History DeaderThanDisco / AnimeAndManga

26th May '16 10:32:49 PM vexer
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* The english dub of ''Anime/YuGiOh'' is this. When it first came out, it was a hit, giving 4kids a hit that would prevent themselves from being a OneHitWonder. Even when it was new it was criticized for being corny and {{Bowdlerize}}d, and ''WebVideo/YuGiOhTheAbridgedSeries'' made it impossible to enjoy unironically ever again... pretty much important for any english dub. While the actual show is fondly remembered, and spawned several sequels, the dub is seen as "that Macekre Creator/LittleKuriboh made fun of." Even the minor backlash against YGOATS couldn't save it.
22nd May '16 9:22:07 PM Kelothan
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* The english dub of ''Anime/YuGiOh'' is this. When it first came out, it was a hit, giving 4kids a hit that would prevent themselves from being a OneHitWonder. Even when it was new it was criticized for being corny and {{Bowdlerize}}d, and ''WebVideo/YuGiOhTheAbridgedSeries'' made it impossible to enjoy unironically ever again... pretty much important for any english dub. While the actual show is fondly remembered, and spawned several sequels, the dub is seen as "that Macekre Creator/LittleKuriboh made fun of." Even the minor backlash against YGOATS couldn't save it.
* ''Manga/SailorMoon'' is ''the'' iconic MagicalGirl, and is to this day, homaged and parodied, so it is not this. What is this, however is the dub produced by Creator/DiC. It was only mildly successful when first released, but then it aried on {{Toonami}} putting the show into Anerican consciousness. It even had more episodes produced by Cloverway when DiC ran out of money. It eventually lead to people rediscovering the original... at which point it was made clear [[CutandPasteTranslation that their version was radically different.]] It was virtually abandoned overnight. It got to the point that when Creator/VizMedia announced a new dub, noone cared about the old one.
15th May '16 12:53:57 PM Xteme19
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6th May '16 11:30:44 AM HighCrate
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* The 2003 adaptation to the manga ''Anime/FullmetalAlchemist'' was easily one of the most acclaimed anime of the turn of the millennium, dominating Adult Swim's action line-up for years and acting as a {{Gateway Series}} for many viewers. Since then, its influence in anime circles has waned significantly, primarily due to the release of ''Anime/FullmetalAlchemistBrotherhood'' - a faithful adaptation of the manga's story, which the original anime abandoned halfway through its run. Brotherhood replaced the original anime on Adult Swim after the dub was released, becoming the first step into the franchise for newcomers, as well as adding tons of fuel to the fandom's BrokenBase. ''Anime/FullmetalAlchemist'' has become something of a CultClassic as a result, though its base is just as dedicated as its manga counterpart's.
* While English dubs are still being produced, they definitely aren't coming from as many places as they used to. The closure of [=4Kids=] and Creator/CentralParkMedia, and the infamy of Media Blasters (along with the double whammy of the economic recession and the end of the anime boom in the late 00's) ensured that almost none of the dubs are coming from New York (though some voice actors at least moved to LA and became popular, and Creator/MichaelSinterniklaas still remains popular). Vancouver used to be a popular place for not only English dubs, but voice acting in general, but even there over-saturation killed off their popularity outside of the more famous ones and most of them retreated to work almost exclusively in WesternAnimation. Then there is British voice acting, which is just seen as [[SnarkBait the source of many terrible dubs]] and too expensive compared to North America (most people understand the differences in dialects anyway). Animeigo hasn't dubbed in years, checking North Carolina off the list, and lastly there's Asian English dubs, seen as terrible at best ([[SoBaditsgood some are enjoyably bad]] or good, but not many), and used only because they're cheaper then American ones (looking at you Odex). Hollywood (the entertainment capital of the world) and Texas (Creator/Funimation) won't be going away anytime soon, though, and Vancouver (Creator/OceanGroup in particular) may have a comeback.
* Creator/{{Gonzo}}'s original ''Anime/{{Hellsing}}'' adaptation underwent something similar against the later ''[[Manga/{{Hellsing}} Hellsing Ultimate]]''. The original was [[GermansLoveDavidHasselhoff an underground phenomenon in America]], praised for its excellent dub, interesting take on vampires, and badass fight scenes. Then ''Ultimate'' came along, got the dub voice cast back, explored the mythology, and [[BloodierAndGorier took the fight scenes]] UpToEleven. It also increased interest in the original manga... and then people realized just how much [[OvertookTheManga the Gonzo series had overtaken it]]. Cue people picking it apart for the usual Gonzo sins, including [[OffModel cheap animation]] and an abrupt GeckoEnding. Today, the Gonzo adaptation is mostly remembered for [[CrowningMusicOfAwesome its soundtrack]] (and to some its AlternateCharacterInterpretation of Seras as the viewpoint character), while ''Ultimate'' has achieved an iconic status.



