History Literature / Timeline191

31st Aug '17 10:07:23 AM HalcyonDayz
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** Other black rebellions, driven more by survival than ideology, flare up in the Confederacy thereafter. During the Second Great War, escaped US POWs occasionally join up with these guerrilla bands.

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** Other black rebellions, driven more by survival than ideology, flare up in the Confederacy thereafter. During the Second Great War, escaped US POWs [=POWs=] occasionally join up with these guerrilla bands.
10th Jun '17 10:27:06 AM nombretomado
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** The element neptunium is called "saturnium", and plutonium is called "jovium" (or "[[WinstonChurchill churchillium]]" if you're a Brit).

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** The element neptunium is called "saturnium", and plutonium is called "jovium" (or "[[WinstonChurchill "[[UsefulNotes/WinstonChurchill churchillium]]" if you're a Brit).
16th May '17 9:49:42 AM nombretomado
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*** Not to mention the British and French becoming fascists and an equivalent of WWII Italy and Japan. And TsaristRussia, Austria-Hungary and UsefulNotes/ImperialGermany becoming more liberal and turning into a thinly-veiled {{Expy}} ''[[BizarroUniverse of our world's inter-war USA and Canada]]''.

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*** Not to mention the British and French becoming fascists and an equivalent of WWII Italy and Japan. And TsaristRussia, UsefulNotes/TsaristRussia, Austria-Hungary and UsefulNotes/ImperialGermany becoming more liberal and turning into a thinly-veiled {{Expy}} ''[[BizarroUniverse of our world's inter-war USA and Canada]]''.
15th May '17 7:35:17 PM nombretomado
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** They start out like this. In later books, though, the conflict that they inspire has a lot more parallels with TheTroubles in Ireland, with the US playing the role of Britain.

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** They start out like this. In later books, though, the conflict that they inspire has a lot more parallels with TheTroubles UsefulNotes/TheTroubles in Ireland, with the US playing the role of Britain.
17th Apr '17 6:14:32 PM Golondrina
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%%
%% ZeroContextExample entries are not allowed on wiki pages. All such entries have been commented out. Add context to the entries before uncommenting them.
%%



* BloodKnight:
** Gordon [=McSweeney=]
** Jefferson Pinkard is after his wife cheats on him.
** So is Jonathan Moss after his family is killed.
** Boris Lavochkin counts in ''In at the Death.''

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* %%* BloodKnight:
** %%** Gordon [=McSweeney=]
** %%** Jefferson Pinkard is after his wife cheats on him.
** %%** So is Jonathan Moss after his family is killed.
** %%** Boris Lavochkin counts in ''In at the Death.''



* TheButcher : During the Second Great War, the Union gives Featherston the derogatory nickname "Jake the Snake" (or just "The Snake").

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* TheButcher : TheButcher: During the Second Great War, the Union gives Featherston the derogatory nickname "Jake the Snake" (or just "The Snake").



* LesCollaborateurs

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* %%* LesCollaborateurs



* CoolPlane : Several, though they're really just doppelgängers of various planes from our history.

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* CoolPlane : CoolPlane: Several, though they're really just doppelgängers of various planes from our history.



* {{Doorstopper}} : Guess.

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* {{Doorstopper}} : {{Doorstopper}}: Guess.



* ForWantOfANail: Special Orders 191.

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* %%* ForWantOfANail: Special Orders 191.



* LaResistance : A LOT.
** The Mormons are almost constantly in rebellion against the United States, starting in 1881.
** Black Marxist guerrillas harass the Confederacy during the Great War, and they are crushed.
** Other black rebellions, driven more by survival than ideology, flare up in the Confederacy thereafter. During the Second Great War, escaped US POWs occasionally join up with these guerrilla bands.
** Canadian patriots rise up at several points during and after the American conquest.
** Freedom Party sympathizers engage in open, armed rebellion against US authorities in territories taken from the Confederacy after the Great War.
** Both the USA and the CSA sponsor rebels and subversives in Kentucky at various points.
** Other, smaller examples include the Mexican Republicans and Native American tribes in Sequoyah during the Great War.
* LeanAndMean: Jake Featherston.

to:

* LaResistance : A LOT.
** The Mormons are almost constantly in rebellion against the United States, starting in 1881.
** Black Marxist guerrillas harass the Confederacy during the Great War, and they are crushed.
** Other black rebellions, driven more by survival than ideology, flare up in the Confederacy thereafter. During the Second Great War, escaped US POWs occasionally join up with these guerrilla bands.
** Canadian patriots rise up at several points during and after the American conquest.
** Freedom Party sympathizers engage in open, armed rebellion against US authorities in territories taken from the Confederacy after the Great War.
** Both the USA and the CSA sponsor rebels and subversives in Kentucky at various points.
** Other, smaller examples include the Mexican Republicans and Native American tribes in Sequoyah during the Great War.
*
%%* LeanAndMean: Jake Featherston.



