History Discworld / NightWatch

8th Jul '16 1:39:47 AM Morgenthaler
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* TheMentor:
** Thanks to time travel, Vimes gets to play this role for himself... though in reality he spends only a small portion of his time training his protégé and much more doing badass and heroic (or anti-heroic) things on his own, and takes pains to keep young Sam from doing anything that'd attract attention to himself. Also spending money like water, because he knows for a fact that he will "die" at the end of the week.
** Madam also plays this role for Vetinari, being an older, DistaffCounterpart version of him, even owning an elderly and smelly tomcat (as he will one day have a smelly old dog). She educates him about the usefulness of men like Keel, and how killing someone isn't always the best answer (though she will if it ''is'' the best answer).



* TheObiWan
** Thanks to time travel, Vimes gets to play this role for himself... though in reality he spends only a small portion of his time training his protégé and much more doing badass and heroic (or anti-heroic) things on his own, and takes pains to keep young Sam from doing anything that'd attract attention to himself. Also spending money like water, because he knows for a fact that he will "die" at the end of the week.
** Madam also plays this role for Vetinari, being an older, DistaffCounterpart version of him, even owning an elderly and smelly tomcat (as he will one day have a smelly old dog). She educates him about the usefulness of men like Keel, and how killing someone isn't always the best answer (though she will if it ''is'' the best answer).
29th Jun '16 10:05:12 AM TrickyPacifist
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* PresentCompanyExcluded: Pithy slogans have it hard in Ankh-Morpork, a city where no self-respecting god can say so much as "Let there be light," without being greeted by a chorus of "What color?" and the result of Reg's declaration "You can take our lives, but you'll never take our freedom!" is chronicled elsewhere on this page. So it should be no surprise that the initial defiant cry of "Death to the fascist oppressors!" from behind the original Whalebone Lane barricade gets quickly amended to "Death to the fascist oppressors, present company excepted! All right, is everybody happy now?"

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* PresentCompanyExcluded: Pithy slogans have it hard in Ankh-Morpork, a city where no self-respecting god can say so much as "Let there be light," without being greeted by a chorus of "What color?" and the result of Reg's declaration "You can take our lives, but you'll never take our freedom!" is chronicled elsewhere on this page. So it should be no surprise that the initial defiant cry of "Death to the fascist oppressors!" from behind the original Whalebone Lane barricade (probably also uttered by Reg Shoe) gets quickly amended to "Death to the fascist oppressors, present company excepted! All right, is everybody happy now?"
29th Jun '16 10:00:58 AM TrickyPacifist
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* PresentCompanyExcluded: Pithy slogans have it hard in Ankh-Morpork, a city where no self-respecting god can say so much as "Let there be light," without being greeted by a chorus of "What color?" and the result of Reg's declaration "You can take our lives, but you'll never take our freedom!" is chronicled elsewhere on this page. So it should be no surprise that the initial defiant cry of "Death to the fascist oppressors!" from behind the original Whalebone Lane barricade gets quickly amended to "Death to the fascist oppressors, present company excepted! All right, is everybody happy now?"
26th Jun '16 5:10:11 PM loracarol
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* NecessaryFail: Cleverly played with. In the regular timeline, the resistance put on the barricades but failed to defend against a sneak attack, resulting in the deaths of the 7 men in the cemetery of Small Gods. When Vimes goes back in time and is tasked to fix Carcer's alterations, he is left with the choice of either doing everything he can to prevent the death of the rebels or doing almost nothing so he could return to his timeline and get back to his wife and unborn child. [[spoiler:Vimes manages to organize the barricades and defend against the attacks. But the revolution fouls up and the new Patrician sends the newly promoted Captain Carcer and his squad of rogue guards to murder Vimes and his men. Cornered, Vimes orders his men to retreat but his companions decide to stay and help him bring down Carcer despite their slim chances of survival. In the end, Vimes manages to bring down Carcer but not without casualties on his side, resulting in the end in the death of the same 7 men that died in the original timeline.In the end, Vimes could not prevent the death of these 7 men but he didn't have to. In the end, they willingly put their lives on the line in both timelines for something they thought was important.]]

to:

