy.



* ''VideoGame/WarCraft III: The Frozen Throne'' has a unique case in reguards to its single-player only Naga race. Since the Naga are singleplayer only, its understandable that Blizzard would overlook balancing this race. The Naga aren't even close to having the same amount of gameplay units and structures as the main orc, human, undead and night elf factions, but once you get your chance to play as the Naga, the unbalance towards how much more powerful their units are in regards to the main races mentioned above becomes apparent. The most obvious unbalance is in reguards to the Naga's flying unit, the Couatl. They're about as powerful as the orc Wyverns without their poison spears, but the main difference is that building Wyverns take four food while the Couatls only need two (plus, they have the ability Abolish Magic). Couatl are forces to be reckoned with, but to give these beasts the same amount of food cost as normal footmen just wasn't good balancing. Massing an army of Couatl just spells game-over to the opponent. Thankfully, you only get a shot to build these things in one total mission of the ''Frozen Throne'' campaign and the enemy Naga opponents in the game barely ever send more than 4 to 6 of them at a time on Hard difficulty to truly see how unbalanced they are.

to:

* ''VideoGame/WarCraft III: The Frozen Throne'' has a unique case in reguards regards to its single-player only Naga race. Since the Naga are singleplayer only, its it's understandable that Blizzard would overlook balancing this race. The Naga aren't even close to having the same amount of gameplay units and structures as the main orc, human, undead and night elf factions, but once you get your chance to play as the Naga, the unbalance towards how much more powerful their units are in regards to the main races mentioned above becomes apparent. The most obvious unbalance is in reguards regards to the Naga's flying unit, the Couatl. They're about as powerful as the orc Wyverns without their poison spears, but the main difference is that building Wyverns take four food while the Couatls only need two (plus, they have the ability Abolish Magic). Couatl are forces to be reckoned with, but to give these beasts the same amount of food cost as normal footmen just wasn't good balancing. Massing an army of Couatl just spells game-over to the opponent. Thankfully, you only get a shot to build these things in one total mission of the ''Frozen Throne'' campaign and the enemy Naga opponents in the game barely ever send more than 4 to 6 of them at a time on Hard difficulty to truly see how unbalanced they are.



* 32X shooter ''Shadow Squadron'' has two ships to choose from: Feather 1, with rapid-fire but weak lasers, a special shield that does diddly squat to protect your ship, and homing missiles that are pitifully weak. Feather 2, on the other hand, has a powerful laser that can fire as fast as you can push the fire button (which theoretically means ''even faster'' than Feather 1,) a massive rocket more suited for using against the giant battleships that are your primary target for the game, and the ability to shoot down enemy missiles (the primary projectile you have to deal with, and an ability that Feather 1 sorely lacks,) allowing Feather 2 to chew through anything almost effortlessly. Simply put, Feather 1 is inferior to Feather 2 in every single way but one: Feather 1 gets its energy and normal shields replenished after every mission, while Feather 2 has a massive stockpile of energy that has to carry it through the whole game, and burns energy at the end of every mission to replenish it's shields. And even then, you shouldn't be taking too many hits since you can shoot down enemy missiles, and Feather 2's energy stockpile is more than enough to carry it through the game, and using a continue even ''replenishes it completely.''

to:

* 32X shooter ''Shadow Squadron'' has two ships to choose from: Feather 1, with rapid-fire but weak lasers, a special shield that does diddly squat to protect your ship, and homing missiles that are pitifully weak. Feather 2, on the other hand, has a powerful laser that can fire as fast as you can push the fire button (which theoretically means ''even faster'' than Feather 1,) a massive rocket more suited for using against the giant battleships that are your primary target for the game, and the ability to shoot down enemy missiles (the primary projectile you have to deal with, and an ability that Feather 1 sorely lacks,) lacks), allowing Feather 2 to chew through anything almost effortlessly. Simply put, Feather 1 is inferior to Feather 2 in every single way but one: Feather 1 gets its energy and normal shields replenished after every mission, while Feather 2 has a massive stockpile of energy that has to carry it through the whole game, and burns energy at the end of every mission to replenish it's its shields. And even then, you shouldn't be taking too many hits since you can shoot down enemy missiles, and Feather 2's energy stockpile is more than enough to carry it through the game, and especially since using a continue even ''replenishes it completely.''



