History Disney / Pocahontas

15th Jun '17 5:04:32 AM Tommoraptor
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Added DiffLines:

* JerkWithAHeartOfGold: Ben.
3rd May '17 10:23:47 AM tyrekecorrea
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-->'''Pocahontas:''' If you kill him, you'll have to go through me first!\\

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-->'''Pocahontas:''' If you kill him, you'll have to go through me first!\\kill me, too!\\
3rd May '17 10:14:19 AM tyrekecorrea
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* DawnAttack: After Thomas kills Kocoum and the Powhatans capture John Smith, Governor Ratcliffe each announce plans attack their opposition at sunrise.

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* DawnAttack: After Thomas kills Kocoum and the Powhatans capture John Smith, Chief Powhatan and Governor Ratcliffe each announce plans attack their opposition at sunrise.
3rd May '17 10:11:56 AM tyrekecorrea
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Added DiffLines:

* DawnAttack: After Thomas kills Kocoum and the Powhatans capture John Smith, Governor Ratcliffe each announce plans attack their opposition at sunrise.
1st May '17 10:32:38 PM Pamina
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* DarkerAndEdgier: For two reasons. 1) *Savages* is the most brutal and intense song that addresses the themes of othering, xenophobia, and genocide. 2) Near the end of the movie, John Smith sacrifices himself by throwing himself in front of Chief Powhatan and gets wounded in the process.

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* DarkerAndEdgier: For two Compared to most earlier Disney films, for three reasons. 1) *Savages* is the most brutal and intense song that addresses the themes of othering, xenophobia, and genocide. 2) [[spoiler: The killing of Kocoum is one of Disney's few onscreen human character deaths.]] 2) Near the end of the movie, John Smith sacrifices himself by throwing himself in front of Chief Powhatan and gets wounded in the process.process, leading to a {{Bittersweet Ending}} instead of the standard Disney happy ending.
28th Apr '17 10:52:01 AM raeslewolhn
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* NotSoDifferent: The natives and the settlers. A fairly dark example, considering our first view of the natives is their warriors returning from having "defeated the Massowomecks" and the ending only avoided being a massacre because both sides launched their sneak attacks at the same time. Also, the leads were too popular to ignore their wishes. Lampshaded when both of them sing a similar song (in fact "Savages" can be considered this trope in song form, as much for some of the expressions and animation choices as for the lyrics).

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* NotSoDifferent: The natives and the settlers. A fairly dark example, considering our first view of the natives is their warriors returning from having "defeated the Massowomecks" and the ending only [[spoiler:only avoided being a massacre because both sides launched their sneak attacks at the same time. Also, the leads were too popular to ignore their wishes.wishes]]. Lampshaded when both of them sing a similar song (in fact "Savages" can be considered this trope in song form, as much for some of the expressions and animation choices as for the lyrics).
28th Apr '17 10:48:13 AM raeslewolhn
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* CloserToEarth: Pocahontas and John Smith. By comparison, the rest of her tribe is just as aggressive and violent as the settlers; their leaders and warriors are returning from a successful conquest when we first see them.
** The Powhatan are depicted this way compared to the settlers. They wage battles, but overall they have more respect for nature (OneWithNature) and are not taking from others; ostensibly like most real-life battles of (North)Eastern native American tribes, their conflicts were based on personal offenses and conflicts, rather than expansionism. At no point are they depriving others of basic necessities or detroying natural resources in pursuit of a (highly valued but) practically useless mineral. Their grayer morality, etc, than the lead characters is the result of defensive fear. The Chief says he would seek peace if the settlers would talk and listen, but anytime the natives go near their camp they get shot at; Ratcliffe has no grayness, he will never negotiate.

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* CloserToEarth: Pocahontas and John Smith. By comparison, the rest of her tribe is just as aggressive and violent as the settlers; their leaders and warriors are returning from a successful conquest battle/war when we first see them.
** The Also, the Powhatan are depicted this way when compared to the settlers. They wage battles, but overall they have more respect for nature (OneWithNature) and are not taking from others; ostensibly others. Ostensibly, like most real-life battles of (North)Eastern native American tribes, their conflicts real life counterparts, the first battle was a result of conflict - they were based on personal offenses and conflicts, rather than expansionism.not expansionists or conquerers. At no point are they depriving others of basic necessities or detroying natural resources in pursuit of a (highly valued but) practically useless mineral. Their grayer morality, etc, than (Within the lead characters is movie, the result pursuit of defensive fear. gold is depicted as a distinctly inane cause with no basis in fact, and irrational and offensive motivation.) The Chief says he would seek peace if the settlers would talk and listen, (rational and wise), but anytime the natives go near their camp camp, even just to look, they get shot at; at. Meanwhile Ratcliffe has no grayness, shoots first and never asks questions, he will never negotiate.



