History DethroningMoment / AnimeAndManga

2nd Sep '17 4:51:59 AM XFllo
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* Tropers/AndyJay: Episode 8 of ''Anime/GargantiaOnTheVerdurousPlanet'' titled "Separation", when Ledo departs to fight the Whalesquid[[spoiler:/Hideauze]] and leaves Amy behind in tears. Her crying is somewhat understandable given that she has a slight crush on him, but her subsequent statement to Bellows about Ledo being "in torment" and how she'd seen "the real Ledo" after the dance was a bit too {{Narm}}y for what should've been a genuinely poignant scene. No, Amy, Ledo has been trying to tell you that he's been fighting the Hideauze [[ChildSoldier his whole life]]; cold combat mode is "the real him". Meanwhile Melty, one of her best friends whom she's presumably known for much of her life (as opposed to a couple months at best with Ledo), is joining Ledo on a departing ship. Amy doesn't even seem the slightest bit concerned about her, even though Melty's also putting her life at risk from a possible Whalesquid attack (which Gargantia was in deadly fear of just two episodes before). Needless to say, this marks the decline of a previously vibrant, independent leading lady into a shallow cheerleader who [[ShallowLoveInterest likes Ledo for very vaguely defined reasons]].

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* Tropers/AndyJay: Episode 8 of ''Anime/GargantiaOnTheVerdurousPlanet'' titled "Separation", when Ledo departs to fight the Whalesquid[[spoiler:/Hideauze]] and leaves Amy behind in tears. Her crying is somewhat understandable given that she has a slight crush on him, but her subsequent statement to Bellows about Ledo being "in torment" and how she'd seen "the real Ledo" after the dance was a bit too {{Narm}}y for what should've been a genuinely poignant scene. No, Amy, Ledo has been trying to tell you that he's been fighting the Hideauze [[ChildSoldier his whole life]]; cold combat mode is "the real him". Meanwhile Melty, one of her best friends whom she's presumably known for much of her life (as opposed to a couple months at best with Ledo), is joining Ledo on a departing ship. Amy doesn't even seem the slightest bit concerned about her, even though Melty's also putting her life at risk from a possible Whalesquid attack (which Gargantia was in deadly fear of just two episodes before). Needless to say, this marks the decline of a previously vibrant, independent leading lady into a shallow cheerleader who [[ShallowLoveInterest likes Ledo for very vaguely defined reasons]].reasons.
1st Sep '17 8:40:52 AM Savini24
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** Tropers/Savini24: I totally agree. I couldn't stand Light after he killed [[spoiler:Misora]]. The only way he could have known [[spoiler: she had given him a fake name was if the Death Note failed. There was absolutely no reason for her to divulge her real name until she met with the actual task force, not one guy who claims to be working for the task force! After she tells him her name, he suddenly decides to reveal that he is Kira, with a confident smirk. Absolutely no reason to do this. Is she had given him a second pseudonym, he'd be screwed. It's just a cheap way to dramatize his victory. In the process, an intelligent and sympathetic character is reduced to a [[IdiotBall desperate and emotional wreck]] to try and show how "smart" Light is.]] Even though later parts of the manga are [[RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap better at showcasing Light's intelligence]], I never stopped rooting against him. Though a lot of people dislike [[TheScrappy Near and Mello]], [[spoiler:anyone who could manage to kill the bastard [[AvertedTrope is aces in my book]].]]