* Creator/MediaBlasters. During the anime boom they were a very popular company, and their ''WesternAnimation/InvaderZim'' DVD releases even got them fans outside of the otaku community. Now thanks to their increasingly cheap production values, the failure of their manga division, and numerous delays (to the point that many series ''never actually get released'') they're almost universally disliked. Many anime fans are surprised to hear they're still in business, to the point of it being a RunningGag.
* LongRunners have become this. In the aughts, most anime ran for several seasons, with it being uncommon for one to make it less than fifty episodes. There were ShortRunners, but they generally vanished from the public eye quickly, with the occasional cult following. Shows like ''Inuyasha'' above had an end date best described as "has the budget run out yet? If not, keep going." Being similar to American episodic cartoons in format, many of these shows also made it to American broadcast, increasing their popularity further - most of {{Toonami}}'s biggest shows were among these. But as time went by, a number of factors made this method impractical. The anime boom drew to a close, and casual fans looking for a weekly fix dried up. This caused a decrease in most show's budgets, making it more practical to go for a shorter run. Furthermore, this heralded the rebirth of short-run prestige shows, with a defined end point that rarely went over [[TwelveEpisodeAnime twelve to twenty-four episodes]]. These shows came on the heels of a backlash against this technique, claiming it led to {{Padding}}, {{Filler}}, and [[OffModel crappy animation]], as well as a backlash against shounen series (many of which were LongRunners). It's very rare today to see a new series aim for more than thirty episodes, and plenty of LongRunners have since been cancelled, with only a few like ''Anime/{{Pokemon}}'' sticking around thanks to merchandising and the GrandfatherClause.
** Another problem with LongRunners is that they are more prone to ContinuityLockout. In both Japan and the West, fewer people have as much time for anime viewing may it be for job commitment or competition from other media like VideoGames and LiveActionTV. Subsequently, anyone who spends less time on a LongRunner series would run the risk of becoming lost and confused with ongoing plots and story arcs. However, some long-lasting franchises, like Franchise/PrettyCure and Franchise/{{Gundam}} worked around this problem by offering AlternateContinuity series that wouldn't need years of backstory for newcomers. Adding onto this is the combination of a crippling economic recession in Japan and an aging population caused by an ongoing decline in birthrate, making long-running series immensely impractical to produce.
* As TheNewTens move on, it is becoming increasingly apparent that {{Shonen|Demographic}} anime and manga are distinctly waning in popularity in the West. Beginning in the early [[TheNoughties noughties]], there was a massive boom in the popularity of shonen manga outside Japan, with numerous series all being released in the US and many other countries all at around the same time. These included the juggernauts referred to as [[FanNickname "The Big Three" or "The Holy Trinity"]], namely ''Manga/OnePiece'', ''Manga/{{Naruto}}'' and the previously-mentioned ''Manga/{{Bleach}}'', all three of which practically printed money at their peaks. Of the three, however, ''Bleach'' was the first to begin to show cracks, getting its anime canceled following the poor reception of the Arrancar Saga (the post-cancellation Thousand Year Blood War Saga in the manga has been better received, but its fanbase is a niche one compared to that which came before). ''Naruto'' fare much better than ''Bleach'', having remained popular from beginning to end in Japan even getting a SpinOff series announced. In the West though, several controversial plot twists toward the end of the series took a large chunk out of its fandom, and, like ''Inuyasha'' before it, it became more famous for its gargantuan FanDumb (to the point that /a/ actually banned discussion of it). In the meantime, many