History Headscratchers / Carrie

17th Mar '17 1:01:28 AM ritzoreo
Is there an issue? Send a Message
17th Mar '17 1:01:24 AM ritzoreo
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** First, Carrie has been bullied not by one but by many students since she started attending school, King has her recall several incidents in school and in summer camp. By then she would have a very general view on the meanness of other teenagers. Second, ''everyone'' who was present at the scene laughed -even the sympathetic teachers, so Carrie was humiliated to the point of snapping. In her overstressed mind, those who laughed were complicit in the prank.



** She's not religious, she's crazy. Her warped view on Christianity is just an outlet for her AmbiguousDisorder. Seriously, her "religion" has all the hallmarks of a psychotic delusion: It's internally consistent, persecutory (she believes God is out to punish everyone and she has to pray for forgiveness), and rationally explains irrational behavior (if God is angry at women for Original Sin, then if I don't let my daughter become a woman, God won't be angry with her.) Even her misquoting/making up Bible verses could be a sign of a thought disorder, where the words on the page and what she reads are two entirely different things. Margaret White is nothing more than a walking psychosis wrapped in the shell Christianity.

to:

** She's not religious, she's crazy. Her warped view on Christianity is just an outlet for her AmbiguousDisorder. Seriously, her "religion" has all the hallmarks of a psychotic delusion: It's internally consistent, persecutory (she believes God is out to punish everyone and she has to pray for forgiveness), and rationally explains irrational behavior (if God is angry at women for Original Sin, then if I don't let my daughter become a woman, God won't be angry with her.) Even her misquoting/making up Bible verses could be a sign of a thought disorder, where the words on the page and what she reads are two entirely different things. Margaret White is nothing more than a walking psychosis wrapped in the shell Christianity.of Christianity.
** Margaret is crazy indeed: Notice that her parents and stepfather in the book are rather normal people who aren't even described as extremely religious. She gets along very poorly with them and she even antagonizes them with her ways by writing them awful letters and refusing to see them when she has a miscarriage. Her religious views seem to be her very own without subscribing to a particular denomination; notice that unlike fundamentalist protestants, she uses a lot of conspicuous iconography. But unlike conservative Catholics she worships at home with herself (a woman) as celebrant.
12th Mar '17 3:21:59 AM ritzoreo
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

** First, in the book, Sue seems to be half-expecting that Tommy won't lend himself to her plan and even if he says yes that Carrie will possibly say no to Tommy's invitation. Later Sue writes that they were 17-18 yr old teenagers, so their decisions and plans, although perhaps well meaning, weren't so well thought. And as for the results of Tommy taking Carrie to the prom, Sue doesn't need to have the students accept Carrie, since after that night, they will all soon graduate and stop seeing each other regularly, making any acceptance scenario moot.
16th Feb '17 1:32:37 AM Nexils
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Carrie was dead at the time and it's not the kind of story that includes vengeful spirits etc. So the nightmare was probably a consequence of Sue's trauma thanks to all the deaths during prom night.

to:

** Carrie was dead at the time and it's not the kind of story that includes vengeful spirits etc. So the nightmare was probably a consequence of caused by Sue's trauma thanks to all the deaths during prom night. trauma. Most of her classmates, teachers and, of course, her own boyfriend died that night.
16th Feb '17 1:29:17 AM Nexils
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

** Carrie was dead at the time and it's not the kind of story that includes vengeful spirits etc. So the nightmare was probably a consequence of Sue's trauma thanks to all the deaths during prom night.
3rd Oct '16 10:59:12 PM shamblingdead2
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** At the very end of the book, Amelia Jenks' letter shows that she's concerned about Annie's TK only because it seems to be associated with heart trouble in the family. We'll have to imagine what a TK child raised in a small Tennessee town by a loving mother will be like later.

to:

** At the very end of the book, Amelia Jenks' letter shows that she's concerned about Annie's TK only because it seems to be associated with heart trouble in the family. [[HeroOfAnotherStory We'll have to imagine imagine]] what a TK child raised in a small Tennessee town by a loving mother will be like later.
20th Apr '16 3:15:23 AM ChrisDen
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Will it matter to the potential victims? Nobody can guarantee that it onlly takes ''years'' of torment to make a PersonOfMassDestruction snap, and that is disregarding those who might actively use the power for malicious purposes.

to:

** Will it matter to the potential victims? Nobody can guarantee that it onlly only takes ''years'' of torment to make a PersonOfMassDestruction snap, and that is disregarding those who might actively use the power for malicious purposes.



** Ah, it was just a mistake. She didn't intend to hurt anyone, she thought it would be a harmless prank. We'll talk to her, make sure she understands the consequences. I promise, nothing like that will ever happen again. Now, Chirs, you could have blown that girl's toes off. You shouldn't do that. Okay? Okay.

to:

** Ah, it was just a mistake. She didn't intend to hurt anyone, she thought it would be a harmless prank. We'll talk to her, make sure she understands the consequences. I promise, nothing like that will ever happen again. Now, Chirs, Chris, you could have blown that girl's toes off. You shouldn't do that. Okay? Okay.



