History Headscratchers / SkipBeat

28th Oct '15 2:49:29 AM Technicolourtardis
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*** I think all of them were entranced by the scene, not realising that Mako was truly in any danger, possibly thinking they'd discussed it with Mako before. The other two girls in the scene don't speak up, so I think all of them thought Mako was just acting, though I do agree that it's a little strange nobody apologised to Mako. Kyoko was just enveloped in her role, and Chiorin was taken over by her inner demons, so neither of them were acting within their own minds at the time, though I don't think this excuses the other girls, or Kyoko and Chiorin's behaviour after. The translation I read had the director thinking maybe they had gone too far, even though he thought the scene was excellent.



** Ren is a [[DeconstructedTrope deconstruction]] of the idea. While there is no question that Ren loves Kyoko, his reactions are genuine anger with her because as far as he can see, Kyoko keeps going back to a man who used and hurt her so deeply she can't accept love any longer, that hurt her so badly she became a totally different person. She keeps going back to someone who she swore she'd hate to the end of her days, who was the reason for even her considering getting into the world of show biz (a reason he didn't agree with). Ren doesn't want Kyoko to get hurt again by Sho, but she keeps coming in contact with him willingly (as far as he sees). He didn't know that she wasn't purposely refusing Sho's calls, because Sho's calls would show up the same was as Ren's own calls would, and then once she does have caller ID, she still gets calls from Sho (at least one as Setsuka), and he assumes it's because she continued to make contact with him, not realising that Sho is just persistent (as I think Ren believes Sho is the type to just give up on something that's too much effort), and she hesitated before rejecting his call as Setsuka. He doesn't want her to contact Sho because of how badly Sho hurt her, rather than out of possessiveness. Sho doesn't want her contacting Reino for the same reason (but he's actually possessive of her). Ren also sees her coming in willing contact with Sho by being in his car, though she was only willing because Sho had made her late by kidnapping her. After all, when Sho forcibly kisses her, he's not angry with her, because it's obvious it wasn't what she wanted. Ren's perception that Kyoko isn't refusing to come in contact with Sho is not unfounded- she willingly participated in his PR Video, answers his phone calls even after identifying work and Ren's numbers, doesn't completely ignore him when she sees him but gets in conversations with him (ergo failing as an actress as she fails to keep her own emotions back), and willingly gets in his car after Sho has forced himself on her. From his perspective, Kyoko keeps going back on her word. Not so much a promise to him, but a promise to herself. The same problem holds with Reino and why Sho hates her coming to contact with him. Reino attempted to rape her but the next thing Sho knows about them, she's making him homemade chocolates. The difference is Ren is more willing to listen when Kyoko does things and Sho is not, and Sho obviously doesn't care Reino tried to rape Kyoko, but cares that Reino threatened to take over his place of most hated in Kyoko's heart. Sho forced himself on Kyoko just like Reino did. Ren actually cares about these things, and cares when Kyoko goes back on what she said because she's putting herself at risk for becoming even more broken. What makes him a deconstruction is that ''Ren'' is an ideal guy- Kuon, who he truly is, is not. Nor is Cain Heel, who is closer to the true Kuon than "Corn" is. While he isn't jealous and possessive, Ren is still aggressive and dangerous because Kyoko brings out Kuon buried deep inside him. How well Ren/Kuon can control himself and let go of his past, something he's also learning to do because of Kyoko, is what will make or break things in the end. Ren is also gradually starting I think to trust that Kyoko knows what she's doing regarding Sho.



