History Literature / ThePrince

25th Apr '16 11:28:29 AM Doug86
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* WickedCultured: Good publicity, again. And it doesn't hurt to know a bit of history, for when you feel like imitating AlexanderTheGreat.

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* WickedCultured: Good publicity, again. And it doesn't hurt to know a bit of history, for when you feel like imitating AlexanderTheGreat.UsefulNotes/AlexanderTheGreat.
13th Apr '16 8:29:04 AM alchixinren
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Added DiffLines:

* RealitySubtext: His bit expounding on how to overthrow religious-based states, nominally about the Ottomans, was intended as a how-to guide on overthrowing the Pope.
24th Jan '16 4:00:53 PM Malloon
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* DefeatMeansFriendship: If you want to make a good impression after you've conquered an enemy, pardon them and allow them to swear loyalty to you in exchange for their lives. If that doesn't work, you can always dispose of them anyway. Also if you're able to convince political rivals to join you and become loyal to you then it's a big plus for you.

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* DefeatMeansFriendship: If you want to make a good impression after you've conquered an enemy, pardon them and allow them to swear loyalty to you in exchange for their lives. If that doesn't work, you can always dispose of them anyway. Also if you're able to convince political rivals to join you and become loyal to you then it's a big plus for you. He also says that the supporters of a just-conquered state will be ''better'' friends to you than those who supported you from the beginning, since they feel like they need to prove themselves to you to earn your trust.
30th Nov '15 4:51:14 AM JulianLapostat
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* GenreDeconstruction: ''The Prince'' belongs to a genre of literature known as the "[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirrors_for_princes mirrors for princes]]," essentially self-help books written by courtiers to provide useful advice to newly-installed rulers (and often also to flatter them so that said courtier would have a better shot at getting an actual assignment to a government post). While these books traditionally emphasized the importance of being a wise, valiant, and virtuous ruler, Machiavelli was one of the first to point out that holding the moral high ground over your subjects is useless if you don't also have actual power to back up your rule.

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* GenreDeconstruction: ''The Prince'' belongs to a genre of literature known as the "[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirrors_for_princes mirrors for princes]]," essentially self-help books written by courtiers to provide useful advice to newly-installed rulers (and often also to flatter them so that said courtier would have a better shot at getting an actual assignment to a government post).
**
While these books traditionally emphasized the importance of being a wise, valiant, and virtuous ruler, Machiavelli was one of the first to point out that holding the moral high ground over your subjects is useless if you don't also have actual power to back up your rule.rule.
** Advocates who feel that the book is a parody of the genre point out, that rather than offering a simple one-stop solution, Machiavelli by discussing how politics work, is actually telling the Prince that he's never going to have a moment's rest, a true Prince/King/Ruler would be an absolute paranoid wreck who is SlaveToPR, always worried if he's Loved/Feared/Hated. In effect, the advise and picture given in the book is impossible to actually follow.
1st Oct '15 2:17:00 PM Anarquistador
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1st Oct '15 2:16:59 PM Anarquistador
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* HumansAreBastards: The prince is advised to assume this from the start, and govern accordingly. Your subjects are fickle, greedy cowards, who will profess their love and loyalty as long as they have full bellies and peaceful lives. But they will turn on you the second the status quo changes for the worse, and you have to be prepared to deal with that at. Yeah, ''maybe'' they'll surprise you, and stand by you in times of crisis, but you can't run a country on "maybes". It's a safer bet to make sure that they know that the punishment for disloyalty outweighs any temporary hardships loyalty brings.

