History BrokenBase / ComicBooks

9th Jul '16 10:43:21 PM Anddrix
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* As with the games, [[ComicBook/SonicTheComic both]] ''Franchise/SonicTheHedgehog'' [[ComicBook/ArchieComicsSonicTheHedgehog comics]]. The various changes from the games and ''WesternAnimation/SonicSatAM'' are a major BaseBreaker in the Archie's comic, and ''ComicBook/SonicTheComic'' fans seem more broken over the unofficially official ''Webcomic/SonicTheComicOnline''.

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* As with the games, [[ComicBook/SonicTheComic both]] ''Franchise/SonicTheHedgehog'' [[ComicBook/ArchieComicsSonicTheHedgehog comics]]. The various changes from the games and ''WesternAnimation/SonicSatAM'' are a major BaseBreaker majorly divisive in the Archie's comic, and ''ComicBook/SonicTheComic'' fans seem more broken over the unofficially official ''Webcomic/SonicTheComicOnline''.
7th Jul '16 6:50:20 PM Pichu-kun
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** Fans are split on whether Betty ([[SpellMyNameWithAnS Bette]]) Kane is the original Batgirl or whether Barbara Gordon s. Betty ''technically'' had the Batgirl mantel first but it was spelled "Bat-Girl", and was more of a DistaffCounterpart to Robin. In TheEighties DC [[CanonDiscontinuity retconned]] Barbara to be the one, original Batgirl while Bette became Flamebird. Fans are split on the technicalities of who should be considered the first Batgirl and whether Flamebird should be a Batfamily member or not.

to:

** Fans are split on whether Betty ([[SpellMyNameWithAnS Bette]]) Kane is the original Batgirl or whether Barbara Gordon s.is. Betty ''technically'' had the Batgirl mantel first but it was spelled "Bat-Girl", and was more of a DistaffCounterpart to Robin. In TheEighties DC [[CanonDiscontinuity retconned]] Barbara to be the one, original Batgirl while Bette became Flamebird. Fans are split on the technicalities of who should be considered the first Batgirl and whether Flamebird should be a Batfamily member or not.



* As with the games, [[ComicBook/SonicTheComic both]] ''SonicTheHedgehog'' [[ComicBook/SonicTheHedgehog comics]]. The various changes from the games and WesternAnimation/SonicSatAM are a major BaseBreaker in the Archie's comic, and ''ComicBook/SonicTheComic'' fans seem more broken over the unofficially official ''Webcomic/SonicTheComicOnline''.

to:

* As with the games, [[ComicBook/SonicTheComic both]] ''SonicTheHedgehog'' [[ComicBook/SonicTheHedgehog ''Franchise/SonicTheHedgehog'' [[ComicBook/ArchieComicsSonicTheHedgehog comics]]. The various changes from the games and WesternAnimation/SonicSatAM ''WesternAnimation/SonicSatAM'' are a major BaseBreaker in the Archie's comic, and ''ComicBook/SonicTheComic'' fans seem more broken over the unofficially official ''Webcomic/SonicTheComicOnline''.



* Campy Franchise/{{Batman}} fans versus DarkerAndEdgier Batman fans. Some prefer Batman as melancholy and stoic while others like him as comedic and fun. This extends to what type of villains he fights and how ther personalities are portrayed, such as whether his more outlandish foes are funny or just obnoxious or whether ComicBook/TheJoker should be genuinely funny or not.
* How ComicBook/HarleyQuinn should be portrayed has become this due to the drift between newer fans (fans who like her because of the ComicBook/New52, ''VideoGame/BatmanArkhamSeries'', or ''ComicBook/InjusticeGodsAmongUs'') and older fans (fans of ''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries''). The problem is caused due to how she's [[DependingOnTheWriter portrayed in media inconsistently]]. Should Harley be a GeniusDitz, a DitzyGenius, or is she ObfuscatingStupidity? Was she a genuine psychologist or was she only in it for the cash and couldn't make it through the schooling on her own? Fans often get into heavy arguments about her portrayals.

to:

