History Fridge / TheWestWing

16th Jan '17 3:52:24 AM 06tele
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** On the other hand, on first glance it seems that Bartlet won the debate by being, and seeming, smarter than Ritchie. This is indeed not very convincing, since no president has ever got elected by seeming smarter than the other guy. But that's not actually what Bartlet does. What Ritchie does in the debate is set out his stall with his folksy charm and his familiar slogans about "the ingenuity of the American people", etc., at the same time making little digs at "Eskimo poetry". What Bartlet then does is not try to make Ritchie look stupid: he makes Ritchie look like a ''liar'', suggesting that Ritchie deliberately fudges issues in order to play to his base, and ignores anything that isn't convenient to his argument. When Ritchie talks about getting rid of partisan politics, Bartlet points out that this itself a political strategy, and that the supposedly bipartisan Ritchie used the word "liberal" 74 times the previous day. The elitist intellectual Bartlet uses BrutalHonesty to ruin Ritchie's image as a plain speaker, making him look shifty, careerist and duplicitous. And ''that'' is how Bartlet won.[[note]]Bartlet even has the nerve to describe Ritchie as a "career politician", which he presumably justifies to himself because he thinks of himself as a career academic from a famous political family who somehow just happened to become governor of New Hampshire.[[/note]]

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** On the other hand, on first glance it seems that Bartlet won the debate by being, and seeming, smarter than Ritchie. This is indeed not very convincing, since no president has ever got elected by seeming smarter than the other guy. But that's not actually what Bartlet does. What Ritchie does in the debate is set out his stall with his folksy charm and his familiar slogans about "the ingenuity of the American people", etc., at the same time making little digs at "Eskimo poetry". What Bartlet then does is not try to make Ritchie look stupid: he makes Ritchie look like a ''liar'', suggesting that Ritchie deliberately fudges issues in order to play to his base, and ignores anything that isn't convenient to his argument. When Ritchie talks about getting rid of partisan politics, Bartlet points out that this itself a political strategy, and that the supposedly bipartisan Ritchie used the word "liberal" 74 times the previous day. The elitist intellectual Bartlet uses BrutalHonesty to ruin Ritchie's image as a plain speaker, making him look shifty, careerist and duplicitous.duplicitous, and making himself look like the guy who is not afraid to tell America the truth. And ''that'' is how Bartlet won.[[note]]Bartlet even has the nerve to describe Ritchie as a "career politician", which he presumably justifies to himself because he thinks of himself as a career academic from a famous political family who somehow just happened to become governor of New Hampshire.[[/note]]
16th Jan '17 3:49:32 AM 06tele
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** Another West Wing example: while this troper always has thought Bartlet's demolition of Ritchie during the season 4 debate was a CrowningMomentOfAwesome, she also felt that it needed a little WillingSuspensionOfDisbelief for Bartlet's incredibly smart-alecky remarks to be acceptable for political debate. Then later, putting together Bartlet's other public moments in earlier episodes, the episode "Let Bartlet Be Bartlet", the charge in "Manchester Part II" about raising the level of debate in the country, the summer-long gap between seasons 3 and 4; and Josh's remark that Bartlet was going to look arrogant no matter what, and they should just focus on making sure no one started demanding he act less arrogant; it hit her: [[StatusQuoIsGod status quo is not God:]] Bartlet, in the minds of regular people who don't work in the White House, must have been socially revolutionary; he must have been the very President who ''changed all the norms we, in the real-life universe, accept about political etiquette.'' After all, nothing Bartlet said would have been unacceptably snarky in, say, ''British'' politics, would it?
** On first glance it seems that Bartlet won the debate by being, and seeming, smarter than Ritchie, but on closer examination, that's not what happens, and it wouldn't have been very convincing, since no president has ever got elected by seeming smarter than the other guy. What Ritchie does is set out his stall with his folksy charm and his familiar slogans about "the ingenuity of the American people", etc., at the same time making little digs at "Eskimo poetry". What Bartlet then does is not suggest that Ritchie doesn't understand what he's talking about: he suggests that Ritchie is deliberately fudging the issues in order to play to his base, and ignoring anything that isn't convenient to his argument. When Ritchie talks about getting rid of partisan politics, Bartlet points out that this itself a political strategy, and that the supposedly non-partisan Ritchie used the word "liberal" 74 times the previous day. The supposedly elitist intellectual Bartlet uses BrutalHonesty to make Ritchie look shifty, careerist and duplicitous. And ''that'' is how Bartlet won.[[note]]Bartlet even has the nerve to describe Ritchie as a "career politician", which he presumably justifies to himself because he thinks of himself as a career academic from a famous political family who just happened to become the governor of New Hampshire.[[/note]]

