Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Also, GameplayAndStorySegregation - if every nation hates you for competing in their "area of expertise", you'll end up antagonizing too many nations just by existing, which limits diplomatic options for the player
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Civ 2 has the same sequence as well. Literacy after writing makes sense, literacy seems to represent ,ore widespread literacy in a society, instead of just a small group of scribes doing the writing, so it makes sense writing would come first. Alphabet before writing is weirder, but Civ 2 has some other advances like this, where a specific sounding name actually represents stages of a more general idea (Ceremonial burial, for instance, isn't just "having nice funerals" but really represents "early religion in general".), so its possible Alphabet was supposed to represent the earliest, simplest writing or other information storage, while writing represents more fully developed writing systems.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Real life religions usually had local reasons for their food taboos. It could be down to the alternate universe having a different set of taboos or perhaps differing variants including LoopholeAbuse. Several Muslim cultures didn't [[NewerThanTheyThink fall into dietary orthodoxy for centuries after conversion considered boar distinct from pigs, including Muslim Spain for its whole existence]] and a 'domesticated boar' would be effectively a pig but bred to not violate their own religious classifications.
Added DiffLines:
** The whole ancient tech tree is a case of GameplayAndStorySegregation in itself as by the starting technologies were ubiquitous for millennia even by 4000 BC.
Added DiffLines:
** Worse than that earlier versions had AI which clearly showed that it expected to be able to stack its units.
Added DiffLines:
** Pure reproduction and conquest also doesn't account for a civilization's growth, instead it is a matter of representing assimilation. Minor peoples and tribes may implicitly occupy the 'uncultured' tiles.
Added DiffLines:
** Water mills specifically have diminishing returns to the energy extraction, a matter of annoyance in early industrial revolution when a rival opens up another factory which uses it up the river.
Added DiffLines:
** Writing predated fixed alphabets, hieroglyphics are essentially an example of a 'pre-alphabet' writing with inconsistent meanings and may have some implicit lack of standardization. Alphabet implies standardization into something consistent with glyphs of the era, no ambiguity if an ibis and reed literally refers to the bird or plant or a symbolic value. Literacy also implies enough societal resources for a substantial portion to be capable of reading instead of just an upper caste.
Added DiffLines:
** [[FridgeBrilliance If they consider it important to their strategy they'll consider it more respectable.]] Vikings thought higher of boats than horses (which were also more practical for their climate), generally European nobility have their coat of arms on shields and considered archery for trained peasants as opposed to case of Asian nobility who considered it part of their warrior identity.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
**Based on what you can do with Writing and Literature (establish embassies and build libraries, respectively), I'm going to guess that Literature is a mix of (1) a technological innovation, such as books or scrolls, that lets you keep long texts in one piece, and (2) people realizing that writing down a single book-length epic or treatises on math/science/etc. is a worthwhile thing to do. Similarly, Writing is probably (1) clay tablets, pieces of paper, or some other object invented for the specific purpose of writing on it, and (2) the idea that you can write down instructions and offers and basically anything you can say, and thus send letters to your embassy. Alphabet on its own doesn't do anything (at least not in III), so that's probably writing that's either non-portable (inscriptions on stone buildings), non-permanent (scratching marks on the ground), or single purpose (e.g., Alphabet is how to keep tax records, and it's not until Writing that they figure out how to write any word rather than a handful of specialized signs for how much taxable stuff you have and how much tax you owe).
