History Headscratchers / BuffySeason7

9th Jul '16 6:25:00 PM Anddrix
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*** It's not so much that she's a JerkAss, it's the fact that she acts like she's a full-fledged member of the Scooby Gang when she hasn't earned it. The only reason she has any more of a voice than the rest of the Potentials is because she's sleeping with Willow. She's no more a member of the group than Wood or Andrew, the other two newcomers the season introduces. Andrew is repeatedly told to sit down and shut up, and Buffy outright tells Wood that if he tries something stupid like trying to kill Spike again, she will stand back and let him die. Wood is given more respect than Andrew, but he still never feels like he's a full-fledged member of the group. Like Andrew, he's still a low man on the totem, and the one time he tries to go outside the chain of command, he's beaten half to death by Spike and then browbeat into submission by Buffy, very effectively putting him in his place. Kennedy, however, behaves as though everyone is supposed to respect her as a full member of the group, for no other reason than because she's sleeping with Willow and, unlike Wood, she never gets put in her place for it, as though the writers themselves want us to accept her as an equal part of the group to Buffy, Xander, Spike, etc. without giving us a reason to respect her as such. Even then, if she were a particularly likeable person, that wouldn't be as big a deal, but all we ever see of her is obnoxious bitch. While the most probable cause for this is simply that she was supposed to have a larger role in the show that was cut drastically short by the impending cancellation (many parts of season 7 feel terribly rushed), that doesn't change the fact that a large part of the fanbase hates Kennedy for the fact that it feels like she effectively fucked her way into the Scooby Gang, and then immediately started acting like a bitch to all the pre-established and well-beloved characters while the writers [[CreatorsPet just looked for more ways to shove her down everyone's throat]]. She's like [[BaseBreaker Dawn]] without any of her redeeming qualities, even less justification for why she should be part of the gang, and a more commanding role despite all that.

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*** It's not so much that she's a JerkAss, it's the fact that she acts like she's a full-fledged member of the Scooby Gang when she hasn't earned it. The only reason she has any more of a voice than the rest of the Potentials is because she's sleeping with Willow. She's no more a member of the group than Wood or Andrew, the other two newcomers the season introduces. Andrew is repeatedly told to sit down and shut up, and Buffy outright tells Wood that if he tries something stupid like trying to kill Spike again, she will stand back and let him die. Wood is given more respect than Andrew, but he still never feels like he's a full-fledged member of the group. Like Andrew, he's still a low man on the totem, and the one time he tries to go outside the chain of command, he's beaten half to death by Spike and then browbeat into submission by Buffy, very effectively putting him in his place. Kennedy, however, behaves as though everyone is supposed to respect her as a full member of the group, for no other reason than because she's sleeping with Willow and, unlike Wood, she never gets put in her place for it, as though the writers themselves want us to accept her as an equal part of the group to Buffy, Xander, Spike, etc. without giving us a reason to respect her as such. Even then, if she were a particularly likeable person, that wouldn't be as big a deal, but all we ever see of her is obnoxious bitch. While the most probable cause for this is simply that she was supposed to have a larger role in the show that was cut drastically short by the impending cancellation (many parts of season 7 feel terribly rushed), that doesn't change the fact that a large part of the fanbase hates Kennedy for the fact that it feels like she effectively fucked her way into the Scooby Gang, and then immediately started acting like a bitch to all the pre-established and well-beloved characters while the writers [[CreatorsPet just looked for more ways to shove her down everyone's throat]]. She's like [[BaseBreaker Dawn]] Dawn without any of her redeeming qualities, even less justification for why she should be part of the gang, and a more commanding role despite all that.
6th Jun '16 6:00:31 AM GiggleLoop
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* Quite simple, they used the old foundations (which included the basement) and just built on top of those. So you've got the shiny new school on top and they seal off the remnants of the old building below. Re-siting the entire building would have made it much more expensive.
