History Headscratchers / TwoThousandTenTheYearWeMakeContact

16th Mar '17 11:23:50 AM ritzoreo
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* Is it me or do the final scenes show Jupiter-Lucifer looking brighter from Earth than the Sun looks from Europa? Shouldn't there be a reciprocity in how both suns look to their respective farthest planets?

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* Is it me or do the final scenes show Jupiter-Lucifer looking brighter from Earth than the Sun looks from Europa? Shouldn't there be a reciprocity in how both suns look to their respective farthest planets?planets (especially considering that the Sun would still be the larger of the two stars)?
16th Mar '17 11:22:46 AM ritzoreo
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* Is it me or do the final scenes show the Sun looking dimmer from Europa than Jupiter-Lucifer looks from Earth? Shouldn't there be a reciprocity in how both suns look to their respective orbiting planets?

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* Is it me or do the final scenes show the Sun looking dimmer from Europa than Jupiter-Lucifer looking brighter from Earth than the Sun looks from Earth? Europa? Shouldn't there be a reciprocity in how both suns look to their respective orbiting farthest planets?
16th Mar '17 11:19:51 AM ritzoreo
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Added DiffLines:

* Is it me or do the final scenes show the Sun looking dimmer from Europa than Jupiter-Lucifer looks from Earth? Shouldn't there be a reciprocity in how both suns look to their respective orbiting planets?
25th Jul '16 2:49:32 PM ritzoreo
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*** IIRC, the Monolith started replicating itself out of nothing to increase Jupiter's mass in order to reach an ignition point and turn the planet into a star. This means Jupiter-Lucifer's mass was increased, which would increase it's gravity as well, which spells bad news for earthlings.

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*** IIRC, the Monolith started replicating itself out of nothing to increase Jupiter's mass in order to reach an ignition point and turn the planet into a star. This means Jupiter-Lucifer's mass was increased, which would increase it's its gravity as well, which spells bad news for earthlings.
25th Jul '16 2:48:50 PM ritzoreo
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*** IIRC, the Monolith started replicating itself out of nothing to increase Jupiter's mass in order to reach an ignition point and turn the planet into a star. This means Jupiter-Lucifer's mass was increased, which would increase it's gravity as well, which spells bad news for earthlings.
8th Sep '15 7:10:16 AM ScorpiusOB1
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** The propulsion system of the ''Discovery'' (as mentioned in the books, but left rather vague in the films save for some production materials) was a so-called "plasma drive", which used a gas-core nuclear reactor that superheated a propellant, kind of like a turbo-charged ion engine; no oxygen necessary. Liquid hydrogen would be more efficient, but also more likely to leach out into space and evaporate over time. In the book, the ship used hydrogen on the initial burn from Earth in booster tanks that were discarded, then used ammonia as fuel for the rest of the mission. In the book of 2001, the target for ''Discovery'' was changed from Jupiter to Saturn (where the monolith broadcast instead), and THAT meant no solo return trip, as the mission couldn't be redesigned for a return from Saturn. In the films, the ship had enough propellant for a minimum-fuel transfer back to Earth over the course of a couple of years (while the initial flight to Jupiter is described as having taken most of a year). And in all cases, it was assumed HAL was well-adjusted enough that he could keep the ship running and watch the hibernating astronauts without a problem for years. Mining hydrogen from the upper atmosphere would be really difficult, as the ship is not at all designed to handle a planetary atmosphere.

