History Headscratchers / Persona4

17th May '16 7:09:24 PM RisetteFan
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** [[spoiler: I don't think Adachi was exactly faking the vomiting at the crime scene. You can't fake "vomiting" that easily, and as a trained police detective, Adachi wouldn't really have a reason to act up having such a strong reaction. From what was seen, Adachi had no idea that Yamano would die inside the TV, nor was he aware that he could push people inside the TV when it happened: he did it in the heat of the moment, and likely expected Yamano to be trapped there for life. It seems he never expected her to reappear somewhere in Inaba. So when Yamano was found dead, the police took action: and remember, Adachi was a member of Inaba's police force at the time. Upon seeing the crime scene, Adachi probably vomited because the realization that he not only killed her, but also that the crime would be investigated by his fellow officers on the force (including Dojima), caused him to freak out. He was likely shocked and scared out of his mind at the time because of the crime turning out the way it did, as well as the fact that his colleagues, including his boss (Dojima), would investigate the crime and could possibly catch onto his action.]]


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*** As a result of that, the game likely had to record scripts for "game over" scenes for the deadlines. There are also several bad endings in the game, and there are scripts for several multiple answer questions including those that may lead to a bad ending.
19th Mar '16 9:32:46 AM MoPete
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*** They weren't. That was the problem. They only "found the fingerprints" on Morooka's clothes, so they could only prove that Mitsuo killed Morooka.
7th Mar '16 8:15:44 AM supershadow2021
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** It doesn't really come off as because "you're a girl", more because "you're my friend." and on the romantic path, is it that bad to gout out of your way for the girl you've fallen for?
21st Jan '16 10:12:31 AM RisetteFan
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*** Keep in mind that the first time Teddie exited the TV world and made foot into the real world, he wound up in Junes first and was wandering around the department store for quite some time. Mr. Hanamura is the manager of Junes, and Teddie's sudden appearance in his store caught the attention of a lot of the staff members, which means that Mr. Hanamura likely knew about Teddie already when Yosuke brought him in. All Yosuke likely needed to do when bringing Teddie home was explain that Teddie is the guy in the bear suit who has been wandering around Junes recently. Mr. Hanamura was probably fully aware that Teddie wasn't going to leave his department store anytime soon and likely had no where else to go, so he was open to allowing him in the Hanamura household since Teddie was hanging around Junes for a day or two at that point, and the staff were all aware of Teddie's presence in the store since it caused such a commotion.
19th Jan '16 11:33:56 AM Willbyr
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** No, you're not. Then again, isn't the idea of "humans only wanting to see false images and ignore the truth" a Buddhist concept? After all, Buddhism is pretty big in Japan, and Atlus has been known to use concepts from Buddhism and Hinduism in their other Megaten games.

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** No, you're not. Then again, isn't the idea of "humans only wanting to see false images and ignore the truth" a Buddhist concept? After all, Buddhism is pretty big in Japan, and Atlus has been known to use concepts from Buddhism and Hinduism in their other Megaten [=MegaTen=] games.



******** The presence of unnaturally intelligent animals like Koromaru and the Shrine Fox, [[spoiler:as well as Shinji and the Sun arcana guy from 3 wishing you luck before fighting Nyx from beyond the grave]], suggests there are some supernatural things out there not directly related to the human psyche and the Jung meets Lovecraft stuff. I mean yeah she could just a be a really powerful shadow that breaks the rules and has powers that are very weird even by their standards even if she isn't one of those unkillable manifestations of a basic idea like Philemon(who was truth if I remember right) Nyarlotep(who was lies, especially to oneself) or Nyx (fear of death), but her being an actual goddess is not out of the question by any means as this world is not just our world with Shadows and Personas, it's our world with shadows, personas, super smart animals, MagiTek [[RobotGirl Robot Girls]] and ghosts. That's not even including stuff from the first two games, which include mainline Megaten demons like Pixies and Nekomatas as random encounters (which would make sense considering that NPC Tamaki/Tammy Uchida is also the protagonist of ''VideoGame/ShinMegamiTenseiIf''), plus a fairy who runs the healing springs and is explicitely stated to be an exile from her actual world.

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******** The presence of unnaturally intelligent animals like Koromaru and the Shrine Fox, [[spoiler:as well as Shinji and the Sun arcana guy from 3 wishing you luck before fighting Nyx from beyond the grave]], suggests there are some supernatural things out there not directly related to the human psyche and the Jung meets Lovecraft stuff. I mean yeah she could just a be a really powerful shadow that breaks the rules and has powers that are very weird even by their standards even if she isn't one of those unkillable manifestations of a basic idea like Philemon(who was truth if I remember right) Nyarlotep(who was lies, especially to oneself) or Nyx (fear of death), but her being an actual goddess is not out of the question by any means as this world is not just our world with Shadows and Personas, it's our world with shadows, personas, super smart animals, MagiTek [[RobotGirl Robot Girls]] and ghosts. That's not even including stuff from the first two games, which include mainline Megaten [=MegaTen=] demons like Pixies and Nekomatas as random encounters (which would make sense considering that NPC Tamaki/Tammy Uchida is also the protagonist of ''VideoGame/ShinMegamiTenseiIf''), plus a fairy who runs the healing springs and is explicitely stated to be an exile from her actual world.