6th Jun '16 5:46:58 AM GiggleLoop
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** Also, The First's plan was time limited. We can pretty much assume that it was one of the Old Ones booted out of the dimension by an early Slayer and her Watchers of the time (possibly the First Slayer and the Shadow Men). Thus we can assume that The First wanted to come back into existence in this dimension by destroying the power that was keeping it there, i.e. The Slayers/Watchers. Now when Buffy was resurrected by Xander in the S1 finale, this meant that Buffy kept her powers, but was removed from the slayer line. Kendra was called, then Faith and so on. However, when the Scoobies resurrected Buffy with dark magic in the S6 premiere, this royally screwed with the Slayer line. We can only speculate here, but the fact that the First goes after the Potentials/Faith, but doesn't go for Buffy could mean that it wanted to kill her last. The theory is that if the First can kill all of the potentials, Buffy (whose 2nd resurrection had put her to the back of the Slayer line, but without the ability to call anyone after her death) would become 'The Chosen One' again, but also become the last slayer, since she had already activated her replacement (Kendra). Note that Buffy's death in S5 doesn't call another Slayer as proof of this. So basically, The First missed its chance to destroy the Slayer line, which ended up exponentially more powerful by the end, thus it gave up, seeing its chance to re-enter the dimension thwarted.



** This line was added to the motion comics and it really does bear repeating, when Kennedy guesses Willow is upset over Tara's death she says, "You know when I said I was open to a threesome I had something more fun in mind." '''''WHAAAAAAT THEEEEEE F***CK?!?!?!?!?!?!''''' 10 sins. Yes I counted them. 1 for speaking ill of the dead, 1 for doing so of the beloved Tara, 1 because it was to Willow, 1 because Willow is clearly upset, 1 for such a horrid comment, 1 for being the absolute worst time to say it, 1 for such a take that comment at Tara, 1 for the film's ad lib, 1 for ignoring earlier story, and 1 because Kennedy comes across as a total bitch.

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** This line was added to the motion comics and it really does bear repeating, when Kennedy guesses Willow is upset over Tara's death she says, "You know when I said I was open to a threesome I had something more fun in mind." '''''WHAAAAAAT THEEEEEE F***CK?!?!?!?!?!?!''''' F***CK‽''''' 10 sins. Yes I counted them. 1 for speaking ill of the dead, 1 for doing so of the beloved Tara, 1 because it was to Willow, 1 because Willow is clearly upset, 1 for such a horrid comment, 1 for being the absolute worst time to say it, 1 for such a take that comment at Tara, 1 for the film's ad lib, 1 for ignoring earlier story, and 1 because Kennedy comes across as a total bitch.
18th May '16 4:09:21 AM Morgenthaler
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* I was a little taken aback by Buffy's whole if you kill a human your effectively a monster when she was trying to convince Willow to stand down, she seems to forget the whole [[KnightsTemplar Knight of Byzantine]] attack on the RV in Season 5 where she killed like 10 of them who happened to be human, now it was in self defense, but so was Willow killing Warren in a sense that Warren wouldn't have stopped trying to kill them until he was dead or in jail, considering the fact that he killed Tara and with-out Willow's intervention Buffy would've died as well, showing that it doesn't take magic or strength to get the drop on them. That's not taking into account that the Knights of Byzantine who to everyone else but the Scoobies and the viewers would be considered the heroes, trying to kill a person who technically didn't exist up until 4 months before that, in order to pretty much save the universe. As for her whole let the human justice system take care of Warren, Jonathan, and Andrew just seemed like she was holding the ConflictBall right there, they were dealing with demons and magic the whole season, they never had a problem dealing with magically inclined humans before, I mean look at Amy's step-mom, the got turned into a living cheerleader trophy, or the kid who sold Buffy out to Spike to get turned into a vampire, she let him there to die and he did. All those things can be hand-waved in saying that they were eliminating threats to the safety of humanity,y'know their job, but Willow kills a triple murderer/attempted rapist, and magical heroin dealer and people were expecting her to feel Angel level guilt, theres also the fact that Season 7 takes place months after the end of Season 6, who's to say that Willow wasn't damn near catatonic for weeks dealing with what she had done, what she had become, plus the epic levels of grief that got the rampage ball rolling to begin with. And i mean no one wanted to watch Willow staring at the ceiling, reliving the death of Tara, and killing Warren over and over again while crying her eyes out, it would've been more depressing than the show had already become up to that point. I also think she gets a pass on the whole guilt thing anyway considering her first major appearance in Season 7 has her ending up facing an enemy she's powerless against, shes paralyzed and forced to watch a demon "flay" strips of her skin off and then eating it, now it didn't get very far, because again it would just be awful to watch, still very LaserGuidedKarma-ish , confusing in that in-universe its never brought up as such, they never show it giving Willow insight into Warrens last seconds, but still you've just been partially eaten alive, who wants to deal with a you deserved it speech. As to those who say Willow is unrepentant they must have missed the part where she is talking to Giles when she says that she thought he brought her to England to kill her or throw her in a magical prison and throw away the key, so she went with him voluntarily where she was near certain there was a punishment awaiting her, it was only because of Giles' seeing her inherent goodness that she wasn't.