* TheMedic: Leonard O'Doull.

to:

* %%* TheMedic: Leonard O'Doull.



* ANaziByAnyOtherName: [[FictionalPoliticalParty The Freedom Party]] of the CSA.

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* %%* ANaziByAnyOtherName: [[FictionalPoliticalParty The Freedom Party]] of the CSA.



* OutWithABang: Lucien Galtier.

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* %%* OutWithABang: Lucien Galtier.



* PresidentEvil: Jake Featherston.

to:

* %%* PresidentEvil: Jake Featherston.



* LaResistance : A LOT.
** The Mormons are almost constantly in rebellion against the United States, starting in 1881.
** Black Marxist guerrillas harass the Confederacy during the Great War, and they are crushed.
** Other black rebellions, driven more by survival than ideology, flare up in the Confederacy thereafter. During the Second Great War, escaped US POWs occasionally join up with these guerrilla bands.
** Canadian patriots rise up at several points during and after the American conquest.
** Freedom Party sympathizers engage in open, armed rebellion against US authorities in territories taken from the Confederacy after the Great War.
** Both the USA and the CSA sponsor rebels and subversives in Kentucky at various points.
** Other, smaller examples include the Mexican Republicans and Native American tribes in Sequoyah during the Great War.



* WhatIf the Confederacy won the Civil War?

to:

* WhatIf WhatIf: What if the Confederacy won the Civil War?



* [[UsefulNotes/WorldWarI The Great War]]
* [[UsefulNotes/WorldWarII The Second Great War]]
17th Apr '17 5:53:35 PM Golondrina
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* LesCollaborateurs



* LesCollaborateurs
14th Apr '17 3:46:00 PM LordSeth
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Added DiffLines:

* NiceJobFixingItVillain: Realizing how brilliant a tactician Irving Morrell is, the Confederacy attempts to assassinate him. However, this only serves to make the United States military realize how much of a threat he is regarded as, and he gets promoted as a result, making him an even more dangerous force.
16th Mar '17 11:29:27 AM Nanuq
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16th Mar '17 11:28:49 AM Nanuq
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* AllohistoricalAllusion: As you can see from this list, Turtledove ''lives'' on this trope.
** Doroteo Arango is the Radical Liberal candidate for president of the Confederacy in 1915. In RealLife, he became Pancho Villa.
** Irving Morrell meets a German Sergeant that has both won the Iron Cross, First Class, and expresses virulent hate towards Jews and Slavs. [[UsefulNotes/AdolfHitler This should remind you of someone]].
*** [[WordOfGod It's not much of an allusion.]]
*** On the other hand, there's the approximately 100 times that a character mentions that Russia could do to the Jews what the CSA does to blacks, but the Germans are too civilized to do something like that...
** Because UsefulNotes/AbrahamLincoln was never assassinated in this timeline, John Wilkes Booth never yells his famous ''"Sic Semper Tyrannis!"'' battle cry. Instead, Frederick Douglass yells it while shaking his fist at Stonewall Jackson.
** The Confederacy launches its blitzkrieg against the United States on June 22, 1941. It's called [[DoesThisRemindYouOfAnything "Operation Blackbeard"]].
** Also in the series after the US Navy devastates the British Pacific Fleet in a surprise attack on Pearl Harbor (as Hawaii became a British colony instead of an American territory), a British character calls the incident a "day that will live in infamy".
*** The main British fort in Pearl Harbor is called Fort William Rufus, after a Medieval king of England. It is on the site where OTL Fort Shafter stands, named after US Army General William Rufus Shafter.
** The Battle of Midway (between the Union and Japan) takes place on December 7, 1941. The Union loses its only Pacific fleet carrier (the rest are being used in the Atlantic against the British and Confederate navies) in the battle, forcing them to rely on escort carriers for the rest of the war.
** In this Timeline, Japan is the only major power involved in UsefulNotes/WorldWarII that isn't the victim of a nuclear bombing.
** An especially odd one is two men named Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein who are experts at bugging rooms, despite the real Woodward not yet having been born at the time while Bernstein was only one year old. Turtledove later said that they were added as a joke and identified the third member of their surveillance team as [[spoiler: UsefulNotes/RichardNixon]].
** Creator/MarkTwain is a newspaper columnist in San Francisco using his real name of Samuel Clemens (see below) and scoffs at the idea of becoming an author, stating that the minimal pay would not be worth it.
** Dowling's objections to [=MacArthur's=] plans for an amphibious invasion of the Virginia coast to circumvent Confederate defenders around Richmond hearken back to the ill-fated [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peninsula_Campaign Peninsula Campaign]] of 1862. Only the setting is updated. In particular, Dowling cites every single thing that went wrong with the campaign in real life as reasons why the plan should ''not'' go forward.
*** This reference isn't only to the Peninsular Campaign, but also the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Inchon Battle of Inchon]] from the Korean War. The only reason that landing isn't regarded as insane by history is that it worked (due to the critical over-extension of the North Korean army, which hadn't sufficient reserve-forces in central Korea to guard against them). The problems in both landings are surprisingly similar. Involving one Admiral Halsey in landings with [=MacArthur=] is also a reference to the entire Pacific War.
** In this timeline, the Emancipation Proclamation sits in draft form on Lincoln's desk as he negotiates a ceasefire with the Confederates and their British and French allies at the beginning of ''How Few Remain''.
** On one occasion when Flora Blackford is speaking to UsefulNotes/FranklinDRoosevelt, she thinks to herself that it's a shame his being wheelchair bound prevents him from ever being able to run for President.
** The Battle of Pittsburgh is a very clear analog of Stalingrad, from the reason it was originally targeted (industrial capital) to being forced into attacking the city directly due to flank attacks preventing the city from being surrounded and cut off, and finally to the encirclement of the Confederate Army inside Pittsburgh.
** Football has supplanted baseball as the national sport for both the USA and CSA (although the CSA version more closely resembles rugby) and many prominent baseball players in Real Life (Lou Gehrig, Hank Greenberg, Jimmie Foxx) are known for football in this timeline. Baseball is stated to be a regional sport confined mainly to the northeast, not unlike hockey in our timeline during this period.
** Clarence Potter is placed on trial for war crimes at the end of the story [[spoiler: for having disguised himself and his troops in US uniforms to smuggle a nuclear weapon into Philadelphia]]. He is acquitted thanks in no small part due to testimony from Irving Morrell saying that US troops had also used the same strategy against the Confederates. This is reminiscent of the trial of Otto Skorzeny, who during the battle of the Ardennes put on US uniforms with a unit of Germans and snuck behind American lines. He was acquitted due to his claims that his soldiers only used the uniforms for sneaking and wore German uniforms in combat, which is allowed under the laws of war. The Allies let him off in part because convicting him would've required them to admit that they'd used similar tactics.
** Custer wins a critical battle in the Second Mexican War with the use of a Gatling gun battery. Generals contemporary to Custer in reality noted that his failure to take along an available Gatling gun battery was a critical tactical error that may have led to his defeat and death at Little Bighorn.
** The [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Battle of the Three Navies]]. It was the largest naval battle of the Great War, with the respective American, British and Japanese fleets utilizing hundreds of ships apiece and holding the most combined firepower in human history to that point. Whatever side lost that battle would inevitably lose the bulk of their naval forces and be forced to abdicate the war at sea. Or at least, that's what was supposed to happen; instead, the battle ended inconclusively, with neither side being able to thoroughly damage the other. All that said, guess what this battle was meant to represent[[note]]The Battle of Jutland[[/note]].
*** In case it wasn't obvious, there's the battleship USS ''Dakota'' (in which Sam Carsen was serving at the time) and her actions during said battle. In the middle of maneuvering, the ''Dakota'''s steering would end up jammed, forcing the battleship to circle the British and Japanese fleets while enduring the brunt of their combined fire; regardless, the ''Dakota'' survived and inflicted damage on her attackers in turn. As the warship enthusiasts will recognize, the ''Dakota'' is pretty much a stand in for the HMS ''Warspite''.
** The CSA starts producing rockets that sound an awful lot like V1s at the end of The Grapple, produced in Huntsville, Alabama. Huntsville is where Wernher von Braun ended up after WWII testing V2 rockets, marking the beginning of the US Space Program.
** Two white Confederates attend a negro boxing league match in 1914. After watching one of the boxers absolutely destroy his opponent, one of the whites wonders for a second about how the victor would fare [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Johnson_%28boxer%29#The_.22Fight_of_the_Century.22 against a white boxer]], then reminds himself that a mixed boxing match would never be allowed in the CSA, nor in the USA.
** Cincinnatus Driver enjoys [[UsefulNotes/RonaldReagan "Dutch's"]] football broadcasts so much, he thinks the man could make reading a phone book sound interesting. "If anyone was a great communicator," the narrative states, "he was the man." In RL Reagan's nickname was "The Great Communicator."
---->'''"Dutch"''' ''(as a runner tears downfield)'': There he goes again!