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* HumansAreBastards: The prince is advised to assume this from the start, and govern accordingly. Your subjects are fickle, greedy cowards, who will profess their love and loyalty as long as they have full bellies and peaceful lives. But they will turn on you the second the status quo changes for the worse, and you have to be prepared to deal with that at.that. Yeah, ''maybe'' they'll surprise you, and stand by you in times of crisis, but you can't run a country on "maybes". It's a safer bet to make sure that they know that the punishment for disloyalty outweighs any temporary hardships loyalty brings.
1st Oct '15 2:13:06 PM Anarquistador
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* HumansAreBastards: The prince is advised to assume this from the start, and govern accordingly. Your subjects are fickle, greedy cowards, who will profess their love and loyalty as long as things are good in the kingdom. But when things are not so good, they will most likely turn on you, and you have to be prepared to deal with that eventuality. ''Maybe'' they'll surprise you, and show genuine loyalty in times of crisis, but you can't run a country on "maybes". It's a safer bet to make sure they're simply too afraid to disobey you.

to:

* HumansAreBastards: The prince is advised to assume this from the start, and govern accordingly. Your subjects are fickle, greedy cowards, who will profess their love and loyalty as long as things are good in the kingdom. they have full bellies and peaceful lives. But when things are not so good, they will most likely turn on you, you the second the status quo changes for the worse, and you have to be prepared to deal with that eventuality. ''Maybe'' at. Yeah, ''maybe'' they'll surprise you, and show genuine loyalty stand by you in times of crisis, but you can't run a country on "maybes". It's a safer bet to make sure they're simply too afraid to disobey you.that they know that the punishment for disloyalty outweighs any temporary hardships loyalty brings.
23rd Sep '15 4:40:25 AM JulianLapostat
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* HobbesWasRight: One of the most familiar examples ever. This book made the name "Niccolo Machiavelli" basically a synonym to "Thomas Hobbes", although in real life, Machiavelli might have also criticized Hobbes' theories if he had read about them.

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* HobbesWasRight: One of the most familiar examples ever. This book made the name "Niccolo Machiavelli" basically a synonym to "Thomas Hobbes", although in real life, Machiavelli might have also criticized Hobbes' theories if he had read about them. Indeed, during UsefulNotes/TheEnlightenment, Creator/JeanJacquesRousseau (whose ideas were totally [[RousseauWasRight opposed to Hobbes]]) did a lot to reconstruct Machiavelli as a republican, as opposed to an advocate for a King (like Hobbes).
10th Sep '15 3:57:40 AM MechWarrior
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* WonTheWarLostThePeace: A [[SlaveToPR Prince who has won a war and wants to avoid being perceived as cruel will let the opposition live]]. ([[ShownTheirWork Machiavelli cites historic examples]].) This inevitably concludes in later war, disorders, and a lot of people dead. So, the paradox is that Prince who truly wants to win the peace must [[ThePurge crush the opposition]] (but not [[CrushingThePopulace the general populace]]) [[NoKillLikeOverkill fast even when the war has already been won]], so all their subjects cannot see any hope in opposing their new ruler, [[HumansAreBastards donít waste time and effort trying it, and instead truly accept the new peace]].

to:

* WonTheWarLostThePeace: A [[SlaveToPR Prince who has won a war and wants to avoid being perceived as cruel will let the opposition live]]. ([[ShownTheirWork Machiavelli cites historic examples]].) This inevitably concludes in later war, disorders, and a lot of people dead. So, the paradox is that Prince who truly wants to win the peace must [[ThePurge crush the opposition]] (but not [[CrushingThePopulace the general populace]]) [[NoKillLikeOverkill [[ThereIsNoKillLikeOverkill fast even when the war has already been won]], so all their subjects cannot see any hope in opposing their new ruler, [[HumansAreBastards donít waste time and effort trying it, and instead truly accept the new peace]].
25th Aug '15 10:01:48 AM LordGro
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* PoliticallyCorrectHistory: Machiavelli spends many words extolling the virtues and accomplishments of Ferdinand of Aragon, yet not once mentions his funding of Columbus's expeditions, which is arguably the only thing he's widely known for today. But then, the modern world order is [[AmericaTakesOverTheWorld somewhat different]].
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