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Not really? While early-founded religions have advantage of more "organic" growth, later ones needs direct intervention (usually by player or lucky AI) - which mirrors how Christianity and Islam came to power. In other words, adopting faith later gives you extra incentive to spread it via conquest/extensive evangelism, just like Muhammad or Christian kings of Europe did.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Fixed with the Gathering Storm Expansion
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Perhaps each represents the evolution of your nation's main language - after all, the Romans didn't speak Italian, instead speaking in Latin. Alphabet could be discovery of Latin or some other language; Writing could be the evolution into a primitive version of your nation's main tongue, and literacy could be the final evolution of said language.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** [[WildMassGuessing The leaders are]] [[Franchise/{{Highlander}} Immortals]], and ''Civilization'' is the story of if [[ThereCanBeOnlyOne The Game]] was a clash of mortal followers of an Immortal leader instead of one-on-one [[SwordFight sword fights]] [[TheMasquerade taking place in the shadows.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** The idea of the Agendas is to incentivize the AI to behave in ways that play to their strengths--in this case, by being more likely to go to war against those without a strong navy, Harald is encouraged to leverage naval supremacy in coastal raids. Notably, in the upcoming Rise and Fall expansion, Ghengis Khan's agenda does work the way you describe, disliking those who compete with him for cavalry--because he has the ability to capture enemy cavalry, so it's to his advantage to go to war with other strong cavalry Civs.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 51 (click to see context) from:
* Many players complain about historical leaders being too "gamey" in Civ5 like hating the player who goes for the same type of victory. But why? The game is not a sandbox like Europa Universalis, both player and AI has clear goals. Previous Civs were silly cause AI could willingly give away victory (f.e. with voting for you in UN). And the first game that truly tries to be competetive, with AI that wins not by accident but by achieving specific goal is not praised for a change but hated?!
to:
* Many players complain about historical leaders being too "gamey" in Civ5 [=Civ5=] like hating the player who goes for the same type of victory. But why? The game is not a sandbox like Europa Universalis, both player and AI has clear goals. Previous Civs were silly cause AI could willingly give away victory (f.e. with voting for you in UN). And the first game that truly tries to be competetive, with AI that wins not by accident but by achieving specific goal is not praised for a change but hated?!
Changed line(s) 56 (click to see context) from:
** It's good game mechanics, it helps keep the Giant Death Robot a limited unit, instead of a unit you can make 50 of on top of all your nukes. But beyond that, this is actually a case of FridgeBrilliance. You could never power a giant robot with a Deuterium-Tritium reactor, because there's very damaging radiation, and it produces heat, not electricity, it'd actually be a steam powered robot. But Helium3+Helium3 is aneutronic (neutrons are the hardest radiation to shield from, because they can create radioactive isotopes when they impact against the shield), and it can produces electricity directly, instead of via a steam turbine. How do you make Helium 3? With a fission reactor. That uranium is going to the process of nuclear alchemy to make the actual GDR fuel.
to:
** It's good game mechanics, it helps keep the Giant Death Robot a limited unit, instead of a unit you can make 50 of on top of all your nukes. But beyond that, this is actually a case of FridgeBrilliance. You could never power a giant robot with a Deuterium-Tritium reactor, because there's very damaging radiation, and it produces heat, not electricity, it'd actually be a steam powered robot. But Helium3+Helium3 [=Helium3=]+[=Helium3=] is aneutronic (neutrons are the hardest radiation to shield from, because they can create radioactive isotopes when they impact against the shield), and it can produces electricity directly, instead of via a steam turbine. How do you make Helium 3? With a fission reactor. That uranium is going to the process of nuclear alchemy to make the actual GDR fuel.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** If you have a strong navy, then Harald probably thinks of you as a WorthyOpponent.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
* Many of the leader agendas in ''Civ VI'' don't make a ton of sense. A lot of them seem to involve the leader in question liking the player if you're muscling in on their field. For example, Harald will like you more if you have a strong navy. Shouldn't he like you ''less'' if you're trying to challenge his naval supremacy?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
*** The poster didn't specify which Civ. In Civilization Revolution, you ''do'' just build the UN, no voting necessary. (And that's the Cultural Victory for it. The magic number for the ability to build it is 20: Number of settled Great People + Number of "flipped" cities (i.e., cities that become yours because they like your culture so much) + Number of Wonders built.)
Added DiffLines:
** Perhaps hyper-longevity is normal in Civ, at least in Civilization Revolution. Start a game on Chieftain, because you get a free Warrior unit from the outset in 4000 B.C.. This same unit can survive all the way to the end in 2100 A.D.. That alone is 6100 years, and we don't even know when the three people in the unit were born.
Added DiffLines:
* In Civilization Revolution, at least, three of the Techs are: Alphabet, Writing, and Literacy, each a prerequisite for the next, according to the Civlopedia. "I've got it! An alphabet! But wait, I can't make its symbols stay around... guess this alphabet is getting lost to mists of time before anyone else can even learn it!" Years pass. "Oh, hey, what if I make grooves in clay in these specific patterns? Then I can record an alphabet! ...Still can't decipher what it says, or even if it says anything..."