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** The propulsion system of the ''Discovery'' (as mentioned in the books, but left rather vague in the films save for some production materials) was a so-called "plasma drive", which used a gas-core nuclear reactor that superheated a propellant, kind of like a turbo-charged ion engine; no oxygen necessary. Liquid hydrogen would be more efficient, but also more likely to leach out into space and evaporate over time. In the book, the ship used hydrogen on the initial burn from Earth in booster tanks that were discarded, then used ammonia as fuel for the rest of the mission. In the book of 2001, the target for ''Discovery'' was changed from Jupiter to Saturn (where the monolith broadcast instead), and THAT meant no solo return trip, as the mission couldn't be redesigned for a return from Saturn. In the films, the ship had enough propellant for a minimum-fuel transfer back to Earth over the course of a couple of years (while the initial flight to Jupiter is described as having taken most of a year). And in all cases, it was assumed HAL was well-adjusted enough that he could keep the ship running and watch the hibernating astronauts without a problem for years. Mining hydrogen from the upper atmosphere would be really difficult, as the ship is not at all designed to handle a planetary atmosphere.atmosphere, nor -seemingly- to mine and refine the gas.
9th Apr '15 12:30:06 AM eddievhfan1984
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* This troper interpreted Floyd's response somewhat differently. He seems honestly confused when Chandra hits him with the "you did." And then after Chandra tells him about the communication, his facial expression is more realization than guilt. His reaction suggested to me that while he knew of the monolith and what Discovery's mission was changed to, he was set up with some of the directives being traced to him as a potential fall guy in case things went wrong. They did, and he was, as we see in the beginning of the film. Floyd ended up shouldering the entire blame. His "Those sons of bitches. I didn't know!" came across like a man who just realized just how badly he got screwed over.

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* ** This troper interpreted Floyd's response somewhat differently. He seems honestly confused when Chandra hits him with the "you did." And then after Chandra tells him about the communication, his facial expression is more realization than guilt. His reaction suggested to me that while he knew of the monolith and what Discovery's mission was changed to, he was set up with some of the directives being traced to him as a potential fall guy in case things went wrong. They did, and he was, as we see in the beginning of the film. Floyd ended up shouldering the entire blame. His "Those sons of bitches. I didn't know!" came across like a man who just realized just how badly he got screwed over.over.
** Partly excusable as the loose omniverse style Clarke went for, but in the book itself, Floyd explains in his ship-to-Earth correspondence that he was actually in on the plans for HAL and ''Discovery''. He objected strenuously to it at the time, but the government overruled his concerns.



** Synthetic Algorithmic?

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** Synthetic Algorithmic? Algorithmic?
** Actually kinda makes sense. In the book, SAL is kind of described as a less complete AI system created after the issues with HAL became known, ostensibly to help find problems with the 9000 series AI design. Her responses and interaction with Chandra suggest a lower level of consciousness than HAL possessed.


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** The propulsion system of the ''Discovery'' (as mentioned in the books, but left rather vague in the films save for some production materials) was a so-called "plasma drive", which used a gas-core nuclear reactor that superheated a propellant, kind of like a turbo-charged ion engine; no oxygen necessary. Liquid hydrogen would be more efficient, but also more likely to leach out into space and evaporate over time. In the book, the ship used hydrogen on the initial burn from Earth in booster tanks that were discarded, then used ammonia as fuel for the rest of the mission. In the book of 2001, the target for ''Discovery'' was changed from Jupiter to Saturn (where the monolith broadcast instead), and THAT meant no solo return trip, as the mission couldn't be redesigned for a return from Saturn. In the films, the ship had enough propellant for a minimum-fuel transfer back to Earth over the course of a couple of years (while the initial flight to Jupiter is described as having taken most of a year). And in all cases, it was assumed HAL was well-adjusted enough that he could keep the ship running and watch the hibernating astronauts without a problem for years. Mining hydrogen from the upper atmosphere would be really difficult, as the ship is not at all designed to handle a planetary atmosphere.
9th Jun '14 4:15:11 AM JohnPotts
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** Mined Jupiter's atmosphere for the Hydrogen they needed? Dunno where they'd get the Oxygen, however.
3rd Apr '14 2:03:20 PM JoeBentley
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\\
If HAL actually stands for "Heuristic/Algorithmic", and it's not just a pun to imply "one step beyond IBM"... what does SAL stand for?
* Synthetic Algorithmic?

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\\
If
*If HAL actually stands for "Heuristic/Algorithmic", and it's not just a pun to imply "one step beyond IBM"... what does SAL stand for?
* ** Synthetic Algorithmic?
3rd Apr '14 2:02:53 PM JoeBentley
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* What was the original plan for HAL? In the original novel the Discovery lacked the fuel for a return trip. If everything had gone according to plan at the end of their mission the 5 astronauts would have all gone into hibernation and leave HAL in charge of the ship until a second vessel was sent to retrieve them. But in 2010 we learn that HAL is pretty much hardwired into the Discovery, with the crew of Lenov having to leave HAL behind to perish in the explosion of Jupiter. So was the plan to maroon HAL out in space the plan all along?
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