History Fridge / MetalGearSolid

5th Oct '15 10:58:09 AM MrStath2015
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\n* The Phantom Pain [[spoiler: adds a further layer as to why Liquid would continue to trust someone seemingly as unstable as Mantis can be when Mantis proposes the idea of having Decoy Octopus pose as the DARPA chief following his (actually planned) death at Ocelot's hands. They've probably worked together for years since 1984, and Liquid actively owes Mantis his life. Mantis, meanwhile, is psychically shackled to Liquid given his bubbling hatred for Snake and Big Boss, as per the new information regarding how his abilities work]].
21st Sep '15 1:13:39 PM Kervinle2500
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* Why does Snake not want to see a woman die in front of him? Answer: He saw Gustava Heffner from ''MetalGear2SolidSnake'' die in front of him by Metal Gear D, the canonical third Metal Gear. It's why he goes out of his why to see not Meryl die.

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* Why does Snake not want to see a woman die in front of him? Answer: He saw Gustava Heffner from ''MetalGear2SolidSnake'' die in front of him by Metal Gear D, the canonical third fourth Metal Gear. It's why he goes out of his why to see not Meryl die.
14th Aug '15 11:39:43 AM MrStath2015
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** It's more likely that, as [[spoiler: a core member of the Patriots, the bribe and persuasion needed were for show. Remember that while Armstech is developing REX and desperately needs the money from the government, and Solidus considered REX ''his'' tool against the Patriots, the Patriots were ''always'' aware of the project]].
28th Jul '15 1:05:44 PM Kervinle2500
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* Why does Snake not want to see a woman die in front of him? Answer: He saw Gustava Heffner from ''MetalGear2SolidSnake'' die in front of him by Metal Gear D, the canonical third Metal Gear. It's why he goes out of his why to see not Meryl die.
24th Jul '15 6:20:17 PM nombretomado
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* At one point, Revolver Ocelot mentions being impressed by Snake's skills, and says something to the effect of "Just what I'd expect from someone with the same code name as the boss." The first time you play the game, it's obvious that "the boss" refers to Liquid Snake, who Ocelot was working for at the time. Then comes ''MetalGearSolid3'', where we learn that Big Boss (who Solid Snake is cloned from) once went by the codename "Naked Snake"... and that Ocelot knew him during this time. Maybe it was intentional, maybe not.

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* At one point, Revolver Ocelot mentions being impressed by Snake's skills, and says something to the effect of "Just what I'd expect from someone with the same code name as the boss." The first time you play the game, it's obvious that "the boss" refers to Liquid Snake, who Ocelot was working for at the time. Then comes ''MetalGearSolid3'', ''VideoGame/MetalGearSolid3SnakeEater'', where we learn that Big Boss (who Solid Snake is cloned from) once went by the codename "Naked Snake"... and that Ocelot knew him during this time. Maybe it was intentional, maybe not.
14th Mar '15 11:43:37 AM MightyKombat
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* This technically only applies to The Twin Snakes, although this was also mentioned in the Japanese script for Metal Gear Solid, as well. Anyways, Psycho Mantis's line of "It feels so... nostalgic" in regards to performing a good deed for Solid Snake and Meryl Silverburgh before dying seemed very confusing to some fans... until you remember that Psycho Mantis's mother died while giving birth to him, which meant he was referring to what his mother did for him before dying.
** Not to be bursting bubbles, but the line "It feels so... nostalgic" was actually in the Japanese version of the original game, and it refers to something from VideoGame/MetalGear2SolidSnake. The line was changed to "kinda... nice." for the US localization because that game never was released here.
*** Actually, Hideo Kojima stated in the director's commentary for Metal Gear Solid that Mantis's line was actually in reference to his mother's last moments being used to give birth to him. Read it here: http://muni_shinobu.webs.com/mgs/commentary2.html
*** I know that it isn't the real reason, but the "feels good" and the "nostalgic feeling" set off a different bell for me. See Mantis constantly breaks the fourth wall, right? Well, what's stopping him from doing that while dying? To me, Mantis felt nostalgic in Twin Snakes because he already had done a good deed before: In the Playstation version.