* Inverted in ''VideoGame/SpaceJam'' where all the Mon Stars have much worse stats compared to the Toons (Who have Michael Jordon, a MasterOfAll, and Bugs Bunny who comes pretty close). However the Mon Stars are all ''huge'', meaning they make up for it purely for having much larger hitboxes and thus a much easier time getting their hands on the ball. Anyone going in with a team of Michael, Bugs, and Lola will find they're actually pretty evenly matched against any combination of Mon Stars since while the Toons are much better at shooting the ball, they won't get as many shots as the Mon Stars.

to:

* Inverted in ''VideoGame/SpaceJam'' where all the Mon Stars have much worse stats compared to the Toons (Who (who have Michael Jordon, a MasterOfAll, and Bugs Bunny who comes pretty close). However the Mon Stars are all ''huge'', meaning they make up for it purely for having much larger hitboxes and thus a much easier time getting their hands on the ball. Anyone going in with a team of Michael, Bugs, and Lola will find they're actually pretty evenly matched against any combination of Mon Stars since while the Toons are much better at shooting the ball, they won't get as many shots as the Mon Stars.



** Subverted in the Remake, though. Chris now handles weapons much better (he shoots faster and has a far higher chance of a [[OneHitKill headshot]], which saves ammo), and has a flash grenade for a secondary weapon which explodes heads. That durability also comes into much better effect as the enemies do hit harder (or Jill got that much weaker). The Grenade Launcher has been considerably nerfed (unless you count the infinite ammo glitch for it), and the immolation mechanic to keep zombies from coming back as more dangerous Crimson Heads takes away Jill's two other item slots anyway (Chris can do it with just his lighter, which gets its own slot as his personal item).

to:

** Subverted in the Remake, though. Chris now handles weapons much better (he shoots faster and has a far higher chance of a [[OneHitKill headshot]], which saves ammo), and has a flash grenade for a secondary weapon which explodes heads. That durability also comes into much better effect as the enemies do hit harder (or Jill got that much weaker). The Grenade Launcher has been considerably nerfed (unless you count the infinite ammo glitch for it), and the immolation mechanic to keep zombies from coming back as more dangerous Crimson Heads takes away Jill's two other item slots anyway (Chris can do it with just his previously-useless lighter, which gets its own slot as his personal item).



** ''Call of Duty'', again, has this problem as well. ''United Offensive'' decided to up the challenge present in the base game - by lessening how often dead enemies will drop medkits when you're injured and giving the Germans a new, incredibly powerful semi-auto rifle. Your only chance of survival is letting your AI teammates do all the fighting, because if you try to do anything, you will lose half your health in one shot and most likely will not be able to replenish a single bit of it afterwards. ''Call of Duty 2'' switched to RegeneratingHealth - and now you're forced to [[TooDumbToLive run right up towards enemy tanks and stand up in front of enemy machine-gunners]] (things real soldiers in real wars ''very quickly learn '''not''' to do'') every fifteen seconds to balance it out.
*** Regenerating health has caused a lot of this in modern games, where developers design the game around the idea that the player has effectively infinite health, without taking into account the fact that the player needs time where they're not getting injured for regeneration to kick in. ''VideoGame/BattlefieldBadCompany'' is another good example, since its draw is destructible cover, [[ThisIsGonnaSuck combined with the typical "give absolutely every enemy a rocket launcher" idea]] that modern shooters always do - if you're injured enough that you have to hide and heal in this game, you're basically already dead.
* In VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoV Online, the player is given the ability to carry additional armor vests and snacks to eat in firefights to help keep them going. So, of course, the armor is [[ArmorIsUseless about as sturdy as wet cardboard]], and ConservationOfNinjitsu is drop-kicked out the window as [[TheComputerIsACheatingBastard enemy NPCs have tank plating for armor]].

to:

** ''Call of Duty'', again, has this problem as well. ''United Offensive'' decided to up the challenge present in the base game - by lessening how often dead enemies will drop medkits when you're injured and giving the Germans that didn't already have the [=MP40=] to shred you in close range a new, incredibly powerful semi-auto rifle.rifle that lets them shred you at ''any'' distance. Your only chance of survival is letting your AI teammates do all the fighting, because if you try to do anything, you will lose half your health in one shot and most likely will not be able to replenish a single bit of it afterwards. ''Call of Duty 2'' switched to RegeneratingHealth - and now you're forced to [[TooDumbToLive run right up towards enemy tanks and stand up in front of enemy machine-gunners]] (things real soldiers in real wars ''very quickly learn '''not''' to do'') do'' if they want to live more than fifteen seconds) every fifteen seconds to balance it out.
*** Regenerating health has caused a lot of this in modern games, where developers design the game around the idea that the player has effectively infinite health, often without taking into account the fact that the player needs time where they're not ''not'' getting injured for that regeneration to kick in. ''VideoGame/BattlefieldBadCompany'' is another good example, since its draw is destructible cover, [[ThisIsGonnaSuck combined with everyone getting explosives or the typical "give absolutely every enemy a rocket launcher" idea]] that modern shooters always do game straight-up making you suicide rush heavy vehicles at times - if you're injured enough that you have to hide and heal in this game, you're basically already dead.
* In VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoV Online, ''VideoGame/GrandTheftAutoV Online'', the player is given the ability to carry additional armor vests and snacks to eat in firefights to help keep them going. So, of course, the armor is [[ArmorIsUseless about as sturdy as wet cardboard]], and ConservationOfNinjitsu is drop-kicked out the window as [[TheComputerIsACheatingBastard enemy NPCs have tank plating for armor]].



* Aircraft types in ''VideoGame/AceCombatInfinity''. Fighters deal increased damage against and acquire locks faster on air targets but suffer penalties to damage and lock-on speed for ground and sea targets, Attackers are the other way around (Bombers going even further, so much that they don't ''get'' air-to-air weapons), and Multiroles have neither a bonus nor a penalty. So far so good, but Multiroles also have a noticeably higher amount of slots for performance-enhancing parts, allowing players to specialize them for either role while keeping respectable performance in the other role. Combined with the mostly unpredictable variations in enemy targets in the missions and the fact that upgrading one Multirole is far cheaper than dumping cash on both a Fighter and an Attacker, it's no surprise that they're the most used aircraft type. Later updates have done something to alleviate this, however. Later-added maps have been more biased towards one type of target rather than a near-perfect mix that gives Multiroles the advantage, such as Area [=B7R=] being entirely fighter-based, or Adriatic Sea offering primarily ground targets with only a small handful of fighters and helicopters. Regular Team Deathmatch gives the advantage to Fighters, since obviously everyone is flying aircraft of some variety, with Multiroles' only advantage being a niche role of protecting allies with the ECM, and Attackers being useless (even with a part only they can use that interferes with missile homing upgrades applied to anyone that fires at them - being untouchable doesn't help much when you invariably can't touch the enemy either). Naval Fleet Assault, meanwhile, lets any type shine. Fighters still obviously have the advantage against the opposing players, and while the KillStreak system allows that to go quite a ways towards victory (with every possible bonus for making kills allowing up to half of the enemy fleet's total health to be taken away), that alone won't win the battle. Attackers and Bombers, as expected, are likewise near-useless against enemy planes, but their hard-hitting air-to-ground weapons do a lot of damage to the enemy fleet (so much so that a Bomber that gets shot down after a single pass on the enemy fleet every time can ''still'' end up as MVP simply because it made those shots count). Multiroles still don't have any specific advantages, but they don't have any disadvantages - one with a good pilot who's poured a lot of money into upgrading and tuning it can switch roles on the fly to pick up the slack and still do just as much overall as a single-role craft.

to:

* Aircraft types in ''VideoGame/AceCombatInfinity''. Fighters deal increased damage against and acquire locks faster on air targets but suffer penalties to damage and lock-on speed for ground and sea targets, Attackers are the other way around (Bombers going even further, so much that they don't ''get'' air-to-air weapons), and Multiroles have neither a bonus nor a penalty. So far so good, but Multiroles also have a noticeably higher amount of slots for performance-enhancing parts, allowing players to specialize them for either role while keeping respectable performance in the other role.role, or even simply upgrade their effectiveness at ''both'' roles. Combined with the mostly unpredictable variations in enemy targets in the missions and the fact that upgrading one Multirole is far cheaper than dumping cash on both a Fighter and an Attacker, it's no surprise that they're the most used aircraft type. Later updates have done something to alleviate this, however. Later-added maps have been more biased towards one type of target rather than a near-perfect mix that gives Multiroles the advantage, such as Area [=B7R=] being entirely fighter-based, or Adriatic Sea offering primarily ground targets with only a small handful of fighters and helicopters. Regular Team Deathmatch gives the advantage to Fighters, since obviously everyone is flying aircraft of some variety, with Multiroles' only advantage being a niche role of protecting allies with the ECM, and Attackers being useless (even with a part only they can use in TDM modes that interferes with missile homing upgrades applied to anyone that fires at them - being untouchable doesn't help much when you invariably can't touch the enemy either). Naval Fleet Assault, meanwhile, lets any type shine. Fighters still obviously have the advantage against the opposing players, and while the KillStreak system allows that to go quite a ways towards victory (with every possible bonus for making kills allowing up to half of the enemy fleet's total health to be taken away), that alone won't win the battle. Attackers and Bombers, as expected, are likewise near-useless against enemy planes, but their hard-hitting air-to-ground weapons do a lot of damage to the enemy fleet (so much so that a Bomber that gets shot down after a single pass on the enemy fleet every time can ''still'' end up as MVP simply because it made hits hard enough that those single shots count). counted for a lot). Multiroles still don't have any specific advantages, but they don't have any disadvantages - one with a good pilot who's poured a lot of money into upgrading and tuning it can switch roles on the fly to pick up the slack and still do accomplish just as much overall as a single-role craft.
27th May '17 8:35:15 PM eroock
Is there an issue? Send a Message


