History Headscratchers / HisDarkMaterials

4th Jan '16 2:20:13 PM danime91
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** [[SarcasmMode Of course it's not criticizing religion]]. Seriously, don't tiptoe around the subject. Own up to it. Pullman sure did.
4th Jan '16 2:11:22 PM danime91
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*** No, I'm pretty sure he was railing against Christianity specifically. The very use of the name Metatron automatically leans it toward Judaism/Christianity, and multiple (poorly researched) historical references make it clear that the target is painted on Christianity.
6th Nov '15 1:20:17 PM Kuriosity
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[[WMG: Was Nobody Else Bothered By The Reincarnation Rules?]] Allowing the souls a method to move on was great, but doesn't leaving the harpies to judge who goes through sour it quite a bit? The only conditions are don't lie and and tell an interesting story. By that criteria any of the Gobblers would get through because they lived interesting lives in spite of harming children, while any number of good people that didn't do much would be denied reincarnation. I understand it was part of the message to go out and live life to the fullest. But looking back it seems more like 'You can be as good or as evil as you like, but you must never be seen as boring by self important Eldritch Abominations. Otherwise you'll be condemned to limbo for eternity.'. I was amazed that in the end the characters decided to encourage people to live this way to satisfy the harpies, rather than get the angels to renegotiate or outright remove them. Pullman really forced in his philosophy in an awkward manner. I was under the impression the core message was not accepting authority that judges people for irrelevant things and forces them to conform to their own values.
6th Nov '15 11:34:54 AM vifetoile
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*** I think the readers are supposed to kind of accept it as a metaphorical victory - swapping out the lies about heaven for the joy of nonbeing, a metaphor for trading a Judeo-Christian viewpoint for an atheistic one. But it only works metaphorically, because you're right, a doorway big enough for "eight people to walk abreast" is a laughably small one for the numbers that Pullman describes. In practical, literal terms, the window that Will made barely improves things at all.
21st Oct '15 8:25:09 AM turnoffspoilers
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*No the gyptians definitely sailed into the Mulefa world and it's never explained how! Sattamax makes a speech of welcome that Mary translates, the Mulefa carry Father Coram because he can't walk easily, the gyptians give them gifts and they all go and see the open doorway from the world of the dead - it's in chapter 38.
21st Oct '15 8:11:40 AM turnoffspoilers
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*** I thought it was that he wasn't truly happy until he could be buried at sea? So not that he was unhappy with what his daemon was but that his daemon reflected his desire to be a part of the ocean. Lyra does ask what happens if you don't like the shape your daemon takes and is told "Well, then, you're discontented, en't you? There's plenty of folk as'd like to have a lion as a daemon and they end up with a poodle. And till they learn to be satisfied with what they are, they're going to be fretful about it. Waste of feeling, that is."

20th Oct '15 7:45:55 PM somebob
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* I don't have any problem seeing the first chapter of AS as some time after the events of the end of SK, but it still doesn't explain how Mrs Coulter travels about 4,500 miles in only a few hours, finds this exact cave that was used before, and gain the awe of the villagers in the little time she had. Barcuh traveled there and back in about two days. However, in the first chapter, it was not Ama's first time bringing Mrs Coulter food. I would put it at about a few days or a week before Will got there as she took a few days before going to get the cure to awaken Lyra and then a few more days before she met Will.