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* This technically only applies to The Twin Snakes, although this was also mentioned in the Japanese script for Metal Gear Solid, as well. Anyways, Psycho Mantis's line of "It feels so... nostalgic" in regards to performing a good deed for Solid Snake and Meryl Silverburgh before dying seemed very confusing to some fans... until you remember that Psycho Mantis's mother died while giving birth to him, which meant he was referring to what his mother did for him before dying.
** Not to be bursting bubbles, but the line "It feels so... nostalgic" was actually in the Japanese version of the original game, and it refers to something from VideoGame/MetalGear2SolidSnake. The line was changed to "kinda... nice." for the US localization because that game never was released here.
*** Actually, Hideo
dying. Stated as such by Kojima stated in the director's commentary for Metal Gear Solid that Mantis's line was actually in reference to his mother's last moments being used to give birth to him. Read it here: http://muni_shinobu.webs.com/mgs/commentary2.html
*** I know that it isn't the real reason, but the "feels good" and the "nostalgic feeling" set off a different bell for me. See Mantis constantly breaks the fourth wall, right? Well, what's stopping him from doing that while dying? To me, Mantis felt nostalgic in Twin Snakes because he already had done a good deed before: In the Playstation version.
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** Well, actually, there are plenty of reasons he could have been bribed. It could be that they ''didn't'' have to bribe him, but he took it because they were offering (ie. simple greed). Or maybe the bribe wasn't about Metal Gear specifically but about allowing ARMSTech to be the company who built it, or to ignore their financial troubles. That is assuming he was bribed at all- bribes were definitely going around, but that does not mean that he was one of the people collecting them. For all we know, the whole thing was Anderson's idea in the first place.



*** MGS 2 gets even more mind screwy when you consider not only the actual plot being a deconstruction but also an allegory to the player-character relationship. The Patriots plotted perfectly to get Raiden to do what they wanted him to. Even though you're trying to help Raiden, you're controlling to make the plot fit while looking at him from a 3rd person view. Guess what that means? I must fight The Patriots! [[FanFic/DoomRepercussionsOfEvil No player, you ARE The Patriots.]]
**** I see it as the opposite. In [=MGS3=], The Boss' tragedy, and indeed a recurring theme throughout the series, is the Patriots manipulating soldiers to do what they want them to do. Just like the player is 'manipulated' into doing what the game wants you to do. Similarly, the trend of the player-character being mocked for blindly following orders can be seen as a Take That to the player doing whatever the game tells them to do.



** That's exactly what's happening, yeah. The 'third person' view you mentioned is Mantis's view, which is exactly what happens if you use first person during the boss fight.

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** That's exactly what's happening, yeah. The 'third person' view you mentioned is Mantis's view, which is exactly what happens if you use first person during the boss fight.
17th Mar '14 10:11:20 AM MrDeath
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** Liquid thought he'd be safe because Liquid ''really'' doesn't understand genetics. According to Kojima, Liquid just plain doesn't know what he's talking about.
16th Mar '14 10:58:17 PM MiriOhki
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[[AC: FridgeLogic]]
* Yes, another problem with the whole Gene issue. Not one about the whole Dominant/recessive argument, but rather a problem with the Genetic issue and [=FoxDie=]. [=FoxDie=] was programmed to target people with specific gene patterns. So why in the hell did Liquid think that because he would be safe if Snake didn't die? The whole problem between the Dominant/Recessive thing is that Liquid and Snake '''can't''' have the exact same genetic pattern, not unless they wanted a whole string of carbon copies in the first place, which was not what they were looking for. Sure, Naomi could, and [[{{Revenge}} would program]] the virus to kill Snake, but if a non-hostile party had programmed/injected the virus into Snake, there's no guarantee that FoxDie would kill both of them.
8th Aug '13 12:37:34 PM ChaoticNovelist
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* After playing MGS 1-3, and reading the comics for 1 & 2, I read this page, lo and behold the light shines brightly. What the troper above mentions about Liquid's tantrum, makes it weirdly plausible that Solidus anticipated that the two most dangerous individuals to his plans were unlikely to be easily eliminated-unless the killer was one of the brothers. Given that Liquid and Solid are on a whole new level compared to any other soldier alive at the time, it makes sense for Solidus to set them up to kill each other. The only way he could pull this was to isolate them from society, place them in a perceived high stakes situation, wait for a body, and nuke an already irradiated island, safely in the knowledge that he could blame the detonation on terrorists mishandling the warheads. It further makes more sense when we examine the presence of a Metal Gear, its the only prize big enough to get Liquid there, and scarier enough for Solid to come out of retirement. The sheer size of Rex makes covert transport from such an isolated area, quite difficult, and despite the complexity only the plans are necessary for Solidus to build a Rex in new location. Nuking the island destroys any records of Rex. Kills the CEO and DARPA representatives who knew about Rex. Removes the Next Generation Special Forces who were slowly coming apart genetically(covering up that little not so legal experiment), wipes out Fox Hound which seems to be a pointless liability given its tendency to do TheStarscream to the [[strike:US Government]] [[strike:United Nations]] unlucky bastards stuck with telling them what to do. Foxdie is the chancy bit however, as Solidus's ace in the hole required someone he did not have complete control over to seek vengeance at a jeopardise-the-entire-mission level. Ocelot's selling of the plans is just his ChronicBackstabbingDisorder, something Solidus could not stop (and probably anticipated) as he needed Ocelot to rig this XanatosRoulette, hence why Ocelot does not show signs of Foxdie (Haven't played MGS 4 but if he does turn out have Foxdie then it kind of changes Ocelot into Snake Plisskin from the second movie...). I nearly wrote off my computer with a glass of coke when this clicked ;)- Eyclonus** And the phrase "code". It refers to both codename, and ''genetic'' code. - pinkdalek