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** *** Tropers/Savini24: I totally agree. I couldn't stand Light after he killed [[spoiler:Misora]]. The only way he could have known [[spoiler: she had given him a fake name was if the Death Note failed. There was absolutely no reason for her to divulge her real name until she met with the actual task force, not one guy who claims to be working for the task force! After she tells him her name, he suddenly decides to reveal that he is Kira, with a confident smirk. Absolutely no reason to do this. Is she had given him a second pseudonym, he'd be screwed. It's just a cheap way to dramatize his victory. In the process, an intelligent and sympathetic character is reduced to a [[IdiotBall desperate and emotional wreck]] to try and show how "smart" Light is.]] Even though later parts of the manga are [[RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap better at showcasing Light's intelligence]], I never stopped rooting against him. Though a lot of people dislike [[TheScrappy Near and Mello]], [[spoiler:anyone who could manage to kill the bastard [[AvertedTrope is aces in my book]].]]
1st Sep '17 8:36:53 AM Savini24
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** Tropers/Savini24: I totally agree. I couldn't stand Light after he killed [[spoiler:Misora]]. The only way he could have known [[spoiler: she had given him a fake name was if the Death Note failed. There was absolutely no reason for her to divulge her real name until she met with the actual task force, not one guy who claims to be working for the task force! After she tells him her name, he suddenly decides to reveal that he is Kira, with a confident smirk. Absolutely no reason to do this. Is she had given him a second pseudonym, he'd be screwed. It's just a cheap way to dramatize his victory. In the process, an intelligent and sympathetic character is reduced to a [[IdiotBall desperate and emotional wreck]] to try and show how "smart" Light is.]] Even though later parts of the manga are [[RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap better at showcasing Light's intelligence]], I never stopped rooting against him. Though a lot of people dislike [[TheScrappy Near and Mello]], [[spoiler:anyone who could manage to kill the bastard [[AvertedTrope is aces in my book]].]]
22nd Aug '17 5:45:35 PM DrZulu2010
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** Tropers/DrZulu2010: Speaking of the animation quality in ''Anime/Berserk2016'' there is a scene from season 2 where Guts moves to protect his allies and he moves like he's on freaking ''WesternAnimation/SouthPark''. (Video [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbA9CrZGkRw here]]) The thing is that South Park's animation style is part of what makes the series it's own and has been the style for 20 years. Berserk was supposed to use 3d to make sure that Miura's artstyle pops more. Yet it means squat when the animation looks lazy and amateurish. That's really sad when the movie trilogy, ''VideoGame/BerserkAndTheBandOfTheHawk'' and even ''VideoGame/SwordOfTheBerserkGutsRage'' has better 3d animation.
15th Aug '17 12:02:49 PM Ferot_Dreadnaught
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* megachao24: While ''[[VideoGame/AikatsuStars Aikatsu Stars!]]'' [[ContestedSequel has been a]] [[LoveItOrHateIt controversial series]] from the onset, Episode 21 is an episode I felt hit a low point that's indefensible. Basically, the episode is about the main character Yume having won the chance of releasing her very first album from a contest held from the previous episode. However, Yume also has a [[DangerousForbiddenTechnique special ability to raise her capabilities to a much higher level]] whenever she's in a pinch and has a drawback of affecting her voice after using it. Four Star's headmaster, Hikaru Moroboshi, is concerned about this, but rather than talk to her about it straight up, he instead [[ExecutiveMeddling sabotages her album release by assigning the record company to release and produce an album for his top idol on short notice and release it on the same day as Yume's]]. While Yume has become [[BaseBreakingCharacter quite controversial]] after a series of events by that point, she definitely did not deserve to have such a [[KickTheDog crushing blow]] so early on in her career.

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* megachao24: While ''[[VideoGame/AikatsuStars Aikatsu Stars!]]'' [[ContestedSequel has been a]] [[LoveItOrHateIt a controversial series]] from the onset, Episode 21 is an episode I felt hit a low point that's indefensible. Basically, the episode is about the main character Yume having won the chance of releasing her very first album from a contest held from the previous episode. However, Yume also has a [[DangerousForbiddenTechnique special ability to raise her capabilities to a much higher level]] whenever she's in a pinch and has a drawback of affecting her voice after using it. Four Star's headmaster, Hikaru Moroboshi, is concerned about this, but rather than talk to her about it straight up, he instead [[ExecutiveMeddling sabotages her album release by assigning the record company to release and produce an album for his top idol on short notice and release it on the same day as Yume's]]. While Yume has become [[BaseBreakingCharacter quite controversial]] after a series of events by that point, she definitely did not deserve to have such a [[KickTheDog crushing blow]] so early on in her career.
5th Aug '17 4:03:34 PM Supreme-X15
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** {{Supreme-X15}}: My moment comes from midway into the second season of Baka and Test, as everybody goes to Study Camp. Akihisa and Yuuji are being blackmailed by a girl with a burn mark on her butt, and they need to to find out who it is. What follows is, for lack of a better phrase, sheer stupidity. First, nearly every girl, including Mizuki and Minami accuse Akihisa, Yuuji, and Kouta, minus Hideyoshi, of installing mini cams in the girls changing (which admittedly Kouta did, but only to read a message Shouko was sending to the blackmailer, and kept the rest of the image blurry) and proceed to [[PervertRevengeMode punish them]]. After that, they grab an {{idiot ball}} and rush the changing rooms to get at the mini cam hidden there, only to be foiled by the teachers. This plan repeats itself for the next two episodes, and escalates to the point of the four gathering an army of like-minded idiots, which leads to fighting an army girls, as well. Good god, the monotony. Sure, it finally ends with Akihisa beating Iron Man, and revealing [[spoiler:Miharu as the culprit]], but it also ends with all of the second year boys being suspended for peeking on the [[FanDisservice principle]], thus rendering their efforts pointless. This entire arc was nothing but an excuse to make the girls even more unlikable, and the guys into brainless morons. This could have been solved quicker had they just asked Aiko, who was implied to know what was going, if she knew who the culprit was, or at least get help from her, or Mizuki and Minami, since the three of them would've had better luck finding the culprit than any of them. Or better yet, get a teacher to help them. But, nope. The boys choose to be litural idiots. While it did have some good moments, the Study Camp Arc was a god awful mess and painful to sit through, leaving you wondering when it will end. Not to mention, it leads to a conflict with Minami and [[spoiler:Miharu]], which adds a lot of unnecessary drama for a comedy anime.