series that premiered in the same "boom" as the Big Three (''Manga/ShamanKing'', ''Manga/ZatchBell'', and [[Anime/FullmetalAlchemist both]] [[Manga/FullmetalAlchemist versions]] of ''Fullmetal Alchemist'' to name a few) had long since ended, Western and Japanese interests had become increasingly divergent (something that has affected Japanese video game sales as well). Fans who were teenagers during the boom have [[FleetingDemographic aged into their twenties and thirties and moved on]], while the aforementioned backlash against LongRunners took place. ''One Piece'' is still a consistent critical and commercial success, but more people are willing to criticize it, especially its [[ArcFatigue pacing]], than before. The lone exception to this rule seems to be ''Manga/DragonBall'', which seems to be undergoing PopularityPolynomial.
** Nowhere better can the death of the shounen boom be seen than in ''Manga/{{Toriko}}''. After being hyped to hell and back and scoring crossovers with ''One Piece'' and ''Dragon Ball'', it made almost no headway in the West, regularly being outsold by ''Bleach''. Ironic as in Japan, it usurped Bleach's position as a part of the big three, but only for a while.
** ''Manga/{{Naruto}}'' still usually holds the top spot in [[http://www.crunchyroll.com/videos/anime Crunchyroll's ranking]], with ''One Piece'' and ''Fairy Tail'' hovering nearby. But all of these, especially ''Naruto'', are extremely common choices for "[[ItsPopularNowItSucks popular anime that you don't enjoy]]," so there seems to be a BrokenBase. Meanwhile, DarkerAndEdgier shonen like ''Manga/AttackOnTitan'' and ''Manga/HunterXHunter'' are what's popular now. There may just be [[SillyRabbitIdealismIsForKids less interest in more whimsical stories]] these days.
** A big factor of the decline in popularity in both Shonen and the aforementioned LongRunners is that in the past decade there's been a shift in anime adapting from LightNovels instead of manga. ''Haruhi's'' massive critical success served as the lynch pin for more light novels to become adapted. The fact that their quicker-pace in comparison to shonen manga [[TwelveEpisodeAnime lent themselves better to adaptations.]]
** However, with the success of the ''Manga/JoJosBizarreAdventure'' anime and the aforementioned ''Manga/DragonBall'', this trope may be starting to fizz out with the {{Shonen|Demographic}}.
3rd May '16 3:19:35 AM Kuruni
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* ''Manga/AxisPowersHetalia'' has fallen mostly into this. It gained enough popularity to garner a massive fanbase infamous for its particularly obnoxious parts and had tons upon tons of fanart, {{fanon}}, and cosplayers at conventions, as well as a FandomRivalry with the ''Webcomic/{{Homestuck}}'' fandom for a while before they became FriendlyFandoms instead. However, once it hit its peak, it began to decline gradually as the anime got retooled and went on hiatus, the creator's blog updates became more and more sporadic, and fans began leaving to focus on greener pastures like ''Manga/AttackOnTitan'' or ''Anime/{{Free}}''. Although the fanbase still lingers, it's noticeably a lot quieter than it used to be and there are far more older fans from when the fandom was in its heyday than newbies sticking around.
3rd May '16 1:13:44 AM ASplashingKoi
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* ''Manga/AxisPowersHetalia'' has fallen mostly into this. It gained enough popularity to garner a massive fanbase infamous for its particularly obnoxious parts and had tons upon tons of fanart, {{fanon}}, and cosplayers at conventions, as well as a FandomRivalry with the ''Webcomic/{{Homestuck}}'' fandom for a while before they became FriendlyFandoms instead. However, once it hit its peak, it began to decline gradually as the anime got retooled and went on hiatus, the creator's blog updates became more and more sporadic, and fans began leaving to focus on greener pastures like ''Manga/AttackOnTitan'' or ''Anime/{{Free}}''. Although the fanbase still lingers, it's noticeably a lot quieter than it used to be and there are far more newbies than older fans from earlier sticking around.