** Point of note: Although the Megaten games share common ancestry, their mythologies aren't remotely linked, and their symbolism is drastically different. "The Demifiend kills Nyxes as random encounters" because, in mainline Megaten, Nyx IS just a demon based upon the primordial Greek goddess of the night, on the same level as Tiamat or Ometeotl or Amaterasu or other primordial deities. In the Persona universe (at least 3 and 4, POSSIBLY 1) Nyx is the personification of Death itself, because humanity's Collective Unconscious tries to comprehend death any way it can. Conversely, Lucifer and Satan and Metatron and the Archangels may be big shots in mainline Megaten, but in the Persona universes, you can summon them as no big deal, with no effect on the world or your "alignment." So comparing how gods and demons in the primary series work with what the Personas of the spinoff represent is sketchy at best.

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** Point of note: Although the Megaten [=MegaTen=] games share common ancestry, their mythologies aren't remotely linked, and their symbolism is drastically different. "The Demifiend kills Nyxes as random encounters" because, in mainline Megaten, [=MegaTen=], Nyx IS just a demon based upon the primordial Greek goddess of the night, on the same level as Tiamat or Ometeotl or Amaterasu or other primordial deities. In the Persona universe (at least 3 and 4, POSSIBLY 1) Nyx is the personification of Death itself, because humanity's Collective Unconscious tries to comprehend death any way it can. Conversely, Lucifer and Satan and Metatron and the Archangels may be big shots in mainline Megaten, [=MegaTen=], but in the Persona universes, you can summon them as no big deal, with no effect on the world or your "alignment." So comparing how gods and demons in the primary series work with what the Personas of the spinoff represent is sketchy at best.



*** Pure hearted? MegaTen? Regardless, Yosuke is regularly complaining about the cost of [[spoiler:Teddie's]] clothes, so no excuse there.

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*** Pure hearted? MegaTen? [=MegaTen=]? Regardless, Yosuke is regularly complaining about the cost of [[spoiler:Teddie's]] clothes, so no excuse there.



**** All the Greek deities and such appear as demons in every other MegaTen game, so if it's going by MegaTen standards, they're nowhere near as powerful as others in the pantheon. And they're all demons. It also would appear that [[spoiler: Izanami]] really is just using Inaba as an excuse to kill ''everyone'', so while it would really suck to be a guy in, say, San Antonio or Paris when [[spoiler: Izanami blows up the planet because of a bunch of people in a rural town in Japan]], is there really a requirement that gods play fair? [[spoiler: Regarding the landscape, I didn't see much uniquely Japanese in there - it was mountains, a lake, and woods. You really can't tell the difference unless you strain yourself. Besides, the perspective would have been from a bunch of Japanese teens, so they're going to have a different frame of reference anyway, so if there was somehow a uniquely Japanese perspective, there's a plausible reason besides assuming everyone in the world wants to be Japanese at heart.]]

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**** All the Greek deities and such appear as demons in every other MegaTen [=MegaTen=] game, so if it's going by MegaTen [=MegaTen=] standards, they're nowhere near as powerful as others in the pantheon. And they're all demons. It also would appear that [[spoiler: Izanami]] really is just using Inaba as an excuse to kill ''everyone'', so while it would really suck to be a guy in, say, San Antonio or Paris when [[spoiler: Izanami blows up the planet because of a bunch of people in a rural town in Japan]], is there really a requirement that gods play fair? [[spoiler: Regarding the landscape, I didn't see much uniquely Japanese in there - it was mountains, a lake, and woods. You really can't tell the difference unless you strain yourself. Besides, the perspective would have been from a bunch of Japanese teens, so they're going to have a different frame of reference anyway, so if there was somehow a uniquely Japanese perspective, there's a plausible reason besides assuming everyone in the world wants to be Japanese at heart.]]
15th Jan '16 2:43:36 PM Anddrix
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**** I realize that the game never gave her the title "FTM Boy" before revealing her name, yes. What I meant was that they introduced a female character, who is (I hope) very clearly female, yet who is presented as a boy. Why is it illogical that someone's ''first'' reaction might be "She's transgender"? As far as I recall, there where no other explanations hinted at until her dungeon. I really cannot think of a better "this is what you're supposed to be thinking when you first meet her" option, other than that she [[ViewersAreMorons actually is a boy]]. Maybe the Japanese VA did a better job of disguising her voice? Besides, I thought the question of whether Naoto ''truly'' wished to be a boy, or if she only wanted that because she felt limited by being female was something you were meant to wonder about? If so, how is it projecting if, ''initially'', you believed the former to be true? The game itself seems to be setting you up to possibly make that assumption. Meanwhile, being female must not have been as big a barrier as she thought, since a year later she's apparently off working as an openly female detective. Okay, wait, you know what? Look. Okay. I see it this way, you see it that way. I can deal with that. Can we just leave it there? I'm just so fatigued from all this Naoto's Gender! talk and it's doing bad things to me in the heart facsimile; I kinda wish I never bothered in the first place.

