History Analysis / Batman

18th Oct '17 5:30:25 PM infernape612
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** Poison Ivy and Croc are probably held at Arkham just because a normal prison couldn't make the accommodations necessary to house a giant lizard man and a woman who controls plants. [[CardboardPrison Not that Arkham does a great job either ...]]
*** I dunno, they probably qualify for a fictional psychosis relating to psychological association of one's identity with the source of metahuman traits rather than human society. ''We'' probably don't have a formal psychological disorder classification for people who categorize themselves as plants and crocodiles rather than humans, but a world with rampant metahumans probably does. They're probably sent to Arkham because their crimes could be stopped (or at least reduced) by convincing them to think of themselves as ''Homo sapiens'', which can only be done at a psychological facility.
*** "''We'' probably don't have a formal psychological disorder classification for people who categorize themselves as plants and crocodiles rather than humans"? I feel like this needs a "yet", seeing as we have those people now.
*** Its been said that KC has been suffering from his mutation/disease so much that he acts more like a reptile than a man.
*** The conditions that you are all looking for is called Species Dysphoria and Clinical Lycanthropy. It's a condition that frequently contributes to the more extreme immersion in abhuman identities frequently found amongst subcultures like the Sanguinarians and Furries.
*** Clayface and Man-Bat probably suffer from a similar "no longer thinks of himself as human, and thus not bound by human social rules due to abnormal metahuman morphology" disorder, emphasized by how Man-Bat is usually a villain to one degree or another, whereas Kirk Langstrom isn't (there's probably some identity disassociation going on there too for Langstrom)
** Scarecrow's characterization varies rather widely, but Jeph Loeb's characterization leaves the impression that he has Dissociative Identity Disorder - when his mask is ripped off in Hush he begins speaking in a normal tone (when he had been singing "Hush little baby ..." before), and doesn't seem to answer to "Scarecrow" and "Jonathan Crane" at the same time. Other characterizations are open to a litany of "diagnoses." Of course, see the "Dr. Crane is faking it" entry above for AlternativeCharacterInterpretation.
** [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_Hatter_(comics) The Mad Hatter]] is said to be schizophrenic.
** Harley is all kinds of crazy, but we can probably specifically pinpoint some variation of Stockholme Syndrome or patient-doctor transference, at least in her StartOfDarkness.
** Calendar Man is almost certainly obsessive compulsive to some degree or another what with his inexplicable calendar theme.
** Firefly is a pyromaniac, and that's a legitimate type of impulse control disorder.
** Maxie Zeus is literally and explicitly delusional.
** Ra's al Ghul is occasionally cited as suffering from a type of insanity induced by the side-effects of the Lazarus pits having more lasting effects on him due to repeated use; they may be hoping that therapy can counteract this and make him a little more rational in his ecological aims.
** Joe Chill: Alcoholism
** This troper would go as far as to say each of the main villains suffers from a cartoonish version of a real disorder. The Joker, for example, has a serious case of mania. It would explain his clownishness and motormouth. The Riddler suffers from obsessive compulsive disorder in most of his incarnations, the Penguin is a narcissist, Catwoman is a crazy cat lady, Mr. Freeze is depressed, Bane is suffering from substance abuse, Two-Face has split personalities, and the Scarecrow is an asshole.

to:

** * Poison Ivy and Croc are probably held at Arkham just because a normal prison couldn't make the accommodations necessary to house a giant lizard man and a woman who controls plants. [[CardboardPrison Not that Arkham does a great job either ...]]
*** ** I dunno, they probably qualify for a fictional psychosis relating to psychological association of one's identity with the source of metahuman traits rather than human society. ''We'' probably don't have a formal psychological disorder classification for people who categorize themselves as plants and crocodiles rather than humans, but a world with rampant metahumans probably does. They're probably sent to Arkham because their crimes could be stopped (or at least reduced) by convincing them to think of themselves as ''Homo sapiens'', which can only be done at a psychological facility.
*** ** "''We'' probably don't have a formal psychological disorder classification for people who categorize themselves as plants and crocodiles rather than humans"? I feel like this needs a "yet", seeing as we have those people now.
*** ** Its been said that KC has been suffering from his mutation/disease so much that he acts more like a reptile than a man.
*** ** The conditions that you are all looking for is called Species Dysphoria and Clinical Lycanthropy. It's a condition that frequently contributes to the more extreme immersion in abhuman identities frequently found amongst subcultures like the Sanguinarians and Furries.
*** ** Clayface and Man-Bat probably suffer from a similar "no longer thinks of himself as human, and thus not bound by human social rules due to abnormal metahuman morphology" disorder, emphasized by how Man-Bat is usually a villain to one degree or another, whereas Kirk Langstrom isn't (there's probably some identity disassociation going on there too for Langstrom)
** * Scarecrow's characterization varies rather widely, but Jeph Loeb's characterization leaves the impression that he has Dissociative Identity Disorder - when his mask is ripped off in Hush he begins speaking in a normal tone (when he had been singing "Hush little baby ..." before), and doesn't seem to answer to "Scarecrow" and "Jonathan Crane" at the same time. Other characterizations are open to a litany of "diagnoses." Of course, see the "Dr. Crane is faking it" entry above for AlternativeCharacterInterpretation.
** * [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_Hatter_(comics) The Mad Hatter]] is said to be schizophrenic.
** * Harley is all kinds of crazy, but we can probably specifically pinpoint some variation of Stockholme Syndrome or patient-doctor transference, at least in her StartOfDarkness.
** * Calendar Man is almost certainly obsessive compulsive to some degree or another what with his inexplicable calendar theme.
** * Firefly is a pyromaniac, and that's a legitimate type of impulse control disorder.
** * Maxie Zeus is literally and explicitly delusional.
** * Ra's al Ghul is occasionally cited as suffering from a type of insanity induced by the side-effects of the Lazarus pits having more lasting effects on him due to repeated use; they may be hoping that therapy can counteract this and make him a little more rational in his ecological aims.
** * Joe Chill: Alcoholism
** * This troper would go as far as to say each of the main villains suffers from a cartoonish version of a real disorder. The Joker, for example, has a serious case of mania. It would explain his clownishness and motormouth. The Riddler suffers from obsessive compulsive disorder in most of his incarnations, the Penguin is a narcissist, Catwoman is a crazy cat lady, Mr. Freeze is depressed, Bane is suffering from substance abuse, Two-Face has split personalities, and the Scarecrow is an asshole.



** [[LackOfEmpathy Anti-social personality disorder]]-He sees others are part of an elaborate joke
** Dementia-The Joker's whole worldview, plus the fact [[NoFourthWall he considers the world he inhabits fictional

to:

** [[LackOfEmpathy Anti-social personality disorder]]-He sees others are part of an elaborate joke
joke.
** Dementia-The Joker's whole worldview, plus the fact [[NoFourthWall he considers the world he inhabits fictionalfictional]].



** [[TheNarcissist Narcissim]]-Sees his crimes as one big game, and loves to goad others(mainly Batman) into playing it

to:

** [[TheNarcissist Narcissim]]-Sees his crimes as one big game, and loves to goad others(mainly Batman) into playing itit.
24th Jul '17 11:04:58 AM Methuselah
Is there an issue? Send a Message


*** Its been said that KC has been suffering from his mutation/disease so much that he acts more like a reptile than a man.



*** Its been said that KC has been suffering from his mutation/disease so much that he acts more like a reptile than a man.
24th Jul '17 11:03:15 AM Methuselah
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

*** The conditions that you are all looking for is called Species Dysphoria and Clinical Lycanthropy. It's a condition that frequently contributes to the more extreme immersion in abhuman identities frequently found amongst subcultures like the Sanguinarians and Furries.
24th Jun '17 4:18:50 PM CJF
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* The Ventriloquist - Similar to Two-Face's dual personalities but unlike Two-Face and Batman, Wesker's other persona subconsciously goes into his puppet which Wesker possibly doesn't know its him making the threats towards himself and others.
** Victor Zsasz: Both lost their wealthy parents and wants to save Gotham, only for Bruce to use the wealth to help others and to use it against crime while Zsasz lost his family's wealth due to gambling and believes saving Gotham by murdering every citizen so he can "free" them from their "prisons".


to:

* The Ventriloquist - ''The Ventriloquist'': Similar to Two-Face's dual personalities but unlike Two-Face and Batman, Wesker's other persona subconsciously goes into his puppet which Wesker possibly doesn't know its him making the threats towards himself and others.
** Victor Zsasz: * ''Victor Zsasz'': Both lost their wealthy parents and wants to save Gotham, only for Bruce to use the wealth to help others and to use it against crime while Zsasz lost his family's wealth due to gambling and believes saving Gotham by murdering every citizen so he can "free" them from their "prisons".

24th Jun '17 4:13:37 PM CJF
Is there an issue? Send a Message




to:

\n** Victor Zsasz: Both lost their wealthy parents and wants to save Gotham, only for Bruce to use the wealth to help others and to use it against crime while Zsasz lost his family's wealth due to gambling and believes saving Gotham by murdering every citizen so he can "free" them from their "prisons".