to:

* AllohistoricalAllusion: As you can see from this list, the fact that [[AllohistoricalAllusion/Timeline191 it has its own page]], Turtledove ''lives'' on this trope.
** Doroteo Arango is the Radical Liberal candidate for president of the Confederacy in 1915. In RealLife, he became Pancho Villa.
** Irving Morrell meets a German Sergeant that has both won the Iron Cross, First Class, and expresses virulent hate towards Jews and Slavs. [[UsefulNotes/AdolfHitler This should remind you of someone]].
*** [[WordOfGod It's not much of an allusion.]]
*** On the other hand, there's the approximately 100 times that a character mentions that Russia could do to the Jews what the CSA does to blacks, but the Germans are too civilized to do something like that...
** Because UsefulNotes/AbrahamLincoln was never assassinated in this timeline, John Wilkes Booth never yells his famous ''"Sic Semper Tyrannis!"'' battle cry. Instead, Frederick Douglass yells it while shaking his fist at Stonewall Jackson.
** The Confederacy launches its blitzkrieg against the United States on June 22, 1941. It's called [[DoesThisRemindYouOfAnything "Operation Blackbeard"]].
** Also in the series after the US Navy devastates the British Pacific Fleet in a surprise attack on Pearl Harbor (as Hawaii became a British colony instead of an American territory), a British character calls the incident a "day that will live in infamy".
*** The main British fort in Pearl Harbor is called Fort William Rufus, after a Medieval king of England. It is on the site where OTL Fort Shafter stands, named after US Army General William Rufus Shafter.
** The Battle of Midway (between the Union and Japan) takes place on December 7, 1941. The Union loses its only Pacific fleet carrier (the rest are being used in the Atlantic against the British and Confederate navies) in the battle, forcing them to rely on escort carriers for the rest of the war.
** In this Timeline, Japan is the only major power involved in UsefulNotes/WorldWarII that isn't the victim of a nuclear bombing.
** An especially odd one is two men named Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein who are experts at bugging rooms, despite the real Woodward not yet having been born at the time while Bernstein was only one year old. Turtledove later said that they were added as a joke and identified the third member of their surveillance team as [[spoiler: UsefulNotes/RichardNixon]].
** Creator/MarkTwain is a newspaper columnist in San Francisco using his real name of Samuel Clemens (see below) and scoffs at the idea of becoming an author, stating that the minimal pay would not be worth it.
** Dowling's objections to [=MacArthur's=] plans for an amphibious invasion of the Virginia coast to circumvent Confederate defenders around Richmond hearken back to the ill-fated [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peninsula_Campaign Peninsula Campaign]] of 1862. Only the setting is updated. In particular, Dowling cites every single thing that went wrong with the campaign in real life as reasons why the plan should ''not'' go forward.
*** This reference isn't only to the Peninsular Campaign, but also the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Inchon Battle of Inchon]] from the Korean War. The only reason that landing isn't regarded as insane by history is that it worked (due to the critical over-extension of the North Korean army, which hadn't sufficient reserve-forces in central Korea to guard against them). The problems in both landings are surprisingly similar. Involving one Admiral Halsey in landings with [=MacArthur=] is also a reference to the entire Pacific War.
** In this timeline, the Emancipation Proclamation sits in draft form on Lincoln's desk as he negotiates a ceasefire with the Confederates and their British and French allies at the beginning of ''How Few Remain''.
** On one occasion when Flora Blackford is speaking to UsefulNotes/FranklinDRoosevelt, she thinks to herself that it's a shame his being wheelchair bound prevents him from ever being able to run for President.
** The Battle of Pittsburgh is a very clear analog of Stalingrad, from the reason it was originally targeted (industrial capital) to being forced into attacking the city directly due to flank attacks preventing the city from being surrounded and cut off, and finally to the encirclement of the Confederate Army inside Pittsburgh.
** Football has supplanted baseball as the national sport for both the USA and CSA (although the CSA version more closely resembles rugby) and many prominent baseball players in Real Life (Lou Gehrig, Hank Greenberg, Jimmie Foxx) are known for football in this timeline. Baseball is stated to be a regional sport confined mainly to the northeast, not unlike hockey in our timeline during this period.