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** {{Supreme-X15}}: My moment comes from midway into the second season of Baka and Test, as everybody goes to Study Camp. Akihisa and Yuuji are being blackmailed by a girl with a burn mark on her butt, and they need to to find out who it is. What follows is, for lack of a better phrase, sheer stupidity. First, nearly every girl, including Mizuki Mizuki, Minami, and Minami Shouko accuse Akihisa, Yuuji, and Kouta, minus Hideyoshi, of installing mini cams in the girls changing (which admittedly Kouta did, did at school, but only to read a message Shouko was sending to the blackmailer, and kept the rest of the image blurry) and proceed to [[PervertRevengeMode brutally punish them]]. them for their transgressions]]. After that, they grab an {{idiot ball}} IdiotBall and rush the girls' changing rooms to get at the mini cam hidden there, only to be foiled by the teachers. This plan repeats itself for the next two episodes, and escalates to the point of the four gathering an army of like-minded idiots, which leads to fighting an army girls, as well. Good god, the monotony. Sure, it finally ends with Akihisa beating Iron Man, and revealing [[spoiler:Miharu as the culprit]], but it also ends with all of the second year boys being suspended for peeking on the [[FanDisservice principle]], thus rendering their efforts pointless. This entire arc was nothing but an excuse to make the girls even more unlikable, and the guys into brainless morons. This could have been solved quicker had they just asked Aiko, who was implied to know what was going, if she knew who the culprit was, or at least get help from her, or Mizuki and Minami, since the three of them would've had better luck finding the culprit than any of them.them, or even Shouko, as she had been in contact with the culprit and could have been persuaded to at least give a blue as to who said culprit is. Or better yet, get a teacher to help them. But, nope. The boys choose to be litural idiots. While it did have some good moments, the Study Camp Arc was a god awful mess and painful to sit through, leaving you wondering when it will end. Not to mention, it leads to a conflict with Minami and [[spoiler:Miharu]], which adds a lot of unnecessary drama for a comedy anime.
11th Jul '17 10:23:03 AM GunarmDyne
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** Tropers/GunarmDyne: The ending is the capstone to the decline of an otherwise very good manga, but the dethroning moment that signaled Takahashi writing herself into a corner involved completely destroying my personal favorite character, Ukyo, by making her fall to the levels of characters like Shampoo and Kodachi. Here was a character who genuinely loved Ranma and competed for his affection without trying to hurt other people in the process (at least after she got over her initial anger). Near the end, she ends up helping destroy the Saotomes' house with Shampoo and Kodachi in a jealous rage. No apology. No recompense. And all three Saotomes are forced to live with the Tendos again. StatusQuoIsGod was so important to Takahashi in that series that she had to destroy a well-established and popular character in order to maintain it.
16th Jun '17 9:18:01 PM IMAGINEZapper
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* IMAGINEZapper: I could easily place the entire GeckoEnding for the anime adaptation of ''Manga/AkameGaKill'' as my DMOS. Unlike most people it didn't ruin the show for me (TBH I like the anime to a certain degree) and I can't say no Wild Hunt or Syura's reduced role were much of losses, but I'd be lying to myself if I said I didn't have multiple problems with it. My main problem with the non-canon ending was that the writers thought it was a brilliant idea to wrap things up in only five episodes when the anime only covered half the manga. Because the anime writing staff had no idea how to coherently end the story or any character arc for that matter, we got five episodes of meaningless character deaths that were nothing more than shock value. Though the death that ended up being my DMOS for the anime was [[spoiler: Leone's death in the last episode.]] Even before I read the manga, I hated this scene and to this day find no reason to defend it. Leone is my favorite character in the series because despite all she's been through she tries her best to stay cheerful and hopeful for the future, which is why I root for her to live to the end. Her [[spoiler: death was just a huge disrespect to her character because not only did it occur after all the main villains were defeated, and the only reason (other than shock value) I could see the writers killing her off was simply because they didn't think she was important enough to have a good ending. This is literally a death that goes against all of the reasons why I like her character.]] The reason I chose that moment as my DMOS was that it just shows the writing staff for the anime tried way too hard to make the ending unpleasant and unsatisfying. I know being dark is Akame ga Kill's thing and all but its not totally nihilistic. Thankfully the ending was non-canon (and I enjoyed everything in the anime beforehand) and the manga looks like its on a better track.