* Campy Franchise/{{Batman}} fans versus DarkerAndEdgier Batman fans. Some prefer Batman as melancholy and stoic while others like him as comedic and fun. This extends to what type of villains he fights and how ther their personalities are portrayed, such as whether his more outlandish foes are funny or just obnoxious or and whether ComicBook/TheJoker should be genuinely funny or not.
* How ComicBook/HarleyQuinn should be portrayed has become this due to the drift between newer fans (fans who like her because of the ComicBook/New52, ''VideoGame/BatmanArkhamSeries'', or ''ComicBook/InjusticeGodsAmongUs'') and older fans (fans of ''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries''). The problem is caused due to how she's [[DependingOnTheWriter portrayed in media inconsistently]]. Should Harley be TheDitz, a GeniusDitz, a DitzyGenius, or is she ObfuscatingStupidity? Was she a genuine psychologist (or psychiatrist depending on who you ask) or was she only in it for the cash and couldn't make it through the schooling on her own? Fans often get into heavy arguments about her portrayals.
22nd Jun '16 11:43:44 PM Pichu-kun
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* How ComicBook/HarleyQuinn should be portrayed has become this due to the drift between newer fans (fans who like her because of ComicBook/New52, ''VideoGame/BatmanArkhamSeries'', or ''ComicBook/InjusticeGodsAmongUs'') and older fans (''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries'' fans). The problemis caused due to how she's [[DependingOnTheWriter portrayed in media often varying]]. Should Harley be a GeniusDitz or is she ObfuscatingStupidity? Was she a genuine psychologist or was she only in it for the cash and couldn't make it through the schooling on herself? Fans often get into heavy arguments about her portrayals.

to:

* How ComicBook/HarleyQuinn should be portrayed has become this due to the drift between newer fans (fans who like her because of the ComicBook/New52, ''VideoGame/BatmanArkhamSeries'', or ''ComicBook/InjusticeGodsAmongUs'') and older fans (''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries'' fans). (fans of ''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries''). The problemis problem is caused due to how she's [[DependingOnTheWriter portrayed in media often varying]]. inconsistently]]. Should Harley be a GeniusDitz GeniusDitz, a DitzyGenius, or is she ObfuscatingStupidity? Was she a genuine psychologist or was she only in it for the cash and couldn't make it through the schooling on herself? her own? Fans often get into heavy arguments about her portrayals.
19th May '16 9:23:40 AM Doug86
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* Back to ''Comicbook/{{Spider-Man}}'': Most of the Creator/JMichaelStraczynski run has this kind of issues. Especially the ''Sins Past'' story arc, which reveals that [[spoiler: Gwen Stacy slept with Norman Osborn]], divided fans between those who sees it as "profanation", those who say its good character development, those who don't care, and those who, because of never-ending arguments in fandom, started to hate [[spoiler: Gwen Stacy]].

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* Back to ''Comicbook/{{Spider-Man}}'': ''Comicbook/SpiderMan'': Most of the Creator/JMichaelStraczynski run has this kind of issues. Especially the ''Sins Past'' story arc, which reveals that [[spoiler: Gwen Stacy slept with Norman Osborn]], divided fans between those who sees it as "profanation", those who say its good character development, those who don't care, and those who, because of never-ending arguments in fandom, started to hate [[spoiler: Gwen Stacy]].
15th May '16 8:50:03 PM nombretomado
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** This is just a tip of the iceberg. There are Avengers fans who think last good Avengers run was by Creator/GeoffJohns or Creator/KurtBusiek or even RogerStern. There are fans who like how the brand expanded on multiple titles and even made some of best Avengers books (''ComicBook/MightyAvengers'' vol.2) and those that hate it and claim that the awful books that barerly have anything to do with Avengers (''Avengers Arena'', ''Avengers Undercover'' being commonly used as an example) taint the reputation of entire line. There are fans of ''ComicBook/UncannyAvengers'' and fans of two books by Creator/JonathanHickman, who constantly argue which is ''true'' Avengers series currently going. There are fans who welcome MarvelCinematicUniverse influences and new blood in the fandom and fans who hate how everything has to be like in MCU, no matter how little sense it makes. ''Avengers'' fandom is one giant landmine.

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** This is just a tip of the iceberg. There are Avengers fans who think last good Avengers run was by Creator/GeoffJohns or Creator/KurtBusiek or even RogerStern. There are fans who like how the brand expanded on multiple titles and even made some of best Avengers books (''ComicBook/MightyAvengers'' vol.2) and those that hate it and claim that the awful books that barerly have anything to do with Avengers (''Avengers Arena'', ''Avengers Undercover'' being commonly used as an example) taint the reputation of entire line. There are fans of ''ComicBook/UncannyAvengers'' and fans of two books by Creator/JonathanHickman, who constantly argue which is ''true'' Avengers series currently going. There are fans who welcome MarvelCinematicUniverse Franchise/MarvelCinematicUniverse influences and new blood in the fandom and fans who hate how everything has to be like in MCU, no matter how little sense it makes. ''Avengers'' fandom is one giant landmine.
19th Apr '16 7:47:15 AM Anddrix
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Added DiffLines:

* [[spoiler:Red Mist's]] AlasPoorVillain moment in ''ComicBook/KickAss'' Volume 3. Some feel it does humanize [[spoiler:Chris]] somewhat, and he get's a RedemptionEqualsDeath hammered in by the fact that even though he's sorry, Hit Girl dismisses his apology because of all the harm he's caused. Others feel it's a cringeworthy attempt to try to ring out sympathy for a truly hateful character, and tries to bank more on his film portrayal than the monster he's always been in the comics.
1st Apr '16 11:09:28 AM Pichu-kun
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* How ComicBook/HarleyQuinn should be portrayed has become this due to the drift between newer fans (fans who like her because of ComicBook/New52, the ''Arkham' games, or ''ComicBook/InjusticeGodsAmongstUs'') and older fans (''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries'' fans). How she's [[DependingOnTheWriter portrayed in media varies heavily]]. Should Harley be a GeniusDitz or is she? Was she a genuine psychologist or was she only in it for the cash and couldn't make it through the schooling on herself? Fans often get into heavy arguments about her portrayals.

to:

* How ComicBook/HarleyQuinn should be portrayed has become this due to the drift between newer fans (fans who like her because of ComicBook/New52, the ''Arkham' games, ''VideoGame/BatmanArkhamSeries'', or ''ComicBook/InjusticeGodsAmongstUs'') ''ComicBook/InjusticeGodsAmongUs'') and older fans (''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries'' fans). How The problemis caused due to how she's [[DependingOnTheWriter portrayed in media varies heavily]]. often varying]]. Should Harley be a GeniusDitz or is she? she ObfuscatingStupidity? Was she a genuine psychologist or was she only in it for the cash and couldn't make it through the schooling on herself? Fans often get into heavy arguments about her portrayals.
1st Apr '16 11:03:20 AM Pichu-kun
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Added DiffLines:

* Campy Franchise/{{Batman}} fans versus DarkerAndEdgier Batman fans. Some prefer Batman as melancholy and stoic while others like him as comedic and fun. This extends to what type of villains he fights and how ther personalities are portrayed, such as whether his more outlandish foes are funny or just obnoxious or whether ComicBook/TheJoker should be genuinely funny or not.
* How ComicBook/HarleyQuinn should be portrayed has become this due to the drift between newer fans (fans who like her because of ComicBook/New52, the ''Arkham' games, or ''ComicBook/InjusticeGodsAmongstUs'') and older fans (''WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries'' fans). How she's [[DependingOnTheWriter portrayed in media varies heavily]]. Should Harley be a GeniusDitz or is she? Was she a genuine psychologist or was she only in it for the cash and couldn't make it through the schooling on herself? Fans often get into heavy arguments about her portrayals.
1st Apr '16 10:10:33 AM Pichu-kun
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* The ''WonderWoman'' fandom (and to a lesser degree, the ''[[JusticeLeagueOfAmerica Justice League]]'' fandom) is rather divided over Diana killing Max Lord before the events of ''InfiniteCrisis''. One faction thinks it was a perfectly acceptable storyline plot twist (as Max Lord's mind control over Superman could only be broken with his death) while others considered it both a pointless example of grim-darkness.

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* ''Franchise/WonderWoman'':
**
The ''WonderWoman'' ''Wonder Woman'' fandom (and to a lesser degree, the ''[[JusticeLeagueOfAmerica ''[[ComicBook/JusticeLeagueOfAmerica Justice League]]'' fandom) is rather divided over Diana killing Max Lord before the events of ''InfiniteCrisis''.''ComicBook/InfiniteCrisis''. One faction thinks it was a perfectly acceptable storyline plot twist (as Max Lord's mind control over Superman could only be broken with his death) while others considered it both a pointless example of grim-darkness.