-> ''As Thomas you can shoot more accurately, throw lassos, and climb ledges; and as Ray you can open the pause menu, restart the mission, and choose Thomas instead, you fucking idiot! Ray takes less damage, [[RegeneratingHealth but health regenerates so it hardly matters anyway]], and he can dual wield pistols, which means twice as many weapons you have to stop and reload every fifteen nanoseconds.''
-->--'''''WebAnimation/ZeroPunctuation''''' on ''VideoGame/CallOfJuarezBoundInBlood''

to:

-> ''As ->''"As Thomas you can shoot more accurately, throw lassos, and climb ledges; and as Ray you can open the pause menu, restart the mission, and choose Thomas instead, you fucking idiot! Ray takes less damage, [[RegeneratingHealth but health regenerates so it hardly matters anyway]], and he can dual wield pistols, which means twice as many weapons you have to stop and reload every fifteen nanoseconds.''
-->--'''''WebAnimation/ZeroPunctuation'''''
"''
-->-- ''WebAnimation/ZeroPunctuation''
on ''VideoGame/CallOfJuarezBoundInBlood''
23rd May '17 2:49:39 AM LucaEarlgrey
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* ''VideoGame/BlazingStar'' has the Peplos classified as a [[DifficultButAwesome "Difficult"]] ship, never being able to power up but in turn getting big Secret bonuses just for clearing stages with the ship and abusing the excess power-up bonus to jack up the DynamicDifficulty for lots of high-scoring opportunities. In practice, the [[SimpleYetAwesome "Simple"]]-classed Windina is by and far regarded as the best score-chasing ship.

to:

* ''VideoGame/BlazingStar'' has the Peplos classified as a [[DifficultButAwesome "Difficult"]] ship, never being able to power up but in turn getting big Secret bonuses just for clearing stages with the ship and abusing the excess power-up bonus to jack up the DynamicDifficulty for lots of high-scoring opportunities. In practice, the [[SimpleYetAwesome "Simple"]]-classed Windina is by and far regarded as the best score-chasing ship.ship that can use the AreaOfEffect explosions of its ChargedAttack to easily obliterate most enemies on the screen wih multiplier bonuses.
23rd May '17 2:47:48 AM LucaEarlgrey
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* ''VideoGame/BlazingStar'' has the Peplos classified as a [[DifficultButAwesome "Difficult"]] ship, never being able to power up but in turn getting big Secret bonuses and abusing the excess power-up bonus to jack up the DynamicDifficulty for lots of high-scoring opportunities. In practice, the [[SimpleYetAwesome "Simple"]]-classed Windina is by and far regarded as the best score-chasing ship.

to:

* ''VideoGame/BlazingStar'' has the Peplos classified as a [[DifficultButAwesome "Difficult"]] ship, never being able to power up but in turn getting big Secret bonuses just for clearing stages with the ship and abusing the excess power-up bonus to jack up the DynamicDifficulty for lots of high-scoring opportunities. In practice, the [[SimpleYetAwesome "Simple"]]-classed Windina is by and far regarded as the best score-chasing ship.
23rd May '17 2:45:39 AM LucaEarlgrey
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

* ''VideoGame/BlazingStar'' has the Peplos classified as a [[DifficultButAwesome "Difficult"]] ship, never being able to power up but in turn getting big Secret bonuses and abusing the excess power-up bonus to jack up the DynamicDifficulty for lots of high-scoring opportunities. In practice, the [[SimpleYetAwesome "Simple"]]-classed Windina is by and far regarded as the best score-chasing ship.
20th May '17 6:30:04 PM Kadorhal
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** The Heists Update added Adversary modes, in which a team of Hunters or Attackers with infinite lives hunt down Runners or Defenders with only one life each. Two of these modes give the alleged prey gross advantages.