* NotSoDifferent: The natives and the settlers. A fairly dark example, considering our first view of the natives is their warriors returning from conquering/destroying another tribe and the ending only avoided being a massacre because both sides launched their sneak attacks at the same time. Lampshaded when both of them sing a similar song (in fact "Savages" can be considered this trope in song form, as much for some of the expressions and animation choices as for the lyrics).
** The line referenced above is "defeated the Massowomecks". Everything above holds up, but this difference is relevant to other tropes - the Massowomecks they fought weren't destroyed or conquered, they live and continue self-governance.

to:

* NotSoDifferent: The natives and the settlers. A fairly dark example, considering our first view of the natives is their warriors returning from conquering/destroying another tribe having "defeated the Massowomecks" and the ending only avoided being a massacre because both sides launched their sneak attacks at the same time. Also, the leads were too popular to ignore their wishes. Lampshaded when both of them sing a similar song (in fact "Savages" can be considered this trope in song form, as much for some of the expressions and animation choices as for the lyrics).
** The line referenced above is "defeated the Massowomecks". Everything above holds up, but this difference is relevant to other tropes - the Massowomecks they fought weren't destroyed or conquered, they live and continue self-governance.
lyrics).



** Interesting info - linguists suppose that earlier English accents sounded more like modern Americn ones than their own decendants (unproven). John Smith is still inconsistent.

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** Interesting info - linguists suppose that earlier English accents sounded more like modern Americn ones than their own decendants (unproven). decendants, although this is unproven. Still, John Smith is still inconsistent.
28th Apr '17 10:23:20 AM raeslewolhn
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** The line referenced above is ''defeated the Massowomecks''. Everything above holds up, but this difference is relevant to other tropes - the Massowomecks they fought weren't destroyed or conquered, they live and continue self-governance.

to:

** The line referenced above is ''defeated "defeated the Massowomecks''.Massowomecks". Everything above holds up, but this difference is relevant to other tropes - the Massowomecks they fought weren't destroyed or conquered, they live and continue self-governance.



** Interesting info - linguists suppose that earlier English accents sounded more like modern Americn ones than their own decendants (unproven). John Smithh is still inconsistent.

to:

** Interesting info - linguists suppose that earlier English accents sounded more like modern Americn ones than their own decendants (unproven). John Smithh Smith is still inconsistent.
28th Apr '17 10:18:10 AM raeslewolhn
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** The Powhatan are depicted this way compared to the settlers. They wage battles, but overall they have more respect for nature and are not taking from others; ostensibly like most real-life battles of (North)Eastern native American tribes, their conflicts were based on personal offenses and conflicts, rather than expansionism. At no point are they competitively depriving others of basic necessities or natural resources. Their grayer morality, etc, than the main characters is the result of defensive fear. The Chief says he would seek peace if the settlers would talk and listen, but anytime the natives go near their camp they get shot at; Radcliffe has no grayness, he will never negotiate.

to:

** The Powhatan are depicted this way compared to the settlers. They wage battles, but overall they have more respect for nature (OneWithNature) and are not taking from others; ostensibly like most real-life battles of (North)Eastern native American tribes, their conflicts were based on personal offenses and conflicts, rather than expansionism. At no point are they competitively depriving others of basic necessities or detroying natural resources. resources in pursuit of a (highly valued but) practically useless mineral. Their grayer morality, etc, than the main lead characters is the result of defensive fear. The Chief says he would seek peace if the settlers would talk and listen, but anytime the natives go near their camp they get shot at; Radcliffe Ratcliffe has no grayness, he will never negotiate.


Added DiffLines:

** The line referenced above is ''defeated the Massowomecks''. Everything above holds up, but this difference is relevant to other tropes - the Massowomecks they fought weren't destroyed or conquered, they live and continue self-governance.


Added DiffLines:

** Interesting info - linguists suppose that earlier English accents sounded more like modern Americn ones than their own decendants (unproven). John Smithh is still inconsistent.
27th Apr '17 11:26:38 PM raeslewolhn
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** The Powhatan are depicted this way compared to the settlers. They wage battles, but overall they have more respect for nature and are not taking from others; ostensibly like most real-life battles of (North)Eastern native American tribes, their conflicts were based on personal offenses. At no point are they competitively depriving others of basic necessities or natural resources. Their grayer morality, etc, than the main characters is the result of defensive fear. The Chief says he would seek peace if the settlers would talk and listen, but anytime the natives go near their camp they get shot at; Radcliffe has no grayness, he will never negotiate.

to:

** The Powhatan are depicted this way compared to the settlers. They wage battles, but overall they have more respect for nature and are not taking from others; ostensibly like most real-life battles of (North)Eastern native American tribes, their conflicts were based on personal offenses.offenses and conflicts, rather than expansionism. At no point are they competitively depriving others of basic necessities or natural resources. Their grayer morality, etc, than the main characters is the result of defensive fear. The Chief says he would seek peace if the settlers would talk and listen, but anytime the natives go near their camp they get shot at; Radcliffe has no grayness, he will never negotiate.
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