** Clarence Potter is placed on trial for war crimes at the end of the story [[spoiler: for having disguised himself and his troops in US uniforms to smuggle a nuclear weapon into Philadelphia]]. He is acquitted thanks in no small part due to testimony from Irving Morrell saying that US troops had also used the same strategy against the Confederates. This is reminiscent of the trial of Otto Skorzeny, who during the battle of the Ardennes put on US uniforms with a unit of Germans and snuck behind American lines. He was acquitted due to his claims that his soldiers only used the uniforms for sneaking and wore German uniforms in combat, which is allowed under the laws of war. The Allies let him off in part because convicting him would've required them to admit that they'd used similar tactics.
** Custer wins a critical battle in the Second Mexican War with the use of a Gatling gun battery. Generals contemporary to Custer in reality noted that his failure to take along an available Gatling gun battery was a critical tactical error that may have led to his defeat and death at Little Bighorn.
** The [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Battle of the Three Navies]]. It was the largest naval battle of the Great War, with the respective American, British and Japanese fleets utilizing hundreds of ships apiece and holding the most combined firepower in human history to that point. Whatever side lost that battle would inevitably lose the bulk of their naval forces and be forced to abdicate the war at sea. Or at least, that's what was supposed to happen; instead, the battle ended inconclusively, with neither side being able to thoroughly damage the other. All that said, guess what this battle was meant to represent[[note]]The Battle of Jutland[[/note]].
*** In case it wasn't obvious, there's the battleship USS ''Dakota'' (in which Sam Carsen was serving at the time) and her actions during said battle. In the middle of maneuvering, the ''Dakota'''s steering would end up jammed, forcing the battleship to circle the British and Japanese fleets while enduring the brunt of their combined fire; regardless, the ''Dakota'' survived and inflicted damage on her attackers in turn. As the warship enthusiasts will recognize, the ''Dakota'' is pretty much a stand in for the HMS ''Warspite''.
** The CSA starts producing rockets that sound an awful lot like V1s at the end of The Grapple, produced in Huntsville, Alabama. Huntsville is where Wernher von Braun ended up after WWII testing V2 rockets, marking the beginning of the US Space Program.
** Two white Confederates attend a negro boxing league match in 1914. After watching one of the boxers absolutely destroy his opponent, one of the whites wonders for a second about how the victor would fare [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Johnson_%28boxer%29#The_.22Fight_of_the_Century.22 against a white boxer]], then reminds himself that a mixed boxing match would never be allowed in the CSA, nor in the USA.
** Cincinnatus Driver enjoys [[UsefulNotes/RonaldReagan "Dutch's"]] football broadcasts so much, he thinks the man could make reading a phone book sound interesting. "If anyone was a great communicator," the narrative states, "he was the man." In RL Reagan's nickname was "The Great Communicator."
---->'''"Dutch"''' ''(as a runner tears downfield)'': There he goes again!
18th Feb '17 6:15:01 AM Bissek
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* VicePresidentWho: Donald Partridge, the second vice president of evil Confederate Nazi President Jake Featherston, is chosen for that office specifically because he is an ineffectual cipher. Featherston's first Vice President had tried to assassinate him. Partridge doesn't do much more than hang out with society ladies and tell jokes.

to:

* VicePresidentWho: Donald Partridge, the second vice president of evil Confederate Nazi President Jake Featherston, is chosen for that office specifically because he is an ineffectual cipher. Featherston's first Vice President had tried to assassinate him. Partridge doesn't do much more than hang out with society ladies and tell jokes. Also true on the Union side - at one point the USA Vice President tells his in-laws that his job is to sit around collecting dust unless something happens to the President.
This list shows the last 10 events of 91. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Literature.Timeline191