* ''Comicbook/GreenLantern''. God help you if you try and discuss who is the best Green Lantern; the fight between fans rallying behind their preferred Lantern is one of the most persistent in fandom. This is parly due to DC ticking off Hal Jordan and old-school Corps fans by getting rid of them when introducing Kyle Rayner as the new GL. Another topic to avoid is why the less well-known John Stewart (a supporting character in the comic books) was made the central Green Lantern in the ''Justice League'' cartoons. Charges of racism fly like crazy from all sides of ''that'' argument.
** WordOfGod has it that show used John Stewart ''because'' he was less known and thus they would have more freedom characterizing him as they needed without legions of fans jumping down their throats. Making the Justice League more ethnically diverse was deemed "an additional benefit". Furthermore, he fits the team better as [[FiveManBand Jordan's personality would have overlapped too much with Flash and Rayner would be too similar to Hawkgirl]].
* ''ComicBook/{{Batgirl}}'' fans are split over their preference for [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl 2011}} Barbara Gordon]], the original Batgirl, or her DarkerAndEdgier replacement [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl 2000}} Cassandra Cain]], or her LighterAndSofter replacement [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl 2009}} Stephanie Brown]]. Further complicated by the fact that Barbara Gordon fans are split between those supporting her uncrippling and those wishing it happened again. There is always been an UnpleasableFanbase since Cassandra Cain first took the mantle, and now that 3 fairly popular and quite different characters have had the role, it gets worse, even though all 3 have had successful times under other monikers. Which meant that if DC had simply provided all 3 with a consistent role, they could probably avoid such difficulties, but replacements cause the replaced to be PutOnABus and ignored. The Barbara Gordon return was made even worse in the noticeable decline of quality, and conscious but unsuccessful copying of several elements of ''Comicbook/{{Batgirl 2009}}''.

to:

* ''Comicbook/GreenLantern''. God help you if you try and discuss who is the best Green Lantern; the fight between fans rallying behind their preferred Lantern is one of the most persistent in fandom. This is parly due to DC ticking off Hal Jordan and old-school Corps fans by getting rid of them when introducing Kyle Rayner as the new GL. Another topic to avoid is why the less well-known John Stewart (a supporting character in the comic books) was made the central Green Lantern in the ''Justice League'' cartoons. Charges of racism fly like crazy from all sides of ''that'' argument.
**
argument. WordOfGod has it that show used John Stewart ''because'' he was less known and thus they would have more freedom characterizing him as they needed without legions of fans jumping down their throats. Making the Justice League more ethnically diverse was deemed "an additional benefit". Furthermore, he fits the team better as [[FiveManBand Jordan's personality would have overlapped too much with Flash and Rayner would be too similar to Hawkgirl]].
* ''ComicBook/{{Batgirl}}'' fans ''ComicBook/{{Batgirl}}'':
** Fans
are split over their preference for [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl 2011}} Barbara Gordon]], the original Batgirl, or her DarkerAndEdgier replacement [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl 2000}} Cassandra Cain]], or her LighterAndSofter replacement [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl 2009}} Stephanie Brown]]. Further complicated by the fact that Barbara Gordon fans are split between those supporting her uncrippling and those wishing it happened again. There is always been an UnpleasableFanbase since Cassandra Cain first took the mantle, and now that 3 fairly popular and quite different characters have had the role, it gets worse, even though all 3 have had successful times under other monikers. Which meant that if DC had simply provided all 3 with a consistent role, they could probably avoid such difficulties, but replacements cause the replaced to be PutOnABus and ignored. The Barbara Gordon return was made even worse in the noticeable decline of quality, and conscious but unsuccessful copying of several elements of ''Comicbook/{{Batgirl 2009}}''.



** Fans are split on whether Betty ([[SpellMyNameWithAnS Bette]]) Kane is the original Batgirl or whether Barbara Gordon s. Betty ''technically'' had the Batgirl mantel first but it was spelled "Bat-Girl", and was more of a DistaffCounterpart to Robin. In TheEighties DC [[CanonDiscontinuity retconned]] Barbara to be the one, original Batgirl while Bette became Flamebird. Fans are split on the technicalities of who should be considered the first Batgirl and whether Flamebird should be a Batfamily member or not.



* {{Deadpool}}. Post-Fabian, either "back to his roots zany-violent awesome," or "homicidal maniac that ignores all character development from ''Cable & Deadpool''."
** Of course one has to point out that he was a homicidal maniac in Fabian's run too and he has never been that heroic.

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* {{Deadpool}}.ComicBook/{{Deadpool}}. Post-Fabian, either "back to his roots zany-violent awesome," or "homicidal maniac that ignores all character development from ''Cable & Deadpool''."
**
" Of course one has to point out that he was a homicidal maniac in Fabian's run too and he has never been that heroic.



** [[spoiler:{{Franchise/Superman}} and Franchise/WonderWoman as a couple, [[ShipToShipCombat especially from the Clois fans]].]]