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Actually, I believe the ocean does not count as a ''fresh'' water source, and that a city on the coast receives less housing than one adjacent to a lake or river. But that said, it is strange that the Dead Sea gives you fresh water when the ocean does not.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** It's for gameplay purposes, but yes, it's ridiculous. I didn't know Ocean also counted; why don't they just call the benefit "water source" instead of "fresh water source"?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
added dead sea example
Added DiffLines:
* Why does the Dead Sea Natural Wonder in 6 act as a fresh water source for a city? It's in the name, its the DEAD SEA. It's much saltier than any ocean! And for that matter why does the Ocean count as fresh water either?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 33 (click to see context) from:
** It's pretty obvious that the religions in Civ 4 are meant to be CosmeticallyDifferentSides of sorts, so they avoided drawbacks for Judaism and Islam as an AcceptableBreakFromReality.
to:
** It's pretty obvious that the religions in Civ 4 are meant to be CosmeticallyDifferentSides of sorts, sorts (to avoid UnfortunateImplications and FlameBait), so they avoided drawbacks for Judaism and Islam as an AcceptableBreakFromReality.
Added DiffLines:
** A number of civilizations in the game, for all intents and purposes, don't exist in all the eras the game portrays, most obviously the United States existing in 4000 BC. It's bad enough the game would have to come up with 6000 years' worth of leaders even if they would just need one per turn early on; if it's completely unavoidable that some would be placed in the wrong era, that's another thing altogether. In any case, considering that many of the governmental forms imply there ''must'' be a succession of leaders of some kind (especially the democratic forms), you can think of the leaders as a kind of abstraction of each nation's government, or as the "God" or "guiding hand" behind each nation just as you are yours.
Added DiffLines:
** In some sense, the best solution may be something like what the spin-off Call to Power did. In C2P2, there was a limit as to how many units could be in a single square, which was greater than Civ V's one but no higher than 12.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Presumably the 'market' or the 'factory' you build is just a representation of the ''first'' market or factory that's built in that particular city.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** For the record, the AI has pursued specific win conditions in Civ IV as well.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Deleted line(s) 8,10 (click to see context) :
* In 4, the British unique unit is "Redcoat", an upgraded rifleman (Rifleman meaning a solider with a '''rifled''' firearm, as opposed to a musket.). Is this a CriticalResearchFailure or just an attempt to add more variety in what a unique unit replaces?
** I think it's more just because the 'Rifleman' unit is usually used to represent 18th/19th century gunpowder-based soldiers in general (like the Infantry unit is used to represent early-mid 20th century infantry as a whole despite looking like a UsefulNotes/WW2 era American soldier), and the Redcoat is the iconic representation of British infantry of this era; it's more like one of the AcceptableBreaksFromReality the game makes, I'd say.
*** The infamous Red Coat was in use pretty much until the turn of the 20th century, including in wars where the British most definitively had toys like Rifled firearms amongst other things. As an example: the British armies that smashed the Tsar's armies on the Crimea, the Indian Mutiny, the Zulu, and the Madhist Empire were all Redcoats.
** I think it's more just because the 'Rifleman' unit is usually used to represent 18th/19th century gunpowder-based soldiers in general (like the Infantry unit is used to represent early-mid 20th century infantry as a whole despite looking like a UsefulNotes/WW2 era American soldier), and the Redcoat is the iconic representation of British infantry of this era; it's more like one of the AcceptableBreaksFromReality the game makes, I'd say.
*** The infamous Red Coat was in use pretty much until the turn of the 20th century, including in wars where the British most definitively had toys like Rifled firearms amongst other things. As an example: the British armies that smashed the Tsar's armies on the Crimea, the Indian Mutiny, the Zulu, and the Madhist Empire were all Redcoats.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
**Persia in ''V'' represents not just the Achaemenid Empire, but the entirety of Persian history; their leader is an Achaemenid Shah, but their theme is a reimagining of ''Morq-e Sahar'', which comes from 20th century Iran, and the Immortals served as Persian honour guard up until the Islamic Revolution. It is possible that the Satrap's Court in ''V'' represents not the Achaemenid satraps, but rathers those of the Sassanids or the Safavids.