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* I was a little taken aback by Buffy's whole if you kill a human your effectively a monster when she was trying to convince Willow to stand down, she seems to forget the whole [[KnightsTemplar [[KnightTemplar Knight of Byzantine]] attack on the RV in Season 5 where she killed like 10 of them who happened to be human, now it was in self defense, but so was Willow killing Warren in a sense that Warren wouldn't have stopped trying to kill them until he was dead or in jail, considering the fact that he killed Tara and with-out Willow's intervention Buffy would've died as well, showing that it doesn't take magic or strength to get the drop on them. That's not taking into account that the Knights of Byzantine who to everyone else but the Scoobies and the viewers would be considered the heroes, trying to kill a person who technically didn't exist up until 4 months before that, in order to pretty much save the universe. As for her whole let the human justice system take care of Warren, Jonathan, and Andrew just seemed like she was holding the ConflictBall right there, they were dealing with demons and magic the whole season, they never had a problem dealing with magically inclined humans before, I mean look at Amy's step-mom, the got turned into a living cheerleader trophy, or the kid who sold Buffy out to Spike to get turned into a vampire, she let him there to die and he did. All those things can be hand-waved in saying that they were eliminating threats to the safety of humanity,y'know their job, but Willow kills a triple murderer/attempted rapist, and magical heroin dealer and people were expecting her to feel Angel level guilt, theres also the fact that Season 7 takes place months after the end of Season 6, who's to say that Willow wasn't damn near catatonic for weeks dealing with what she had done, what she had become, plus the epic levels of grief that got the rampage ball rolling to begin with. And i mean no one wanted to watch Willow staring at the ceiling, reliving the death of Tara, and killing Warren over and over again while crying her eyes out, it would've been more depressing than the show had already become up to that point. I also think she gets a pass on the whole guilt thing anyway considering her first major appearance in Season 7 has her ending up facing an enemy she's powerless against, shes paralyzed and forced to watch a demon "flay" strips of her skin off and then eating it, now it didn't get very far, because again it would just be awful to watch, still very LaserGuidedKarma-ish , confusing in that in-universe its never brought up as such, they never show it giving Willow insight into Warrens last seconds, but still you've just been partially eaten alive, who wants to deal with a you deserved it speech. As to those who say Willow is unrepentant they must have missed the part where she is talking to Giles when she says that she thought he brought her to England to kill her or throw her in a magical prison and throw away the key, so she went with him voluntarily where she was near certain there was a punishment awaiting her, it was only because of Giles' seeing her inherent goodness that she wasn't.
24th Apr '16 5:41:47 PM tsstevens
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* '''Empty Places'''
24th Apr '16 5:38:40 PM tsstevens
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* Redone from the Analysis page, Everything Wrong With Kennedy in, say, two minutes, minus sins taken off for when Kennedy does work.
* '''Bring On The Night'''
** Kennedy's first reaction of Buffy is clear disdain. 1 sin.
** Kennedy demanding weapons, okay now she's getting bratty. 1 sin.
* '''Show Time'''
** Kennedy pestering Willow, then trying to get her to do magic while hitting on her. I'm sure it was meant to be sweet but given how much she bragged, 2 sins.
** At the end it's shown Kennedy approves of Buffy's approach and is going to take it to heart. We don't know at the time but this is going to go very very wrong. The fact she seems to be a military buff (see later) one would think the Buffster quoting Richard Marcinko and taking a Hell Week approach should have been a big clue. 1 sin.
* '''The Killer In Me'''
** Kennedy faking sick so she can court Willow. Buffy did the same thing, so just 1 sin.
** Make that 2, with the ''mission'' to try and seduce her.
** Kennedy should really know better than to be this confrontational on homosexuality, 1 sin.
** I'm going to give her the benefit of the doubt and guess she was joking about date rape, 3 sins. One for suggesting it, one for joking about it, and one for the possibility she may not have been.