2nd Feb '17 11:02:04 AM CJF
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* ''Scarecrow'': His main tactic is to rule through fear -- similar to how Batman cultivates a frightening persona to intimidate crooks and hoodlums.

to:

* ''Scarecrow'': His main tactic is to rule through fear -- similar to how Batman cultivates a frightening persona to intimidate crooks and hoodlums. Also their costumes are foils in that Scarecrow had a fear of crows so therefore he dressed up a Scarecrow make himself feel strong meanwhile Batman had a fear of bats but ended up over coming it by being his fear and dressing up as it to frighten his enemies.




to:

* The Ventriloquist - Similar to Two-Face's dual personalities but unlike Two-Face and Batman, Wesker's other persona subconsciously goes into his puppet which Wesker possibly doesn't know its him making the threats towards himself and others.

4th Nov '16 1:49:35 PM SirHandel3
Is there an issue? Send a Message



to:

**This troper has an alternative: Batman has built up a reputation in Gotham after years of fighting crime, to the point where people identify him so much with Gotham that during the time between Batman's death at the hands of Darkseid and his return, "Batman" Jones says that without Batman Gotham "has no one to answer to. [Gotham has] lost its god." In both the DCU and our world, Batman has a cult status, similar to a god. Maxie Zeus on the other hand, models himself after a preexisting god and believes himself to be one while Batman remains aware that in spite of his status he is fully human and not godlike, at least not in the sense that Zeus believes himself to be. Both characters are about myth and legend: Batman became a legend - one that never existed previously - through his persistence and hard work while remaining aware that he is not a god, while Maxie Zeus suffers from delusions of grandeur and immediately started declaring himself to be Zeus. Essentially it boils down to these elements: Both are rich and deluded to some degree about what they can do with their influence; but Batman has been more successful in becoming Gotham's "god" through years of his own hard work while Maxie's success is all in his head. Alternatively, you could interpret them both as not gods, but idols, with Batman being the genuine article who deserves it while Maxie is a false idol.
16th Oct '16 12:35:23 PM Monolaf317
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** [[TheSociopath Sociopathy]]-The Joker is incapable of empathy or guilt, highly intelligent and [[ManipulativeBastard good at manipulating others]]. If you take the interpretation that he's faking madness.

to:

** [[TheSociopath Sociopathy]]-The Joker is incapable of empathy or guilt, highly intelligent and [[ManipulativeBastard good at manipulating others]]. If you take the interpretation that he's faking madness.madness.
----
1st Jul '16 12:29:15 PM CJF
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

** Joe Chill: Alcoholism
29th Jun '16 10:40:41 AM CJF
Is there an issue? Send a Message


Which brings us to TheJoker. He is the extreme of criminal behavior that law is unable to resolve. A constant throughout the series is that Joker ''can not'' be redeemed. His madness cannot be treated or cured. In fact his madness is slightly contagious; trying to analyze him, or in some cases just spending a significant amount of time in his proximity, may drive you mad as well. He can't be contained either; imprison him and he'll just break out again. Only one thing can really be done with him...and no representative of law and order - not even Gotham's extraordinary agent of it - is willing or able to do that. ThouShaltNotKill is the one rule that ''no one'' will break, even though it will quite handily solve the unsolvable problem of the Joker, and that is presented to us as a good thing. Unfortunately traditional concepts of "good" and "evil" do not apply in a place like Gotham. The Joker's continued existence - and the continued reign of terror he engages in - is the inevitable end product of the moral myopia/moral hypocrisy of Gotham City. Everyone in Gotham - including the vigilante who is technically outside the system - is applying a system of morality to a situation where it is no longer relevant, and in the process contributing to their own self-destruction.

to:

Which brings us to TheJoker. He is the extreme of criminal behavior that law is unable to resolve. A constant throughout the series is that Joker ''can not'' be redeemed. His madness cannot be treated or cured. In fact his madness is slightly contagious; trying to analyze him, or in some cases just spending a significant amount of time in his proximity, may drive you mad as well. He can't be contained either; imprison him and he'll just break out again. Only one thing can really be done with him...and no representative of law and order - not even Gotham's extraordinary agent of it - is willing or able to do that. ThouShaltNotKill is the one rule that ''no one'' will break, even though it will quite handily solve the unsolvable problem of the Joker, and that is presented to us as a good thing. Unfortunately traditional concepts of "good" and "evil" do not apply in a place like Gotham. The Joker's continued existence - and the continued reign of terror he engages in - is the inevitable end product of the moral myopia/moral hypocrisy of Gotham City. Everyone in Gotham - including the vigilante who is technically outside the system - is applying a system of morality to a situation where it is no longer relevant, and in the process contributing to their own self-destruction.self-destruction.