* NecessaryFail: Cleverly played with. In the regular timeline, the resistance put on the barricades but failed to defend against a sneak attack, resulting in the deaths of the 7 men in the cemetery of Small Gods. When Vimes goes back in time and is tasked to fix Carcer's alterations, he is left with the choice of either doing everything he can to prevent the death of the rebels or doing almost nothing so he could return to his timeline and get back to his wife and unborn child. [[spoiler:Vimes manages to organize the barricades and defend against the attacks. But the revolution fouls up and the new Patrician sends the newly promoted Captain Carcer and his squad of rogue guards to murder Vimes and his men. Cornered, Vimes orders his men to retreat but his companions decide to stay and help him bring down Carcer despite their slim chances of survival. In the end, Vimes manages to bring down Carcer but not without casualties on his side, resulting in the end in the death of the same 7 men that died in the original timeline. In the end, Vimes could not prevent the death of these 7 men but he didn't have to. In the end, they willingly put their lives on the line in both timelines for something they thought was important.]]
9th Jun '16 3:34:03 PM LentilSandEater
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** Which takes on a whole new (hilarious) meaning if you remember Brick Top's speech from ''{{Film/Snatch}}'': "Do you know what 'nemesis' means? A righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent. Personified in this case by an 'orrible cunt..." In this universe, Vimes.
9th Jun '16 3:33:19 PM LentilSandEater
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*** [[SubvertedTrope Subverted]] when it turns out that [[spoiler:nope, Reg was ''right.'']]
9th Jun '16 3:29:25 PM LentilSandEater
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* DoomedMoralVictor: Parodied, as the villains consider "You may take our lives, but you'll never take our freedom" to be the dumbest revolutionary slogan ever. Specifically, Carcer replies "Wrong," and cue the hail of crossbow bolts. However, [[FridgeBrilliance if you think about it]], they did take Reg's life, but they never took his freedom.

to:

* DoomedMoralVictor: Parodied, as the villains consider "You may take our lives, but you'll never take our freedom" to be the dumbest revolutionary slogan ever. Specifically, Carcer replies "Wrong," and cue the hail of crossbow bolts. However, [[FridgeBrilliance if you think about it]], they did take Reg's life, but they never took his freedom.



** A bit of {{Fridge Brilliance}} in that one. Imagine Vimes as a ball, Keel as a cube, & the time travel as a tunnel that loops back on itself. Vimes goes into the tunnel at Pv, & comes out at Pk, where Keel is now dead. Keel's death knocks Vimes into Keel's temporal path, thereby forcing the ball to take the cube's place. Once this happens, THE BALL HAS ALWAYS BEEN THE ONE IN THAT TEMPORAL PATH, meaning that Keel's politics are now, AND ALWAYS HAVE BEEN moot, as it was always Vimes who taught Sam.



** The unnamed Captain who met Vimes's barricades during his patrol. Despite the fact that all barricades were ordered to be pulled down, he took time to understand the situation and listened to Vimes's argument that the area behind was much '''safer''' than the so called safe zones and eventually filed a report to his superiors that basically told them to ignore this area, estimating that the situation would resolve itself. In a moment of Fridge Brilliance, we realize that he was right all along as no amount of military force managed to tear down the barricade but when the amnesty was declared, the rebels disassembled the barricades themselves.
** Don't forget Major Clive Mountjoy-Standfast and Captain Tom Wrangle. They were the military officers in charge of pacifying the streets and were both decent, reasonable and competent men. Shame that they had to take orders from Carcer.

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** The unnamed Captain who met Vimes's barricades during his patrol. Despite the fact that all barricades were ordered to be pulled down, he took time to understand the situation and listened to Vimes's argument that the area behind was much '''safer''' than the so called safe zones and eventually filed a report to his superiors that basically told them to ignore this area, estimating that the situation would resolve itself. In a moment of Fridge Brilliance, we realize that he was right all along as no amount of military force managed to tear down the barricade but when the amnesty was declared, the rebels disassembled the barricades themselves.
itself.
** Don't forget Major Clive Mountjoy-Standfast and Captain Tom Wrangle. They were the military officers in charge of pacifying the streets and were both decent, reasonable and competent men. Shame that they had to take orders from Carcer.
9th Jun '16 3:28:17 PM LentilSandEater
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** [[spoiler:It isn't Vetinari entering that does him in. It's the fact that, through his aunt's machinations in getting the 'right' people into the right 'groups', Vetinari is able to close the distance...and go 'boo']]
9th Jun '16 3:25:18 PM LentilSandEater
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** Normally amiable Fred Colon's reaction to a young corporal asking why they were wearing sprigs of lilac seems quite disproportionate, as it seems like a fair question to us, but as the reason becomes apparent later in the book the incident implies that the subject of the revolution is a BerserkButton for Colon.
*** Mind you, it's not the question itself that sets Colon off, but the young corporal's (well-meaning) offer to put on a lilac as well, which Colon finds presumptive. (Lilac aside, the Watch goes far out of its way to avoid honoring the men who died in the revolution, to prevent others from trying to emulate them.)

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** Normally amiable Fred Colon's reaction to a young corporal asking why they were wearing sprigs of lilac lilac, and whether the corporal should be wearing one, seems quite disproportionate, as it seems like a fair question to us, but as the reason becomes apparent later in the book the incident implies that the subject of the revolution is a BerserkButton for Colon.
*** Mind you, it's not the question itself that sets Colon off, but the young corporal's (well-meaning) offer to put on a lilac as well, which Colon finds presumptive. (Lilac aside, the Watch goes far out of its way to avoid honoring the men who died in the revolution, to prevent others from trying to emulate them.)
Colon.
8th May '16 5:58:11 AM nighttrainfm
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* AcquiredPoisonImmunity: Winder's food taster is said to have eaten so much poison that he's proof against almost anything and can turn silver black by breathing on it. He's taken to eating toads just to stay in practice and talking about poisons like mild seasoning.
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