History Headscratchers / Arrow

20th Feb '17 11:31:57 PM bigfatcarp93
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** Lyla makes the argument that John isn't thinking clearly out of guilt, and she is correct. Furthermore, John has a son to think of; he doesn't have the luxury of being allowed to sit in prison boo-hoo-hooing, not when he and those closest to him know full well that he's innocent. As far as Lyla and Ollie are concerned, Dig's obviously family, and sometimes family's job is to do what's best for you when you're full of shit.
16th Feb '17 1:01:43 PM Discar
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** It's pretty common to give friends and family members key roles in your administration. Heavily frowned upon, but not actually illegal. The fact that Thea is good at her job (arguably better than Oliver) probably helped smooth out some of the public problems with the appointment.
16th Feb '17 8:09:27 AM Tsar673
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14th Feb '17 2:51:40 PM ShorinBJ
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** I think a big problem is down to miscasting combined with trying to have Canary's origin told over the course of the series. Katie Cassady isn't really a bad actress, but she's ill-fitted for the role and lacks any chemistry with most of the cast, while they gave her a pretty basic characterization that didn't really click with audiences. Combine that with them then introducing Felicity and Sara, both whom had much more interesting personalities, better actors who had stronger chemistry with Oliver and the other characters, and both served a use to the plot rather than the TrappedByMountainLions and DesignatedDamsel roles Laurel got, it turned audiences against her.

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** I think a big problem is down to miscasting combined with trying to have Canary's origin told over the course of the series. Katie Cassady Cassidy isn't really a bad actress, but she's ill-fitted for the role and lacks any chemistry with most of the cast, while they gave her a pretty basic characterization that didn't really click with audiences. Combine that with them then introducing Felicity and Sara, both whom had much more interesting personalities, better actors who had stronger chemistry with Oliver and the other characters, and both served a use to the plot rather than the TrappedByMountainLions and DesignatedDamsel roles Laurel got, it turned audiences against her.



*** She ''is'' the canon Black Canary. The Black Canary's full name in the comics is Dinah Laurel Lance, same as here, she's romantically linked to Green Arrow, and she has her Canary cry, albeit not technological in the comics. So her biographical details are a little different -- that happens in adaptations. She was introduced specifically to BE Black Canary. From the pilot onward, she was ''always'' going to be Black Canary, not this woman who doesn't even exist in the comics. Also, where do you get the idea that Oliver should have a free pass for ''sleeping with her sister'' when they were together, just because he (for all she knew) spent five years on an extended camping trip? That's the kind of thing that you expect to earn you undying hatred, yet she eventually does forgive him. Likewise, guess what? Sleeping with your sister's boyfriend is a little more than a "mistake." It's an incredibly cruel thing to do. And she forgives Sara for that, too. Her behavior in the first season is a hundred percent justified. She goes off the rails in the second season, but then gets better. I think you have an incredibly skewed view of this character.



** Also addressing why Laurel - now she's becoming the Black Canary - is so different from the original character. Essentially the show was meant to be her origin story but was one misstep after another. In Season 1 they locked her into a toxic OfficialCouple relationship with Oliver, and had her cause the death of her more popular LoveInterest Tommy. (Yes, as said she was trying to help people by getting those files, but ultimately they're just ''files'', not people like Roy was trying to save, and your common sense really should kick in when the buildings falling down and Quentin, Moira and Oliver all told her to get the hell out of there). In Season 2, they made her highly unlikable compared to characters like Sara and Oliver who suffered far worse without becoming so whiny. The show essentially moved on without her and she was unnecessary to the plot. So by the time Season 3 rolled around and they returned to their Black Canary plan they had 1) A highly, highly unlikable character who contributed nothing apart from maybe her law expertise and 2) A much more popular, skilled and complex Canary in Sara. Instead of keeping Sara or fixing Laurel's characterization/position slowly, they killed off Sara whipped Laurel into the Canary position in half a season, while the memory of hated Laurel from Season 1 and 2 was still present in everyone's mind. Poor characterization and plotlines, and a rushed journey resulted in Laurel's disconnect from the original vision of The Black Canary character.

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** Also addressing why Laurel - now she's becoming the Black Canary - is so different from the original character. Essentially the show was meant to be her origin story but was one misstep after another. In Season 1 they locked her into a toxic OfficialCouple relationship with Oliver, and had her cause the death of her more popular LoveInterest Tommy. (Yes, as said she was trying to help people by getting those files, but ultimately they're just ''files'', not people like Roy was trying to save, and your common sense really should kick in when the buildings building's falling down and Quentin, Moira and Oliver all told her to get the hell out of there). In Season 2, they made her highly unlikable compared to characters like Sara and Oliver who suffered far worse without becoming so whiny. The show essentially moved on without her and she was unnecessary to the plot. So by the time Season 3 rolled around and they returned to their Black Canary plan they had 1) A highly, highly unlikable character who contributed nothing apart from maybe her law expertise and 2) A much more popular, skilled and complex Canary in Sara. Instead of keeping Sara or fixing Laurel's characterization/position slowly, they killed off Sara whipped Laurel into the Canary position in half a season, while the memory of hated Laurel from Season 1 and 2 was still present in everyone's mind. Poor characterization and plotlines, and a rushed journey resulted in Laurel's disconnect from the original vision of The Black Canary character.