12th May '15 4:21:40 PM nombretomado
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*** That's just not true: in Northern Lights we are shown a world where the oppression is invisible to the point of not really affection most of the people we see. Neither in the academic world of Oxford of the glamorous one of Mrs. Coulter's London do we see any oppression affecting the characters. The Gyptians don't have things so good, but this is nothing to do with the Church - it's the burden of a maligned social group. Only really when we get to Bolvangar is there any evidence of Church wrong-doing, and it's worth noting that Bolvangar is run by an organisation the official Church has been careful to maintain plausible deniability of. People in Lyra's world are depicted as living their lives as freely as we do. The controlling force at work becomes evident in insidious ways - for instance, the Victorian-ness of a world contemporary with out own timeline presumably being due to the Church's control of scientific endeavour (it's probably safe to assume that the Age of Reason was less... Reasonable in Lyra's world). The Church doesn't seem to have any more overt bearing on the lives of the characters we meet than it does in this world. In fact, where the Church is mentioned for the majority of the story it's in a neutral or positive light. The Intercessor (Jordan College's resident clergyman) is portrayed as boring to the thoughtless, boisterous young Lyra, but thoroughly well-meaning. When Lyra is running away in London her first thought is to seek shelter in a Oratory (a church). It's apparent that the Church, for all the evil that is later revealed, still represents many positive things to the people of Lyra's world as well: guidance, sanctuary etc. In the later books we hear more about the Church's injustices as A. we spend time with characters who have reason to know about the Church's more secretive side and B. yes, Pullman becomes more Anvillicious. But for the most part the Church don't act as tyrants. One of the few good things about the [[TheGoldenCompass: movie]] was a couple of lines from Mrs. Coulter that crystalised the L-world Church's attitude:
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*** That's just not true: in Northern Lights we are shown a world where the oppression is invisible to the point of not really affection most of the people we see. Neither in the academic world of Oxford of the glamorous one of Mrs. Coulter's London do we see any oppression affecting the characters. The Gyptians don't have things so good, but this is nothing to do with the Church - it's the burden of a maligned social group. Only really when we get to Bolvangar is there any evidence of Church wrong-doing, and it's worth noting that Bolvangar is run by an organisation the official Church has been careful to maintain plausible deniability of. People in Lyra's world are depicted as living their lives as freely as we do. The controlling force at work becomes evident in insidious ways - for instance, the Victorian-ness of a world contemporary with out own timeline presumably being due to the Church's control of scientific endeavour (it's probably safe to assume that the Age of Reason was less... Reasonable in Lyra's world). The Church doesn't seem to have any more overt bearing on the lives of the characters we meet than it does in this world. In fact, where the Church is mentioned for the majority of the story it's in a neutral or positive light. The Intercessor (Jordan College's resident clergyman) is portrayed as boring to the thoughtless, boisterous young Lyra, but thoroughly well-meaning. When Lyra is running away in London her first thought is to seek shelter in a Oratory (a church). It's apparent that the Church, for all the evil that is later revealed, still represents many positive things to the people of Lyra's world as well: guidance, sanctuary etc. In the later books we hear more about the Church's injustices as A. we spend time with characters who have reason to know about the Church's more secretive side and B. yes, Pullman becomes more Anvillicious. But for the most part the Church don't act as tyrants. One of the few good things about the [[TheGoldenCompass: [[Film/TheGoldenCompass: movie]] was a couple of lines from Mrs. Coulter that crystalised the L-world Church's attitude:
9th May '15 7:26:13 AM thespecialneedsgroup
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According to Will's father, your daemon will weaken and eventually die if you spend too much time in a world that isn't your own. Was there ever any indication of why he was so certain about that? There's a lot of talk about how he became a respected scientist in Lyra's world, so hopefully he understood that a single case study--''his own'' case, no less--isn't sufficient to draw a conclusion; so why and how did he come to the conclusion that he did? His deteriorating health could have easily been caused by a fairly mundane chronic illness. In fact, based on the symptoms we see, heart disease actually seems like a ''much'' more likely explanation of his deteriorating health.
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According to Will's father, your daemon will weaken and eventually die if you spend too much time in a world that isn't your own. Was there ever any indication of why he was so certain about that? There's a lot of talk about how he became a respected scientist in Lyra's world, so hopefully he understood that a single case study--''his own'' case, no less--isn't sufficient to draw a conclusion; so why and how did he come to the conclusion that he did? His deteriorating health could have easily been caused by a fairly mundane chronic illness. In fact, based on the symptoms we see, heart disease actually seems like a ''much'' more likely explanation of for his deteriorating health.
9th May '15 7:25:00 AM thespecialneedsgroup
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