to:

* ''Manga/AxisPowersHetalia'' has fallen mostly into this. It gained enough popularity to garner a massive fanbase infamous for its particularly obnoxious parts and had tons upon tons of fanart, {{fanon}}, and cosplayers at conventions, as well as a FandomRivalry with the ''Webcomic/{{Homestuck}}'' fandom for a while before they became FriendlyFandoms instead. However, once it hit its peak, it began to decline gradually as the anime got retooled and went on hiatus, the creator's blog updates became more and more sporadic, and fans began leaving to focus on greener pastures like ''Manga/AttackOnTitan'' or ''Anime/{{Free}}''. Although the fanbase still lingers, it's noticeably a lot quieter than it used to be and there are far more newbies than older fans from earlier when the fandom was in its heyday than newbies sticking around.
3rd May '16 1:12:52 AM ASplashingKoi
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Added DiffLines:

* ''Manga/AxisPowersHetalia'' has fallen mostly into this. It gained enough popularity to garner a massive fanbase infamous for its particularly obnoxious parts and had tons upon tons of fanart, {{fanon}}, and cosplayers at conventions, as well as a FandomRivalry with the ''Webcomic/{{Homestuck}}'' fandom for a while before they became FriendlyFandoms instead. However, once it hit its peak, it began to decline gradually as the anime got retooled and went on hiatus, the creator's blog updates became more and more sporadic, and fans began leaving to focus on greener pastures like ''Manga/AttackOnTitan'' or ''Anime/{{Free}}''. Although the fanbase still lingers, it's noticeably a lot quieter than it used to be and there are far more newbies than older fans from earlier sticking around.
25th Apr '16 6:33:08 PM bowserbros
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** Another problem with LongRunners is that they are more prone to ContinuityLockout. In both Japan and the West, fewer people have as much time for anime viewing may it be for job commitment or competition from other media like VideoGames and LiveActionTV. Subsequently, anyone who spends less time on a LongRunner series would run the risk of becoming lost and confused with ongoing plots and story arcs. However, some long-lasting franchises, like Franchise/PrettyCure and Franchise/{{Gundam}} worked around this problem by offering AlternateContinuity series that wouldn't need years of backstory for newcomers.

to:

** Another problem with LongRunners is that they are more prone to ContinuityLockout. In both Japan and the West, fewer people have as much time for anime viewing may it be for job commitment or competition from other media like VideoGames and LiveActionTV. Subsequently, anyone who spends less time on a LongRunner series would run the risk of becoming lost and confused with ongoing plots and story arcs. However, some long-lasting franchises, like Franchise/PrettyCure and Franchise/{{Gundam}} worked around this problem by offering AlternateContinuity series that wouldn't need years of backstory for newcomers. Adding onto this is the combination of a crippling economic recession in Japan and an aging population caused by an ongoing decline in birthrate, making long-running series immensely impractical to produce.
15th Apr '16 5:19:55 PM Doug86
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** ''Manga/TsubasaReservoirChronicle'' is this as it started as a GottaCatchThemAll with the characters travelling around TheMultiverse and meeting various versions of other CLAMP characters. Then, it went into a DarkerAndEdgier where the DarkAndTroubledPast of the characters and revelation of certain characters which instigated the plot in the first place. However, this brought in the convoluted origins of Syaoran and by extension, Watanuki of ''Manga/{{Xxxholic}}'' and the last arc became much of a MindScrew which readers tried to make some sense out of it. Several readers believed this is the start of CLAMP's decline which is followed by the NoEnding of ''Xxxholic''. Then on 2015, CLAMP continued the manga with ''Tsubasa World Chronicle'' which seemed to be an AuthorsSavingThrow but the first volume earned poor sales on the second week. These days, everybody remembers the manga as the MindScrew with too many crossovers that rival TheDCU.