* Isn't the logic behind Oliver revealing Laurel's identity at her funeral highly flawed? He does it in the name of protecting her legacy. Which makes sense in the immediately context of the episode, but not so much if one really thinks about it. Consider this - Laurel was an ADA who was involved in the prosecution of probably hundreds of criminals. Now that its known that she moonlighted as a vigilante, wouldn't that taint all the cases she handled, especially ones in which the Black Canary or any other member of Team Arrow were involved in the apprehension of the perpetrator? Wouldn't anyone she got convicted have reasonable grounds for appealing - after all, if the ADA was willing to take the law into her own hands by beating criminals to a pulp, who's to say she wouldn't have stooped to evidence tampering? Not to mention, revealing Laurel's identity puts Quentin Lance, who's already potentially facing some kind of official action over his involvement with Darkh, on even shakier legal ground. To what extent can the good captain's arrests (or any initiative undertaken by him at SCPD) be considered legit if his own daughter was a vigilante (and its doubtful he didn't know about it)? What the reveal essentially leads to is dozens, if not hundreds of criminals, back on the streets because of the tarnished reputations of a prominent ADA and police officer. In trying to safeguard Laurel's legacy, Oliver might have destroyed it.

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* Isn't the logic behind Oliver revealing Laurel's identity at her funeral highly flawed? He does it in the name of protecting her legacy. Which makes sense in the immediately context of the episode, but not so much if one really thinks about it. Consider this - Laurel was an ADA who was involved in the prosecution of probably hundreds of criminals. Now that its it's known that she moonlighted as a vigilante, wouldn't that taint all the cases she handled, especially ones in which the Black Canary or any other member of Team Arrow were involved in the apprehension of the perpetrator? Wouldn't anyone she got convicted have reasonable grounds for appealing - after all, if the ADA was willing to take the law into her own hands by beating criminals to a pulp, who's to say she wouldn't have stooped to evidence tampering? Not to mention, revealing Laurel's identity puts Quentin Lance, who's already potentially facing some kind of official action over his involvement with Darkh, on even shakier legal ground. To what extent can the good captain's arrests (or any initiative undertaken by him at SCPD) be considered legit if his own daughter was a vigilante (and its doubtful he didn't know about it)? What the reveal essentially leads to is dozens, if not hundreds of criminals, back on the streets because of the tarnished reputations of a prominent ADA and police officer. In trying to safeguard Laurel's legacy, Oliver might have destroyed it.
14th Feb '17 2:32:59 PM ShorinBJ
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* Why is Verdant still a popular nightclub? Its known to be owned by Ollie and Thea and clearly the city isn't drawing a distinction between them and their mother as evidenced by the reception Ollie got at the hospital, so why are people still going there night after night?

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* Why is Verdant still a popular nightclub? Its It's known to be owned by Ollie and Thea and clearly the city isn't drawing a distinction between them and their mother as evidenced by the reception Ollie got at the hospital, so why are people still going there night after night?



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[[folder:Prototye]][[folder:Prototype]]
14th Feb '17 2:28:28 PM ShorinBJ
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** An unshaven chin is hardly an uncommon characteristic. But, possibly FridgeBrillaince: Ollie wanted to leave small, unprovable breadcrumbs to make the police catch on, so he could then disprove them. He only did this around one officer, who had a personal vendetta against him, so it could be explained away by the police as Lance mis-remembering these details in order to convince himself that it was Oliver, as happens with real eye-witness testimony.

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** An unshaven chin is hardly an uncommon characteristic. But, possibly FridgeBrillaince: FridgeBrilliance: Ollie wanted to leave small, unprovable breadcrumbs to make the police catch on, so he could then disprove them. He only did this around one officer, who had a personal vendetta against him, so it could be explained away by the police as Lance mis-remembering these details in order to convince himself that it was Oliver, as happens with real eye-witness testimony.
14th Feb '17 2:54:22 AM themadfiles
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**Yes, yes it is.
13th Feb '17 3:36:09 PM speyeker
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[[/folder]]
[[folder: Nepotism in the mayor's office in season 5]]
* So Oliver Queen is now the mayor of Star City...and he's hired his sister as his chief secretary? Isn't that nepotism, pure and simple?
11th Feb '17 4:03:26 PM immortalfrieza
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[[/folder]]
[[folder: Diggle wants to be in prison! So let's break him out!]]
* What exactly are Lyla and Oliver THINKING when they broke John out of prison? Not only does he WANT to remain in jail (which makes how easily John just goes with it when Oliver shows up nonsensical) but there had to be at ''least'' 50 different perfectly legal avenues that they could have used to gotten him out to try first before they resorted to that, especially with the director of ARGUS being his wife. If they had at least established previously that he was in danger from his Commander trying to get him killed while Dig was in prison it would make sense, but there's nothing that gives any indication they were under any sort of pressure to get him out. Lyla jumped straight to "BREAK JOHN OUT!!!" and Oliver is like "Okay", that was the extent of the conversation.
9th Feb '17 10:20:27 PM immortalfrieza
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** I can't see any actual reason either. I could maybe see the team looking to exploit the idol's powers themselves for some new magical threat of the week showing up, but the flashback scenes make it painfully clear Oliver knows EXACTLY what the idol is, what it does, and how it takes lives to fuel it, making that a ridiculous plot hole. The fact that they hid one of the pieces to keep it from working makes it even more ridiculous that they didn't just grind the thing into dust and scatter the dust to the four corners of the world.




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** My question is why they don't ever just put in sound filters in their ears so the entire team isn't incapacitated at the same time as the bad guys every single time she ever used it.
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