** 1 sin for thinking turning into Warren is funny. She may not have had context but I'm counting it.
** 2 sins when she meets the Wiccan group, 1 for insulting them, 1 for her open distaste of magic when she wants Willow.
** Not Kennedy related, ha ha ha ha ha. I really liked Giles asking if he's evil for taking girls camping and not touching them. -1 sin for him.
** When Willow storms in with the gun Kennedy does what anyone worth their salt would do and immediately goes caring and try to talk down the murder/suicide. Then she immediately drops it bragging how good she is. 1 sin.
* '''Get It Done'''
** Oh boy this is gonna suck. 1 sin right off the bat.
** Kennedy helping the other potentials train is okay. Her leading them thinking she's Sergeant Hartman, not so much. 1 sin for this and 1 sin for this being in promos, given hindsight.
** 1 sin for picking on Chloe. You know if she had done any research on Full Metal Jacket she would have seen that who she is emulating is a bully and a failure. So 2 more sins for this, and 1 more for not doing the research.
** Then she brags about picking on Chloe and being a bully and failure, how charmingly sickening, 3 sins. It's a shame Jack Bauer didn't follow Wayne Palmer from 24 just to kick the shit out of Kennedy for this, 1 sin.
** "Who the hell are you?" He's the President so shut your mouth before CTU nuke your ass. 1 sin for the comment and another for acting this way in Buffy's home.
** Enough with the drill sergeant nasty shit already. 2 sins, 1 for the attitude and 1 for not getting the hint the first time.
** Gotta admit, The First has a point. 1 sin.
** Even though it's partially Kennedy's fault she's right in the way Buffy is acting. F*ck it, 1 sin.
** 1 sin again for the magic bashing.
* '''Empty Places'''
* '''Touched'''
** Kennedy apologizing when trying to take command may get her -1 sin. Wait...
** ...she blows it. Maybe she would like to see if she could do a better job. 1 sin.
* '''Chosen'''
** I'm 99% certain that Giles, Dawn and Buffy wanting to throw up at the tongue comment was a nod to the fans, -1 sin for each of them.
* Talley: 31
* Punishment: "It's a total loss of control, and not in a nice, wholesome, my girlfriend has a pierced tongue kind of way." *cue Giles, Dawn and Buffy throwing up*
* We could leave it there, but the comics are canon even if some fans don't count them. I'll go over the ones I have.
* '''Time Of Your Life'''
** Kennedy getting jealous that Buffy may have gone gay and go for Willow, and threatening to kill her, was just off and out of left field. 2 sins.
** What's with the vamp face after sleeping with Willow. 1 sin.
** The end. Very inappropriate comment at the worst of times. 2 sins.
* '''Anywhere But Here'''
** This line was added to the motion comics and it really does bear repeating, when Kennedy guesses Willow is upset over Tara's death she says, "You know when I said I was open to a threesome I had something more fun in mind." '''''WHAAAAAAT THEEEEEE F***********CK?!?!?!?!?!?!''''' 10 sins. Yes I counted them. 1 for speaking ill of the dead, 1 for doing so of the beloved Tara, 1 because it was to Willow, 1 because Willow is clearly upset, 1 for such a horrid comment, 1 for being the absolute worst time to say it, 1 for such a take that comment at Tara, 1 for the film's ad lib, 1 for ignoring earlier story, and 1 because Kennedy comes across as a total bitch.
* '''Swell'''
** Okay, Satsu being bratty doesn't entitle Kennedy to be as well. 1 sin.
** This whole thing with her being upset about turning straight people gay really needs to stop. 1 sin.
* '''Guarded'''
** I have no quarrel with Kennedy trying to speak some hard truths to Buffy here. Until she starts acting bratty. 1 sin.
** Bop! Kennedy could have lost another sin for saying about thinking about the little guy, but then ruins it by bringing up Giles. I'd add a sin but Buffy beats me to the punch.
* '''The Core'''
** So just what was Kennedy doing since getting Buffy and co to where they needed? Looking for another girl? That's exactly what she did and is trying to recruit Faith. Cool, but where was she when she could have been needed? Gun wielding Slayer against gun wielding Slayer, someone dropped the ball. 1 sin.