to:

** The Heists Update added Adversary modes, in which a team of Hunters or Attackers with infinite lives hunt down Runners or Defenders with only one life each. Two Three of these modes give the alleged prey gross advantages.
20th May '17 5:29:11 PM Kadorhal
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* Aircraft types in ''VideoGame/AceCombatInfinity''. Fighters deal increased damage against air targets but suffer a damage penalty against ground and sea targets, Attackers (and especially later Bombers) are the other way around, and Multiroles have neither a bonus nor a penalty. So far so good, but Multiroles also have a noticeably higher amount of slots for performance-enhancing parts, allowing players to specialize them for either role while keeping respectable performance in the other role. Combined with the mostly unpredictable variations in enemy targets in the missions and the fact that upgrading one Multirole is far cheaper than dumping cash on both a Fighter and an Attacker, it's no surprise that they're the most used aircraft type. Competitive modes have done something to deal with this, however - Team Deathmatch modes give the advantage to pure Fighters, since obviously everyone is flying aircraft of some variety, with Multiroles' only advantage being a niche role of protecting allies with the ECM, and Attackers being useless. Naval Fleet Assault, meanwhile, lets any type shine. Fighters still obviously have the advantage against the opposing players, and while the KillStreak system allows that to go quite a ways towards victory (with every possible bonus for making kills allowing up to half of the enemy fleet's total health to be taken away), that alone won't win the battle. Attackers and Bombers, as expected, are likewise near-useless against enemy planes, but their hard-hitting air-to-ground weapons do a lot of damage to the enemy fleet. Multiroles still don't have any specific advantages, but they don't have any disadvantages - one with a good pilot who's poured a lot of money into upgrading and tuning it can overall do just as good as a specialized craft, whether they're directly attacking the enemy fleet, tangling up enemy fighters, or defending their own fleet.

to:

* Aircraft types in ''VideoGame/AceCombatInfinity''. Fighters deal increased damage against and acquire locks faster on air targets but suffer a penalties to damage penalty against and lock-on speed for ground and sea targets, Attackers (and especially later Bombers) are the other way around, around (Bombers going even further, so much that they don't ''get'' air-to-air weapons), and Multiroles have neither a bonus nor a penalty. So far so good, but Multiroles also have a noticeably higher amount of slots for performance-enhancing parts, allowing players to specialize them for either role while keeping respectable performance in the other role. Combined with the mostly unpredictable variations in enemy targets in the missions and the fact that upgrading one Multirole is far cheaper than dumping cash on both a Fighter and an Attacker, it's no surprise that they're the most used aircraft type. Competitive modes Later updates have done something to deal with alleviate this, however - however. Later-added maps have been more biased towards one type of target rather than a near-perfect mix that gives Multiroles the advantage, such as Area [=B7R=] being entirely fighter-based, or Adriatic Sea offering primarily ground targets with only a small handful of fighters and helicopters. Regular Team Deathmatch modes give gives the advantage to pure Fighters, since obviously everyone is flying aircraft of some variety, with Multiroles' only advantage being a niche role of protecting allies with the ECM, and Attackers being useless.useless (even with a part only they can use that interferes with missile homing upgrades applied to anyone that fires at them - being untouchable doesn't help much when you invariably can't touch the enemy either). Naval Fleet Assault, meanwhile, lets any type shine. Fighters still obviously have the advantage against the opposing players, and while the KillStreak system allows that to go quite a ways towards victory (with every possible bonus for making kills allowing up to half of the enemy fleet's total health to be taken away), that alone won't win the battle. Attackers and Bombers, as expected, are likewise near-useless against enemy planes, but their hard-hitting air-to-ground weapons do a lot of damage to the enemy fleet. fleet (so much so that a Bomber that gets shot down after a single pass on the enemy fleet every time can ''still'' end up as MVP simply because it made those shots count). Multiroles still don't have any specific advantages, but they don't have any disadvantages - one with a good pilot who's poured a lot of money into upgrading and tuning it can overall switch roles on the fly to pick up the slack and still do just as good much overall as a specialized craft, whether they're directly attacking the enemy fleet, tangling up enemy fighters, or defending their own fleet.single-role craft.
This list shows the last 10 events of 399. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Main.FakeBalance