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** Another West Wing example: while * While this troper always has thought Bartlet's demolition of Ritchie during the season 4 debate was a CrowningMomentOfAwesome, she also felt that it needed a little WillingSuspensionOfDisbelief for Bartlet's incredibly smart-alecky remarks to be acceptable for political debate. Then later, putting together Bartlet's other public moments in earlier episodes, the episode "Let Bartlet Be Bartlet", the charge in "Manchester Part II" about raising the level of debate in the country, the summer-long gap between seasons 3 and 4; and Josh's remark Josh quoting Toby that Bartlet was going to look arrogant no matter what, and they should just focus on making sure no one started demanding he act less arrogant; it hit her: [[StatusQuoIsGod status quo is not God:]] Bartlet, in the minds of regular people who don't work in the White House, must have been socially revolutionary; he must have been the very President who ''changed all the norms we, in the real-life universe, accept about political etiquette.'' After all, nothing Bartlet said would have been unacceptably snarky in, say, ''British'' politics, would it?
** On the other hand, on first glance it seems that Bartlet won the debate by being, and seeming, smarter than Ritchie, but on closer examination, that's Ritchie. This is indeed not what happens, and it wouldn't have been very convincing, since no president has ever got elected by seeming smarter than the other guy. But that's not actually what Bartlet does. What Ritchie does in the debate is set out his stall with his folksy charm and his familiar slogans about "the ingenuity of the American people", etc., at the same time making little digs at "Eskimo poetry". What Bartlet then does is not suggest try to make Ritchie look stupid: he makes Ritchie look like a ''liar'', suggesting that Ritchie doesn't understand what he's talking about: he suggests that Ritchie is deliberately fudging the fudges issues in order to play to his base, and ignoring ignores anything that isn't convenient to his argument. When Ritchie talks about getting rid of partisan politics, Bartlet points out that this itself a political strategy, and that the supposedly non-partisan bipartisan Ritchie used the word "liberal" 74 times the previous day. The supposedly elitist intellectual Bartlet uses BrutalHonesty to make Ritchie ruin Ritchie's image as a plain speaker, making him look shifty, careerist and duplicitous. And ''that'' is how Bartlet won.[[note]]Bartlet even has the nerve to describe Ritchie as a "career politician", which he presumably justifies to himself because he thinks of himself as a career academic from a famous political family who somehow just happened to become the governor of New Hampshire.[[/note]]
16th Jan '17 3:39:00 AM 06tele
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Added DiffLines:

** On first glance it seems that Bartlet won the debate by being, and seeming, smarter than Ritchie, but on closer examination, that's not what happens, and it wouldn't have been very convincing, since no president has ever got elected by seeming smarter than the other guy. What Ritchie does is set out his stall with his folksy charm and his familiar slogans about "the ingenuity of the American people", etc., at the same time making little digs at "Eskimo poetry". What Bartlet then does is not suggest that Ritchie doesn't understand what he's talking about: he suggests that Ritchie is deliberately fudging the issues in order to play to his base, and ignoring anything that isn't convenient to his argument. When Ritchie talks about getting rid of partisan politics, Bartlet points out that this itself a political strategy, and that the supposedly non-partisan Ritchie used the word "liberal" 74 times the previous day. The supposedly elitist intellectual Bartlet uses BrutalHonesty to make Ritchie look shifty, careerist and duplicitous. And ''that'' is how Bartlet won.[[note]]Bartlet even has the nerve to describe Ritchie as a "career politician", which he presumably justifies to himself because he thinks of himself as a career academic from a famous political family who just happened to become the governor of New Hampshire.[[/note]]
8th Nov '16 7:27:04 AM DoctorNemesis
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Added DiffLines:

** One might also consider that Josh is a gunshot victim. If anyone has a reason to be squeamish around blood, hospitals and major surgical procedures, he does.
8th Nov '16 7:25:21 AM DoctorNemesis
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** With regard to Leo's funeral, he probably ''was'' there; we just didn't see him. There were a ''lot'' of people paying their respects in that church.

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** With regard to Leo's funeral, he Sam probably ''was'' there; we just didn't see him. There were a ''lot'' of people paying their respects in that church.
18th Oct '16 5:47:46 PM DoctorNemesis
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* In the second half of "In the shadow of two Gunmen," when Bartlet [[spoiler: comes to see Josh when he's at the airport waiting for his flight after his father died]], three Secret Service agents walk into shot, one at a time. That was the night President Bartlet won the Illinois primary and became the Democratic nominee; it was probably the first time he had Secret Service protection.