** It bothers me too, but can be explained by the way how the text was wrote. The male caller text is redacted in a way that can be interpreted as "I was with a lot of women, but now I realize you were The Only One all the time, and I'm So Very Sorry that I left you," and is acted to sound very aploglectic. Most women in real life have taken back unfaithful lovers with less sincere apologies. The audictioning girls are either young and unexperienced enough for act that way in real life, or concious enough of her tropes to know better and pretend to take back the guy, as shown in movies. Kyouko's reaction, instinctive and visceral, comes from a person that has become too cynical to open her heart to others anymore. A more "loving" person listening the man but not wanting to take him back would be tearing while saying "Sorry, but I don't believe in you anymore"; had Kyouko acted it this way instead of her "go rot to Hell!" reaction, she could have fooled the audictioners for a bit longer.
** This troper took it as the fact that fans often go through multiple celebrities, liking many at a time. If a person isn't willing to even fake love towards a fan, even if they were always loyal, then they can't be a "true" celebrity in Lory's eyes (note how Ren is typically shallow in relationships but can still express positive emotions. Lory approves of him). Kyouko couldn't even act the part when she was told to; she immediately went into a rage. Even someone who didn't want to take the caller back would have still been somewhat teary or emotionally torn. Kyouko showed that she is so scarred she can't even fathom love (she constantly denies obvious signs from Ren), much less welcome or understand it. Since that is a necessary desire for a celebrity, Lory couldn't directly admit her; yet, he was concerned enough to create the Love Me section for her.

to:

** It bothers me too, but can be explained by the way how the text was wrote. The male caller text is redacted in a way that can be interpreted as "I was with a lot of women, but now I realize you were The Only One all the time, and I'm So Very Sorry that I left you," and is acted to sound very aploglectic.apologetic. Most women in real life have taken back unfaithful lovers with less sincere apologies. The audictioning auditioning girls are either young and unexperienced inexperienced enough for act that way in real life, or concious enough of her tropes to know better and pretend to take back the guy, as shown in movies. Kyouko's reaction, instinctive and visceral, comes from a person that has become too cynical to open her heart to others anymore. A more "loving" person listening the man but not wanting to take him back would be tearing while saying "Sorry, but I don't believe in you anymore"; had Kyouko acted it this way instead of her "go rot to Hell!" reaction, she could have fooled the audictioners for a bit longer.
** This troper took it as the fact that fans often go through multiple celebrities, liking many at a time. If a person isn't willing to even fake love towards a fan, even if they were always loyal, then they can't be a "true" celebrity in Lory's eyes (note how Ren is typically shallow in relationships but can still express positive emotions. Lory approves of him). Kyouko couldn't even act the part when she was told to; she immediately went into a rage. Even someone who didn't want to take the caller back would have still been somewhat teary or emotionally torn. Kyouko showed that she is so scarred she can't even fathom love (she constantly denies obvious signs from Ren), much less welcome or understand it. Since that is a necessary desire for a celebrity, Lory couldn't directly admit her; yet, he was concerned enough to create the Love Me section for her.her.
** I don't think the woman was supposed to exactly take him back, but at least pretend to forgive him and turn him away gently, as there is a chance he's sincere. Kyoko's spiteful, hateful reaction was vicious and inconsiderate, showing a lack of empathy. The test was to see how well they could fake in their own agony empathy for someone who they should have no empathy for, who is undeserving of their kindness. Kyoko's reaction wasn't one of someone who was in love before, but of someone consumed by their hatred for that person they became inconsiderate and deaf to another person's emotions.
8th Oct '15 7:45:14 PM RisingRah
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** It bothers me too, but can be explained by the way how the text was wrote. The male caller text is redacted in a way that can be interpreted as "I was with a lot of women, but now I realize you were The Only One all the time, and I'm So Very Sorry that I left you," and is acted to sound very aploglectic. Most women in real life have taken back unfaithful lovers with less sincere apologies. The audictioning girls are either young and unexperienced enough for act that way in real life, or concious enough of her tropes to know better and pretend to take back the guy, as shown in movies. Kyouko's reaction, instinctive and visceral, comes from a person that has become too cynical to open her heart to others anymore. A more "loving" person listening the man but not wanting to take him back would be tearing while saying "Sorry, but I don't believe in you anymore"; had Kyouko acted it this way instead of her "go rot to Hell!" reaction, she could have fooled the audictioners for a bit longer.

to:

** It bothers me too, but can be explained by the way how the text was wrote. The male caller text is redacted in a way that can be interpreted as "I was with a lot of women, but now I realize you were The Only One all the time, and I'm So Very Sorry that I left you," and is acted to sound very aploglectic. Most women in real life have taken back unfaithful lovers with less sincere apologies. The audictioning girls are either young and unexperienced enough for act that way in real life, or concious enough of her tropes to know better and pretend to take back the guy, as shown in movies. Kyouko's reaction, instinctive and visceral, comes from a person that has become too cynical to open her heart to others anymore. A more "loving" person listening the man but not wanting to take him back would be tearing while saying "Sorry, but I don't believe in you anymore"; had Kyouko acted it this way instead of her "go rot to Hell!" reaction, she could have fooled the audictioners for a bit longer.longer.
** This troper took it as the fact that fans often go through multiple celebrities, liking many at a time. If a person isn't willing to even fake love towards a fan, even if they were always loyal, then they can't be a "true" celebrity in Lory's eyes (note how Ren is typically shallow in relationships but can still express positive emotions. Lory approves of him). Kyouko couldn't even act the part when she was told to; she immediately went into a rage. Even someone who didn't want to take the caller back would have still been somewhat teary or emotionally torn. Kyouko showed that she is so scarred she can't even fathom love (she constantly denies obvious signs from Ren), much less welcome or understand it. Since that is a necessary desire for a celebrity, Lory couldn't directly admit her; yet, he was concerned enough to create the Love Me section for her.
3rd May '13 10:57:36 AM Lequinni
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* Lory's reason for saying that Kyouko lacks the emotion of love always bothered me. The audition involved listening to a phone call, in which a man asks if a woman will take him back. The people auditioning weren't given any context to the history of this relationship. The contents of the phone call lead one to believe that he broke up with her so that he could get with a bunch of different women, and the actors are expected to show feelings of happiness, and take him back immediately. If they don't, then obviously they lack the ability to love. Granted, Kyouko's reaction was a bit extreme, but still.

to:

* Lory's reason for saying that Kyouko lacks the emotion of love always bothered me. The audition involved listening to a phone call, in which a man asks if a woman will take him back. The people auditioning weren't given any context to the history of this relationship. The contents of the phone call lead one to believe that he broke up with her so that he could get with a bunch of different women, and the actors are expected to show feelings of happiness, and take him back immediately. If they don't, then obviously they lack the ability to love. Granted, Kyouko's reaction was a bit extreme, but still.still.
** It bothers me too, but can be explained by the way how the text was wrote. The male caller text is redacted in a way that can be interpreted as "I was with a lot of women, but now I realize you were The Only One all the time, and I'm So Very Sorry that I left you," and is acted to sound very aploglectic. Most women in real life have taken back unfaithful lovers with less sincere apologies. The audictioning girls are either young and unexperienced enough for act that way in real life, or concious enough of her tropes to know better and pretend to take back the guy, as shown in movies. Kyouko's reaction, instinctive and visceral, comes from a person that has become too cynical to open her heart to others anymore. A more "loving" person listening the man but not wanting to take him back would be tearing while saying "Sorry, but I don't believe in you anymore"; had Kyouko acted it this way instead of her "go rot to Hell!" reaction, she could have fooled the audictioners for a bit longer.
23rd Apr '11 3:04:05 PM lbookwurm
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**No, I believe the above troper also that its basically a 3 way between Ren, Sho, and Reino and she already has 2 immature guys on her tail who the mature one just seems more ideal to a person in reality. What I don't get is, who warped the personalities of these guys to make them into jerkasses and [[TheGadfly Gadflies]]? Ren is the most mature of the 3, but its really a 2 way fight as Kyouko genuinely hates Reino.

to:

**No, I believe the above troper also that its basically a 3 way between Ren, Sho, and Reino and she already has 2 immature guys on her tail who the mature one just seems more ideal to a person in reality. What I don't get is, who warped the personalities of these guys to make them into jerkasses and [[TheGadfly Gadflies]]? Ren is the most mature of the 3, but its really a 2 way fight as Kyouko genuinely hates Reino.Reino.
* Lory's reason for saying that Kyouko lacks the emotion of love always bothered me. The audition involved listening to a phone call, in which a man asks if a woman will take him back. The people auditioning weren't given any context to the history of this relationship. The contents of the phone call lead one to believe that he broke up with her so that he could get with a bunch of different women, and the actors are expected to show feelings of happiness, and take him back immediately. If they don't, then obviously they lack the ability to love. Granted, Kyouko's reaction was a bit extreme, but still.
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