** They may not have been aware of the full extent of Margaret's abuse. If Carrie is like [[TruthInTelevision most abused children]], she may have feared Margaret's retaliation if she spoke up. With no physical signs (the abuse appeared mostly emotional and verbal) and no testimony from the child, it would be very difficult to prove that any abuse had occured. Even if the prayer closet did exist, Margaret could have easily explained it away as a shrine for religious practice. Again, unless Carrie admitted that she'd been thrown into it, CPS wouldn't have any proof. And all of that is assuming that CPS was even involved; the school district could have easily revoked Margaret's homeschooling privileges without involving CPS, since homeschooling has to meet district standards of education.
* Margaret's character doesn't make sense to me. To elaborate, she's such an over-the-top psycho with all the latent horror associated with every religious fanatic stereotype that would make members of WBC cringe! First of all, she's quoting things that ''[[CriticalResearchFailure aren't even in the Bible]]'' [[hottip:*: which Carrie herself lampshades in the 2013 version]], and believes that the normal things in female biology (ie: menstral cycles, developing breasts) are either punishments or proof that you've committed sin. How the hell does a grown woman believe that having breasts is a sign that you 'weren't raised right'? Second, contrary to popular [[ReligiousStereotype "common knowledge"]], Christians don't preach that SexIsEvil. Granted, I'll let that slide a bit since ''that'' tenet of hers seems more from a FreudianExcuse than doctrine, but how does she expect the human race to perpetuate itself?! She seems to be more a case of RuleOfScary applied to TheFundamentalist than TheFundamentalist UpToEleven [[hottip:*: Okay, really she's [[TakeAThirdOption a bit of both]]. Plus, she seems for the most part to be trying to do [[WellIntentionedExtremist what's best for Carrie]], but she [[spoiler: pulls a friggin' knife on the girl and tries to murder her!]] I guess it wouldn't bug me so much if it weren't for the occasional HollywoodAtheist pointing to Margaret White as a "perfect example" of why ReligionIsEvil.

to:

** They may not have been aware of the full extent of Margaret's abuse. If Carrie is like [[TruthInTelevision most abused children]], she may have feared Margaret's retaliation if she spoke up. With no physical signs (the abuse appeared mostly emotional and verbal) and no testimony from the child, it would be very difficult to prove that any abuse had occured.occurred. Even if the prayer closet did exist, Margaret could have easily explained it away as a shrine for religious practice. Again, unless Carrie admitted that she'd been thrown into it, CPS wouldn't have any proof. And all of that is assuming that CPS was even involved; the school district could have easily revoked Margaret's homeschooling privileges without involving CPS, since homeschooling has to meet district standards of education.
* Margaret's character doesn't make sense to me. To elaborate, she's such an over-the-top psycho with all the latent horror associated with every religious fanatic stereotype that would make members of WBC cringe! First of all, she's quoting things that ''[[CriticalResearchFailure aren't even in the Bible]]'' [[hottip:*: which Carrie herself lampshades in the 2013 version]], and believes that the normal things in female biology (ie: menstral menstrual cycles, developing breasts) are either punishments or proof that you've committed sin. How the hell does a grown woman believe that having breasts is a sign that you 'weren't raised right'? Second, contrary to popular [[ReligiousStereotype "common knowledge"]], Christians don't preach that SexIsEvil. Granted, I'll let that slide a bit since ''that'' tenet of hers seems more from a FreudianExcuse than doctrine, but how does she expect the human race to perpetuate itself?! She seems to be more a case of RuleOfScary applied to TheFundamentalist than TheFundamentalist UpToEleven [[hottip:*: Okay, really she's [[TakeAThirdOption a bit of both]]. Plus, she seems for the most part to be trying to do [[WellIntentionedExtremist what's best for Carrie]], but she [[spoiler: pulls a friggin' knife on the girl and tries to murder her!]] I guess it wouldn't bug me so much if it weren't for the occasional HollywoodAtheist pointing to Margaret White as a "perfect example" of why ReligionIsEvil.



** That motivation seems plausible... but it doesn't account for her strangely emotionally detatched, manipulative actions. Again this version of Sue has very little personal contact with Carrie and seems happy to pull strings from a distance (and force her boyfriend to warm up to Carrie.) It does seem kind of creepy.

to:

** That motivation seems plausible... but it doesn't account for her strangely emotionally detatched, detached, manipulative actions. Again this version of Sue has very little personal contact with Carrie and seems happy to pull strings from a distance (and force her boyfriend to warm up to Carrie.) It does seem kind of creepy.



*** Carrie "takes in sewing" for customers/neighbours in the book, so she has a little money put away.

to:

*** Carrie "takes in sewing" for customers/neighbours customers/neighbors in the book, so she has a little money put away.