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* In the second half of "In the shadow of two Gunmen," when Bartlet [[spoiler: comes to see Josh when he's at the airport waiting for his flight after his father died]], three Secret Service agents walk into shot, one at a time. That was the night President Bartlet won the Illinois primary and became the Democratic nominee; it was probably the first time he had Secret Service protection.protection.
* In Season 5, when Will goes to work for the new Vice President to become his Chief of Staff and eventual campaign manager, several of the senior staff (particularly Toby) react with betrayal as if he's abandoning them. In addition to his arguments about considering the future of the government, however, consider that Will has both worked at the White House for a shorter time than the rest of the senior staff has and, for a significant portion of that time there, has encountered quite a lot of hazing, mind games (such as his first encounter with the President) and general condescension. It's perhaps not such a huge surprise that he might not view working for the current administration with the same starry-eyed idealism as they do or feel particularly attached to staying there and 'completing' the job.
7th Jul '16 8:45:08 AM Daltonia
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* In the second half of "In the shadow of two Gunmen," when Bartlet [[spoiler: comes to see Josh when he's at the airport waiting for his flight after his father died]], three Secret Service agents walk into shot, one at a time. That was the night President Bartlet won the Illinois primary and became the Democratic nominee; it was probably the first time he had Secret Service protection.
* In "The U.S. Poet Laureate" Bartlet calls Ritchie a ".22 caliber mind in a .357 magnum world", pretending not to realise that he was on air to get the insult out there. By using a gun metaphor, he avoids any chance of the remark backfiring as liberal snobbery.

to:

* In the second half of "In the shadow of two Gunmen," when Bartlet [[spoiler: comes to see Josh when he's at the airport waiting for his flight after his father died]], three Secret Service agents walk into shot, one at a time. That was the night President Bartlet won the Illinois primary and became the Democratic nominee; it was probably the first time he had Secret Service protection.
* In "The U.S. Poet Laureate" Bartlet calls Ritchie a ".22 caliber mind in a .357 magnum world", pretending not to realise that he was on air to get the insult out there. By using a gun metaphor, he avoids any chance of the remark backfiring as liberal snobbery.
protection.
7th Jul '16 8:44:11 AM Daltonia
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* In the second half of "In the shadow of two Gunmen," when Bartlet [[spoiler: comes to see Josh when he's at the airport waiting for his flight after his father died]], three Secret Service agents walk into shot, one at a time. That was the night President Bartlet won the Illinois primary and became the Democratic nominee; it was probably the first time he had Secret Service protection.

to:

* In the second half of "In the shadow of two Gunmen," when Bartlet [[spoiler: comes to see Josh when he's at the airport waiting for his flight after his father died]], three Secret Service agents walk into shot, one at a time. That was the night President Bartlet won the Illinois primary and became the Democratic nominee; it was probably the first time he had Secret Service protection.protection.
* In "The U.S. Poet Laureate" Bartlet calls Ritchie a ".22 caliber mind in a .357 magnum world", pretending not to realise that he was on air to get the insult out there. By using a gun metaphor, he avoids any chance of the remark backfiring as liberal snobbery.
4th Mar '16 2:45:58 PM wrestlingdog909
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* The idea that Josh is generally AfraidOfBlood might not be exactly true. When the doctor in the military hospital in Germany is telling Josh about all the details of Donna's operation, maybe he feels sick and eventually faints because of how worried he is about Donna. If this is true, it doubles as a really touching moment.

to:

* The idea that Josh is generally AfraidOfBlood might not be exactly true. When the doctor in the military hospital in Germany is telling Josh about all the details of Donna's operation, maybe he feels sick and eventually faints because of how worried he is about Donna. If this is true, it doubles as a really touching moment.moment.
* In the second half of "In the shadow of two Gunmen," when Bartlet [[spoiler: comes to see Josh when he's at the airport waiting for his flight after his father died]], three Secret Service agents walk into shot, one at a time. That was the night President Bartlet won the Illinois primary and became the Democratic nominee; it was probably the first time he had Secret Service protection.
1st Aug '15 12:21:22 PM emily164
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* Josh [[spoiler: breaking a window in his apartment during a PTSD episode and cutting his hand]] is remarkably similar to [[RealitySubtext something that happened]] to Martin Sheen while filming ''Film/ApocalypseNow'' [[spoiler: (though for him, it was a mirror, not a window and due to drunkeness, not PTSD)]].

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* Josh [[spoiler: breaking a window in his apartment during a PTSD episode and cutting his hand]] is remarkably similar to [[RealitySubtext something that happened]] to Martin Sheen while filming ''Film/ApocalypseNow'' [[spoiler: (though for him, it was a mirror, not a window and due to drunkeness, drunkenness, not PTSD)]].PTSD)]].
* The idea that Josh is generally AfraidOfBlood might not be exactly true. When the doctor in the military hospital in Germany is telling Josh about all the details of Donna's operation, maybe he feels sick and eventually faints because of how worried he is about Donna. If this is true, it doubles as a really touching moment.
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