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* After playing MGS 1-3, and reading the comics for 1 & 2, I read this page, lo and behold the light shines brightly. What the troper above mentions about Liquid's tantrum, makes it weirdly plausible that Solidus anticipated that the two most dangerous individuals to his plans were unlikely to be easily eliminated-unless the killer was one of the brothers. Given that Liquid and Solid are on a whole new level compared to any other soldier alive at the time, it makes sense for Solidus to set them up to kill each other. The only way he could pull this was to isolate them from society, place them in a perceived high stakes situation, wait for a body, and nuke an already irradiated island, safely in the knowledge that he could blame the detonation on terrorists mishandling the warheads. It further makes more sense when we examine the presence of a Metal Gear, its the only prize big enough to get Liquid there, and scarier enough for Solid to come out of retirement. The sheer size of Rex makes covert transport from such an isolated area, quite difficult, and despite the complexity only the plans are necessary for Solidus to build a Rex in new location. Nuking the island destroys any records of Rex. Kills the CEO and DARPA representatives who knew about Rex. Removes the Next Generation Special Forces who were slowly coming apart genetically(covering up that little not so legal experiment), wipes out Fox Hound which seems to be a pointless liability given its tendency to do TheStarscream to the [[strike:US Government]] [[strike:United Nations]] unlucky bastards stuck with telling them what to do. Foxdie is the chancy bit however, as Solidus's ace in the hole required someone he did not have complete control over to seek vengeance at a jeopardise-the-entire-mission level. Ocelot's selling of the plans is just his ChronicBackstabbingDisorder, something Solidus could not stop (and probably anticipated) as he needed Ocelot to rig this XanatosRoulette, GambitRoulette, hence why Ocelot does not show signs of Foxdie (Haven't played MGS 4 but if he does turn out have Foxdie then it kind of changes Ocelot into Snake Plisskin from the second movie...). I nearly wrote off my computer with a glass of coke when this clicked ;)- Eyclonus** And the phrase "code". It refers to both codename, and ''genetic'' code. - pinkdalek

2nd May '13 11:38:06 AM TypoKiller
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** This technically only applies to The Twin Snakes, although this was also mentioned in the Japanese script for Metal Gear Solid, as well. Anyways, Psycho Mantis's line of "It feels so... nostalgic" in regards to performing a good deed for Solid Snake and Meryl Silverburgh before dying seemed very confusing to some fans... until you remember that Psycho Mantis's mother died while giving birth to him, which meant he was referring to what his mother did for him before dying.

to:

** * This technically only applies to The Twin Snakes, although this was also mentioned in the Japanese script for Metal Gear Solid, as well. Anyways, Psycho Mantis's line of "It feels so... nostalgic" in regards to performing a good deed for Solid Snake and Meryl Silverburgh before dying seemed very confusing to some fans... until you remember that Psycho Mantis's mother died while giving birth to him, which meant he was referring to what his mother did for him before dying.
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