** She was REALLY that sheltered. In the movie a point is made that until very recently she was homeschooled by her mother, and it's shown that she had problems doing something as normal to any teen as browising the internet and watching videos on Youtube.

to:

** She was REALLY that sheltered. In the movie a point is made that until very recently she was homeschooled by her mother, and it's shown that she had problems doing something as normal to any teen as browising browsing the internet and watching videos on Youtube.



** Sex Education in American schools is a huge hot-button issue. Some people (mostly religious groups) are dead-set against anyone even mentioning sex to anyone else, especially kids. Others think that sex ed should start in kindegarten. While the majority opinion is somewhere in the middle (let kids know what's happening to their bodies, and educate them so they can make good decisions), it's still a rough topic, and there are still many public schools that have substandard or nonexistent sex ed programs because the public opinion is just that contentious. It's certainly possible, however unlikely, that Carrie's school in 2013 either didn't have a sex ed program, or made it optional/require parental permission, which Margaret obviously wouldn't have given. And even if the school has a sex ed program, a class is only as good as its teacher. Imagine if the principal (the same one who got queasy whenever someone said "tampon") was the only staff member deemed qualified to teach the class. He may well have completely glossed over certain aspects because he just wasn't comfortable talking about them (something which, ironically, would have been prevented if his school had a decent sex ed program. . .) There was also a time not long ago (and it may still be, I haven't really done the research) where sexual knowledge among teens was at an all-time low, because parents weren't comfortable talking to their kids about it, assuming they'd learn about it in school. But schools weren't comfortable teaching kids about sex, assuming they'd learn about it from their parents, creating a situation where no one was talking to anyone about anything.

to:

** Sex Education in American schools is a huge hot-button issue. Some people (mostly religious groups) are dead-set against anyone even mentioning sex to anyone else, especially kids. Others think that sex ed should start in kindegarten.kindergarten. While the majority opinion is somewhere in the middle (let kids know what's happening to their bodies, and educate them so they can make good decisions), it's still a rough topic, and there are still many public schools that have substandard or nonexistent sex ed programs because the public opinion is just that contentious. It's certainly possible, however unlikely, that Carrie's school in 2013 either didn't have a sex ed program, or made it optional/require parental permission, which Margaret obviously wouldn't have given. And even if the school has a sex ed program, a class is only as good as its teacher. Imagine if the principal (the same one who got queasy whenever someone said "tampon") was the only staff member deemed qualified to teach the class. He may well have completely glossed over certain aspects because he just wasn't comfortable talking about them (something which, ironically, would have been prevented if his school had a decent sex ed program. . .) There was also a time not long ago (and it may still be, I haven't really done the research) where sexual knowledge among teens was at an all-time low, because parents weren't comfortable talking to their kids about it, assuming they'd learn about it in school. But schools weren't comfortable teaching kids about sex, assuming they'd learn about it from their parents, creating a situation where no one was talking to anyone about anything.
13th Apr '16 6:19:59 AM fearlessnikki
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** It is implied in the books that Margaret is estranged from her parents precisely for that reason. In the first film, Ralph White ran off with another woman - so that explains why his relatives don't bother about her. Margaret appears to be a bit of a recluse in the 2013 film so it's believable no one would talk to her.



** Alternatively, maybe Tommy turned his phone off. If you're dancing with Chloe Moretz, it seems the sensible thing to do. Or the school had a rigorously enforced "no cell phones" policy at the dance, which would also be a sensible thing to do.

to:

** Alternatively, maybe Tommy turned his phone off. If you're dancing with Chloe Moretz, it seems the sensible thing to do. Or the school had a rigorously enforced "no cell phones" policy at the dance, which would also be a sensible thing to do.do.
** Well Tommy's seen texting Sue during the prom so presumably phones were allowed. Him turning it off for the dance is possible though.
23rd Oct '15 7:05:28 AM jmparker78
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

** Well, as for how she expected the human race to perpetuate itself, there's two answers there. One is that she probably felt the end times were upon us and that the human race wasn't meant to spread much further. However, and this is specifically addressed in the book, she did say that she and her husband would remain chaste and that "If there is issue, let it be divine." In other words, she thought that immaculate conception, a miracle that happened literally only once in the Bible, was the only way a pure follower of God would ever have children. See below about Margaret being crazy, and her religious fervor just being an outlet for her insanity.
13th Sep '15 8:13:38 AM ErikModi
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

** Sue also probably believed (not without reason) that a simple apology and offer of friendship wouldn't have been sufficient, since Carrie was meek enough to accept both whether she believed they were genuine or not, and Sue would have had no real way to demonstrate sincerity. Sure, if she wanted to make a meaningful act of contrition it might have been better to talk to Carrie with Tommy, explain that she felt horrible about what happened, and wanted to make it up to her by having Tommy take Carrie to prom, show her a good time, and let her have one nice memory of high school. But let's face it, Sue's an eighteen year old. . . they're not exactly known for carefully weighing and thinking through all their options (especially in horror movies.)
This list shows the last 10 events of 100. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Headscratchers.Carrie