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** [[spoiler:{{Franchise/Superman}} {{Franchise/Superman}} and Franchise/WonderWoman as a couple, [[ShipToShipCombat especially from the Clois fans]].]]



** In some corners of the fandom, there are intense arguments over whether the original Terra really was ''that'' sociopathic and evil, or if she was just the designated villain and if Raven is in fact more criminal and horrible of a character for never being punished for some of her own actions (Mind-controlling Wally West into loving her, attempting to come between Nightwing and Starfire, going evil twice and [[MoralEventHorizon committing several atrocities the second time around]], etc. ). These arguments don't end too well, and usually hinge on which character is the favorite of the fan that adds to the debate.

to:

** In some corners of the fandom, there are intense arguments over whether the original Terra really was ''that'' sociopathic and evil, or if she was just the designated villain DesignatedVillain and if Raven is in fact more criminal and horrible of a character for never being punished for some of her own actions (Mind-controlling Wally West into loving her, attempting to come between Nightwing and Starfire, going evil twice and [[MoralEventHorizon committing several atrocities the second time around]], etc. ). These arguments don't end too well, and usually hinge on which character is the favorite of the fan that adds to the debate.


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* ''Franchise/ArchieComics'':
** "Betty or Veronica?" is a classic example, usually combined with ShipToShipCombat. The series has been using the broken base to its advantage for years.
** Jughead's sexuality. A common AlternateCharacterInterpretation has been that he's either gay or asexual. Supporters have their reasons for believing so, such as his general dislike for romance, while people against it hate it for being against the canon. Jughead [[AscendedFanon canonically being]] asexual in the reboot has added fuel to the fire: Great and inclusive or unneeded and pandering?
** The DarkerAndEdgier adaptations such as ''ComicBook/ChillingAdventuresOfSabrina'', ''ComicBook/ArchieVSPredator'', ''ComicBook/AfterlifeWithArchie'', and especially ''Series/{{Riverdale}}''. They go against the stereotypical clean and wholesome image the franchise has built over the years, which is a part of the appeal but is also disconcerting for some fans. Are they good or trying too hard to be dark deconstructions?
** Is ''ComicBook/ArchieComics2015'' a good reboot or not?
* There's a broken base between superhero comics in general versus every other type of comic. Superhero comics are the most popular type of comic in North America, to the point where many people think "comic book" instantly refers to superheroes. Many superhero fans find other genres niche, a waste, or just boring. On the other hand many fans of other genres hate how it's difficult for non-cape comics to become popular or think superhero comics are immature and full of poor writing. There is a frequent overlap between fans though, and many believe comics as a medium shouldn't be limited to superheroes.
* The KidHero character: Yay or nay? Sidekicks in particular get this treatment due to the DarkerAndEdgier depiction of many comics compared to the 40s and 50s. Are sidekicks fun, often self-insert, characters or are they [[TheArtifact relics]] that don't work in modern comics due to how dangerous being a hero is. It doesn't help that many tend to be killed off, though they're ''usually'' brought back eventually. Franchise/{{Batman}} typically gets [[GrandfatherClause a free pass]] but even he isn't safe, as many dislikers of sidekicks either think Robin decreases his coolness or makes Batman seem like someone who endangers children while supporters love the dynamic and think Batman isn't Batman without Robin.
* Should ComicBook/{{Shazam}} be aimed at the 'core' comic audience of adults, children, or be neutral (family friendly)? He is traditionally aimed at kids and was created as a borderline self-insert character but DC has swished between demographics for decades.
10th Mar '16 4:47:36 AM Hunn2070
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* The SuperHero comic book medium as a whole is divided as to if UsefulNotes/{{the Dark Age|of Comic Books}} was a good thing that brought maturity to the medium, or if it's all just {{Wangst}} and UsefulNotes/{{the Silver Age|of Comic Books}} lighthearted goofiness was better. The theme of the ModernAge seems to be the conflict between the two groups, both of which are fighting for [[RunningTheAsylum control of the asylum]].

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* The SuperHero comic book medium as a whole is divided as to if whether UsefulNotes/{{the Dark Age|of Comic Books}} was a good thing that brought maturity to the medium, or if it's all just {{Wangst}} and UsefulNotes/{{the Silver Age|of Comic Books}} lighthearted goofiness was better. The theme of the ModernAge seems to be the conflict between the two groups, both of which are fighting for [[RunningTheAsylum control of the asylum]].
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