* '''Where The River Meets The Sea'''
** Kennedy should have known Faith wouldn't have RTFM. On the one hand she's more mature, and when she lets her emotions overtake common sense it's altruistic these days. But it's Faith, 1 sin.
* Talley: 20
* Punishment: "It's bullshit!"
27th Dec '15 2:13:54 PM SeptimusHeap
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* In "The Killer in Me", what appears to be a dead man walks into a gun shop with no ID or Handgun Safety Certificate, picks out a gun and buys it without a method of payment, and immediately walks off with it without filling out a single form or waiting ten days. Now, the entire episode is a DarthWiki/WallBanger, even by [[SeasonalRot Season 7 standards]], but how the hell does ''this'' happen? Is the gun dealer somehow affected by the spell cast on Willow? There's no obvious reason to believe he is... other than that he sold the gun.

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* In "The Killer in Me", what appears to be a dead man walks into a gun shop with no ID or Handgun Safety Certificate, picks out a gun and buys it without a method of payment, and immediately walks off with it without filling out a single form or waiting ten days. Now, the entire episode is a DarthWiki/WallBanger, even by [[SeasonalRot Season 7 standards]], but how How the hell does ''this'' happen? Is the gun dealer somehow affected by the spell cast on Willow? There's no obvious reason to believe he is... other than that he sold the gun.
26th Dec '15 12:42:28 PM SeanRenaud
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*** The Bringers never display super human feats and the First never displays having any being more powerful than Caleb and we're not truly certain just how powerful he actually is additionally he can only be in one place at any given time. Not only would spreading them out and hiding them have forced the Bringers to stay spread out but there is ultimately no 'being ready' for a zerg rush. The Bringers at any time could have just molotoved the Buffy residence and only Willow would stand any realistic chance of thwarting forty or more bringers intent on killing a few dozen mostly helpless girls. The only true upside is the hope that the next slayer is in the room and unwounded and aware of her power nearly immediately.
24th Dec '15 6:12:04 AM DarkWillow
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***** The above is plain wrong, it's been established on both series that True Demons are vastly more powerful (and larger) than the demons on Earth, all of which are 'tainted' or hybrids in some way.


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***** Illyria wasn't just close to an Old One, she was on of the most powerful Old Ones of the Primordium Age. She was one of the monarchs of that age, as Wesley finds out. When she was resurrected she had limited control over time itself, nearly impenetrable armour, the ability to open dimensional gates at will among other powers - and this wasn't even Illyria at full strength. In her true form she was also around 30ft high, adding almost unstoppable physical power/strength to the mix. Not all the Old Ones were as powerful, but True Demons (Old Ones) do not exist on Earth. They clearly had varying power levels, but a lot of them were so powerful death wasn't the end for them, as Drogyn tells Angel and Spike.


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****** The (canonical) comics have hinted at a greater role for humans in the defeat of the Old Ones than was previously thought. Nobody really knows what happened, but one version is that human Mages gradually overcame the Old Ones. They had depleted themselves so much by in-fighting that they were taken by surprise by the numerically superior and magically capable humans. They could kill us by the hundreds, but they still lost the war in the end.
24th Dec '15 5:52:32 AM DarkWillow
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* Throughout the series, but particularly in S7, Buffy is shown to have a strong sense of right and wrong in terms of her own personal views, but also unwavering loyalty to friends. So when a friend crosses Buffy's self-imposed line, she redraws it because it's Willow. Only a few episodes later she decides another friend (Anya) is irredeemable because she's returned to being a Vengeance Demon. Xander quite rightly calls this out as the bullshit it is - Willow is allowed redemption, but Anya has to die? Because Buffy says so? Later in the season Buffy's superiority complex regarding Slayers and the inferiority complex she has about it (as Holden points out in Conversations with Dead People) comes to the fore. Buffy believes herself to be The Law when it comes to right and wrong, but also that being THE (not 'a') Slayer makes her the ideal leader. She goes so far as to say her little gang is not a democracy and that because she's the Slayer, they all have to fall in line. So when everyone essentially goes 'ummm...NO' she can't deal with it. Buffy's psychology is at times contradictory and very naive, but it's consistent all the way through the series.
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