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* IMAGINEZapper: I could easily place the entire GeckoEnding Changing my DMOS for the anime adaptation of ''Manga/AkameGaKill'' as my DMOS. Unlike most people it didn't ruin the show for me (TBH I like the anime to a certain degree) and I can't say no Wild Hunt or Syura's reduced role were much of losses, but I'd be lying to myself if I said I didn't have multiple problems with it. My main problem with the non-canon ending was that the writers thought it was a brilliant idea to wrap things up in only five episodes when the anime only covered half the manga. Because the anime writing staff had no idea how to coherently end the story or any character arc for that matter, we got five episodes of meaningless character deaths that were nothing more than shock value. Though the death that ended up being my DMOS for the anime was from [[spoiler: Leone's death in the last episode.]] Even before anime]]. I read the manga, I hated this scene still think its terrible, but after thinking long and to this day hard about it I personally find no reason to defend it. Leone is my favorite character in that the series because despite all she's been through she tries her best to stay cheerful and hopeful for the future, which is why I root for her to live to the end. Her way [[spoiler: Syura]] was defeated in the manga to be much worse. I've long abandoned the ''Akame ga Kill'' fandom but in spite of that I can still get some enjoyment out of the first half of the manga when it was focused on Night Raid vs. the Jaegers. Like many, I felt that the Wild Hunt arc was the beginning of the manga's decline since it threw away many of the potentially interesting plots from the first half but it was when [[spoiler: Lubbock anti-climatically killed Syura]] that I felt the manga had really gone off the deep end. While Syura is an utterly repulsive character, I felt he had the potential to be a strong main antagonist. Unlike the other members of Wild Hunt he is introduced in the middle of the first half and seeing as how he was the leader of Wild Hunt it was pretty clear that Takahiro was setting him up to be a major villain or even the true final boss. The fact that he was an enemy to both Night Raid and the Jaegers gave him an edge over the other antagonists which I thought would have made for a cool EnemyMine team up fight. Obviously, none of this happened and instead [[spoiler: he is killed off by Lubbock without a fight in the middle of the Wild Hunt arc nonetheless and long before the manga has yet to reach its climax.]] Even Ogre and Zank, who were mere [[VillainOfTheWeek Villains of the Week]] that existed just to demonstrate how fights work in ''Akame ga Kill'' ended up putting up more of a fight than Syura. Making things worse is that Syura ends up being a very bad case of TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodCharacter as his motivations are never explored and all he amounts to being is yet another cartoonishly evil arc villain. [[spoiler: His death was just a huge disrespect also has very little payoff as well, it doesn't move the Wild Hunt arc forward and even leads to her Lubbock's death wasting away a character because not only did that looked like he was moving towards an interesting character arc.]] Lastly, in spite of being a major character we never get to see his Teigu used in combat nor do we learn what its Hidden Ability is. Let it occur after all sink in that the main villains were defeated, mediocre anime adaptation actually gave him a better fight than the manga and the only reason (other than shock value) I could see the writers killing her off his fight was simply because they didn't think she was important enough to have a good ending. This is literally a death that goes against all of the reasons why I like her character.]] The reason I chose that moment as my DMOS was that it just shows the writing staff for the anime tried way too hard to make the ending unpleasant and unsatisfying. I know being dark is Akame ga Kill's thing and all but its not totally nihilistic. Thankfully the ending was non-canon (and I enjoyed everything included in the anime beforehand) is because his first appearance was adapted and the manga looks like its on a better track.White Fox didn't want to forget about him.
15th Jun '17 3:28:48 PM mrbits
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** Komatsuzaki - It really astonishes me that anyone over the age of 18 kept watching. His sexual abuse is presented as something funny or awesome. What does it say about our culture, both in Japan and in the West, that people saw this character and thought, "Yes, this is definitely the kind of main character I want to keep watching!" Anime in general seems to have a problem with this, but this one really took the cake.
15th Jun '17 2:56:53 PM ArgonianLorekeeper
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* Tropers/LordTNK: ''Manga/{{Akira}}'''s ending, for the same thing.

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* Tropers/LordTNK: ''Manga/{{Akira}}'''s ending, for the same thing.reason as that of ''Anime/Berserk1997''.
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