to:

** ''Manga/TsubasaReservoirChronicle'' is this as it started as a GottaCatchThemAll with the characters travelling around TheMultiverse and meeting various versions of other CLAMP characters. Then, it went into a DarkerAndEdgier where the DarkAndTroubledPast of the characters and revelation of certain characters which instigated the plot in the first place. However, this brought in the convoluted origins of Syaoran and by extension, Watanuki of ''Manga/{{Xxxholic}}'' and the last arc became much of a MindScrew which readers tried to make some sense out of it. Several readers believed this is the start of CLAMP's decline which is followed by the NoEnding of ''Xxxholic''. Then on 2015, CLAMP continued the manga with ''Tsubasa World Chronicle'' which seemed to be an AuthorsSavingThrow but the first volume earned poor sales on the second week. These days, everybody remembers the manga as the MindScrew with too many crossovers that rival TheDCU.Franchise/TheDCU.
12th Apr '16 7:42:47 AM KizunaTallis
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* While english dubs are still being produced, they aren't coming from as many places as they used to. The closure of 4Kids and CentralParkMedia, and the infamy of Media Blasters (and, let's face it, the recession and end of the anime boom) ensure that almost none of the dubs are coming from New York (though some voice actors at least moved to LA and became popular, and MichaelSinterniklaas still remains popular). Vancouver used to be a popular place for not only english dubs, but voice acting in general(ErinFitzgerald even got her start here, in her only really popular western roles in EdEddnEddy), but there oversaturation killed off their popularity outside of the more famous ones(the recession was a big part too) and most of them retreated to WesternAnimation. Then there is British voice acting, which is just seen as the source of many terrible dubs and too expensive compared to North America (most people understand the diffrences in dialecys anyways). Animeigo hasn't dubed in years, checking North Carolina off the list, and lastly there's Asian English dubs, seen as Terrible at best([[SoBaditsgood some are enjoyabley bad]] or good, but not many), and used only because they're cheaper then American ones (looking at you Odex). Hollywood (the entertainment capital of the world) and Texas (Funimation) won't be going away anytime soon, though, and Vancouver (OceanGroup) may have a comeback.

to:

* While english English dubs are still being produced, they definitely aren't coming from as many places as they used to. The closure of 4Kids [=4Kids=] and CentralParkMedia, Creator/CentralParkMedia, and the infamy of Media Blasters (and, let's face it, (along with the double whammy of the economic recession and the end of the anime boom) ensure boom in the late 00's) ensured that almost none of the dubs are coming from New York (though some voice actors at least moved to LA and became popular, and MichaelSinterniklaas Creator/MichaelSinterniklaas still remains popular). Vancouver used to be a popular place for not only english English dubs, but voice acting in general(ErinFitzgerald general, but even got her start here, in her only really popular western roles in EdEddnEddy), but there oversaturation over-saturation killed off their popularity outside of the more famous ones(the recession was a big part too) ones and most of them retreated to work almost exclusively in WesternAnimation. Then there is British voice acting, which is just seen as [[SnarkBait the source of many terrible dubs dubs]] and too expensive compared to North America (most people understand the diffrences differences in dialecys anyways). dialects anyway). Animeigo hasn't dubed dubbed in years, checking North Carolina off the list, and lastly there's Asian English dubs, seen as Terrible terrible at best([[SoBaditsgood best ([[SoBaditsgood some are enjoyabley enjoyably bad]] or good, but not many), and used only because they're cheaper then American ones (looking at you Odex). Hollywood (the entertainment capital of the world) and Texas (Funimation) (Creator/Funimation) won't be going away anytime soon, though, and Vancouver (OceanGroup) (Creator/OceanGroup in particular) may have a comeback.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=DeaderThanDisco.AnimeAndManga