[[WMG: Mental disorders of the villains]]
Just what are the types of psychoses that Batman's enemies that are labeled insane and sent to Arkham possess? It's known that Riddler has an extreme case of obsessive compulsive disorder, due to childhood abuse. This makes him obsessed with never lying by leaving clues around, as he simply ''cannot'' commit a crime without clues. Two-Face had multiple personalities, with the darker one being more dominant, but the good side having some power through the use of the coin. It's possible that the Ventriloquist also has multiple personalities shown through the puppet Scarface, but I believe that Scarface is living. And the Joker's mental disorder is unknown. But what's wrong with the other villains like Poison Ivy or Killer Croc? Exactly what is the name of the insanity they have that causes them to do what they do? Feel free to add suggestions.
** Poison Ivy and Croc are probably held at Arkham just because a normal prison couldn't make the accommodations necessary to house a giant lizard man and a woman who controls plants. [[CardboardPrison Not that Arkham does a great job either ...]]
*** I dunno, they probably qualify for a fictional psychosis relating to psychological association of one's identity with the source of metahuman traits rather than human society. ''We'' probably don't have a formal psychological disorder classification for people who categorize themselves as plants and crocodiles rather than humans, but a world with rampant metahumans probably does. They're probably sent to Arkham because their crimes could be stopped (or at least reduced) by convincing them to think of themselves as ''Homo sapiens'', which can only be done at a psychological facility.
*** "''We'' probably don't have a formal psychological disorder classification for people who categorize themselves as plants and crocodiles rather than humans"? I feel like this needs a "yet", seeing as we have those people now.
*** Its been said that KC has been suffering from his mutation/disease so much that he acts more like a reptile than a man.
*** Clayface and Man-Bat probably suffer from a similar "no longer thinks of himself as human, and thus not bound by human social rules due to abnormal metahuman morphology" disorder, emphasized by how Man-Bat is usually a villain to one degree or another, whereas Kirk Langstrom isn't (there's probably some identity disassociation going on there too for Langstrom)
** Scarecrow's characterization varies rather widely, but Jeph Loeb's characterization leaves the impression that he has Dissociative Identity Disorder - when his mask is ripped off in Hush he begins speaking in a normal tone (when he had been singing "Hush little baby ..." before), and doesn't seem to answer to "Scarecrow" and "Jonathan Crane" at the same time. Other characterizations are open to a litany of "diagnoses." Of course, see the "Dr. Crane is faking it" entry above for AlternativeCharacterInterpretation.
** [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_Hatter_(comics) The Mad Hatter]] is said to be schizophrenic.
** Harley is all kinds of crazy, but we can probably specifically pinpoint some variation of Stockholme Syndrome or patient-doctor transference, at least in her StartOfDarkness.
** Calendar Man is almost certainly obsessive compulsive to some degree or another what with his inexplicable calendar theme.
** Firefly is a pyromaniac, and that's a legitimate type of impulse control disorder.
** Maxie Zeus is literally and explicitly delusional.
** Ra's al Ghul is occasionally cited as suffering from a type of insanity induced by the side-effects of the Lazarus pits having more lasting effects on him due to repeated use; they may be hoping that therapy can counteract this and make him a little more rational in his ecological aims.
** This troper would go as far as to say each of the main villains suffers from a cartoonish version of a real disorder. The Joker, for example, has a serious case of mania. It would explain his clownishness and motormouth. The Riddler suffers from obsessive compulsive disorder in most of his incarnations, the Penguin is a narcissist, Catwoman is a crazy cat lady, Mr. Freeze is depressed, Bane is suffering from substance abuse, Two-Face has split personalities, and the Scarecrow is an asshole.
* The Joker seems to have multiple disorders instead of just one:
** [[LackOfEmpathy Anti-social personality disorder]]-He sees others are part of an elaborate joke
** Dementia-The Joker's whole worldview, plus the fact [[NoFourthWall he considers the world he inhabits fictional
** [[DespairEventHorizon Depression]]-ComicBook/TheKillingJoke implies that the Joker uses insanity as an escape from pain.
** Dissociative personality disorder-[[AlternativeCharacterInterpretation The numerous personalities the Joker has adopted over the years.]]
** Platonic [[FoeYay (or not)]] [[StalkerWithACrush eroto]][[StalkerWithoutACrush mania]]-The Joker is obsessed with Batman as his arch-enemy, often refusing to kill him to continue their rivalry. It borders on [[FoeYay outright romance]] in the most twisted way possible.
** [[TheNarcissist Narcissim]]-Sees his crimes as one big game, and loves to goad others(mainly Batman) into playing it
** [[ForTheEvulz Sadistic personality disorder]]-The Joker's favourite crimes are hurting his foes on a personal level, and much of what he does is basically [[MadArtist artistic sadism.]]
** [[TheSociopath Sociopathy]]-The Joker is incapable of empathy or guilt, highly intelligent and [[ManipulativeBastard good at manipulating others]]. If you take the interpretation that he's faking madness.
This list shows the last 10 events of 49. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Analysis.Batman