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**** I realize that the game never gave her the title "FTM Boy" before revealing her name, yes. What I meant was that they introduced a female character, who is (I hope) very clearly female, yet who is presented as a boy. Why is it illogical that someone's ''first'' reaction might be "She's transgender"? As far as I recall, there where no other explanations hinted at until her dungeon. I really cannot think of a better "this is what you're supposed to be thinking when you first meet her" option, other than that she [[ViewersAreMorons actually is a boy]].boy. Maybe the Japanese VA did a better job of disguising her voice? Besides, I thought the question of whether Naoto ''truly'' wished to be a boy, or if she only wanted that because she felt limited by being female was something you were meant to wonder about? If so, how is it projecting if, ''initially'', you believed the former to be true? The game itself seems to be setting you up to possibly make that assumption. Meanwhile, being female must not have been as big a barrier as she thought, since a year later she's apparently off working as an openly female detective. Okay, wait, you know what? Look. Okay. I see it this way, you see it that way. I can deal with that. Can we just leave it there? I'm just so fatigued from all this Naoto's Gender! talk and it's doing bad things to me in the heart facsimile; I kinda wish I never bothered in the first place.
1st Jan '16 4:32:46 PM TeamBenevolence
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** It apparently originates from the fact that Rise helps Naoto out in the manga Persona x Detective Naoto.
28th Dec '15 10:37:28 PM RTaco
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** Being transgender and defying gender roles are completely independent of one another. Not wanting to be treated the way women are in Japan, and acting more masculine, does not make her transgender - Gender isn't a choice any more than sex is, and suggesting that it is just reinforces the gender roles that cause the discomfort people like her feel in the first place.
28th Dec '15 9:59:52 PM RisetteFan
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****The Shadows also appear to attack people who have the Persona ability primarily, as they are the ones that the Shadows view as threats. Particularly in the case of the Investigation Team, the shadows become agitated around them since they are seeking the truth, and the Shadows despise any source of truth and become agitated if they see them. This is especially the case when you see the Shadow selves of the kidnapped go berserk: when they go berserk upon being denied, they actually don't immediately kill the person they manifested from: they actually fight the Investigation Team before attempting to kill the person they emerged from.


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** He most likely also threw Naoto in the TV as well, and from Naoto's deductions during her kidnapping, she was most definitely kidnapped by Namatame. However, despite this, Naoto's kidnapping was overlooked during the script writing, as this is evident not only in Namatame's testimony to the group, but also in his diary, as Naoto's name is surprisingly absent from Namatame's diary. So yeah, this is likely an error in the script as the script writers seemingly overlooked what happened to Naoto, as she isn't mentioned in Namatame's diary and Namatame does not imply that he kidnapped her, though Naoto's testimony upon joining the Investigation Team implied that he did.
28th Dec '15 2:54:25 PM RisetteFan
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**** The most likely reason why the protagonist feels dizzy after he fails to save someone is that it is the effect he feels of being suddenly summoned into the Velvet Room by Igor. Remember, after you fail to rescue someone, Igor suddenly calls you in and tells you that the mystery has deepened and the fog has thickened, and now it's too dangerous to continue moving forward. He then gives you the choice to terminate your journey or "retrace your steps" (in other words, return to a week ago). Mayumi Yamano and Saki Konishi's deaths are meant to be part of the plot, and they were meant to die. Saki's death was Yosuke's motivation to investigate the other world, and the two murders were the reason the Investigation Team formed in the first place. Most likely, Igor also likely had foreseen that the two murders were central to the "catastrophe" the protagonist will face in his year in Inaba. Any subsequent deaths would inhibit the protagonist's journey through the "fog" to reach out to the truth, as if anyone else is dead, the death will also frustrate any further attempt to investigate the murder case due to the lack of leads. This means the truth is now forever lost in the fog, especially since the game is all about fighting through the fog of lies to reach out to the truth.
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