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This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.

IBlameCommunism: Who realised the function of edit reasons a split second too late, alas. Anyway, I write to justify my insisting on keeping the strike through "lost" as regards the end of the British Empire. The opposition believes that "the Indians made our position untenable". This I do not deny, although I still think the original phrasing was very blunt. However, I do believe that recognising an untenable position and choosing to bow out without a fuss is not losing. The opposition also labours under the impression that the British Empire consisted completely and entirely of India. What of the Dominions? Of the colonies in Africa? Of Malaysia (which can be compared to Vietnam very favourably)? Of the colonies in the West Indies?

It appears to me that we are not debating the nature of decolonialisation, but the meaning of the word "lost". Therefore, I have arrived at the compromise phrasing of "gave independence to". This is of course undeniably and entirely true, whatever your Po V.


IBlameCommunism: I removed a link to Internet Counterattack from the New Improved Union Flag because it's nonsense. That wasn't a counterattack at all: what did the British flag ever do to 4chan (that's where it comes from, I believe?). The "reason" meantioned isn't that 4chan hates your country for no reason (true as this may be), but that the internet is full of silly nerdy people. Like us. And many of them have image manipulations software.


Seth: Hunter Is this really necessary? We already have British Telly Tropes which the IC Number page can be put on. There aren't that many differences between USA and England one Index is enough.

Ununnilium: I disagree. Actually, I'd be for moving some of those tropes over to this page.


Dark Sasami: In response to at least one shrill non-US voice who has screamed repeatedly that Americanitis is a bad thing, I wonder: Do we need Useful Notes On The USA, and if so, what goes into it?

Mister Six: I don't think so. This is a primarily US-based site, so having notes on British shows makes sense. And - speaking as a Brit - the cultural osmosis from the US into the UK is so great that these kinds of notes probably couldn't tell us anything that we haven't picked up from TV, films and books already. At least, not without getting into stuff that's not even slightly TV related, like all this business of giving everyone 20 percent tips, even if the service wasn't particularly exceptional. Actually, that kind of thing might be quite entertaining. Is Fast Eddie willing to let us do that? Because I could definitely do a fun write-up on how the British pub system works even though it's not really that related to TV.

Seth: We have American Political System, but as Six said - most of our programming and films comes from the US - so we sorta already know this stuff. (I know people who care more about the upcoming US election then they do our upcoming election)
Silent Hunter: Sorry, forgot to add The Ashes to the index. Thanks, Corahs Uncle/
Silent Hunter: Anyone know where I can find a picture of three or more of these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbary_macaque

The caption is going to be "Hey, hey, we're the monkeys..."

Citizen: I don't, but now I'm curious how this ties into Britainnia. o.o

Silent Hunter: Gibraltar is famous for them.

Citizen: No love for the flag, SH?

Silent Hunter: Sorry, I wasn't very clear. It's for the page on Gibraltar.

Citizen: Gibraltar (IPA: /dʒɨˈbrɒltər/) is a British overseas territory <— Okay, I guess you making your inquiry here makes a little more sense. =P

Violet Strange: Since the British Courts entry doesn't seem to have a discussion page, I thought this question would probably be appropriate here.

  • One asked who Paul Gascoigne, a famous British footballer with 57 England caps to his name.

What the heck does this mean? Not because I'm pretty sure that the word "was" was left out, although I think it was, but because I have no idea what 'England caps' means in this context. For the record: only a fan of American football, so maybe that's where the translation difficulty is coming from?

Silent Hunter: You can create a discussion page there. "England caps" means he played for the English national side on 57 occasions. You get a cap each time play. Editing now. Sorry.


Paul Power: We've got pages now for each of the countries/principalities that make up Britain, but how about a page talking about the various regions within England (South West, South East, East Anglia, West Midlands, East Midlands, North West, Yorkshire & Humberside and North East)? Could include basic history, famous people and TV programmes, major cities and so on.

Silent Hunter: Go for it.

Chandagnac: We don't have Jersey or Guernsey yet. I know, they're closer to France than Britain, but their constitutional relationship with Britain is similar to that of the Isle of Man (they're all Crown Dependancies rather than British possessions. Which means that they're almost fully independent except for four things: they have Queen Elizabeth II as their (figure?)head of state, the UK will defend them if there's a war, the UK represents them on the diplomatic front (but sometimes they choose to negotiate on their own behalf) and the UK is responsible for their ultimate good governance (this clause is rather vague, and I'm not sure anyone really knows what it means. I suppose if a dictator seized power of the Isle of Man the UK would be duty bound to kick him out.

There have been suggestions that the people of Jersey and Guernsey would like to be fully independent. I'm not entirely sure what they would gain from this, but I read a newspaper article that suggested that they're not entirely happy with how the UK has represented their diplomatic interests. And of course, there's always that sweet, sweet taste of freedom.

Silent Hunter: Feel free to add them. Don't forget their status as tax havens.

Chandagnac: What should the articles be called?

Silent Hunter: Four Little Tax Havens? If we're covering the whole lot in one article.

Chandagnac: Jersey, Guernsey, Alderney and Sark. Right.

Chandagnac: Well, I finally got round to doing it. Somebody who actually lives in the Channel Islands will probably want to correct me (my experience comes mainly from reading about it, but I did go there for a holiday once).

I may try to write up a page for England next. The problem is that English culture (as opposed to Welsh or Scottish or Cornish culture) is so ubiquitous that it's hard to tell whether something is part of English culture. We don't seem to have any iconic stuff like tartan or haggis or a really cool [[Badass]] dragon or cornish pasties, so...


Zarbag: I made a few changes. First, I gave a little background about the various parts that make-up the UK. Secondly I removed the "depending on politics" part about Britain's geography - there's a difference between Britain being in Europe (the continent) which is geographical fact and Britain being in the EU (the political confederation) which is a matter of politics, people shouldn't confuse the two. Thirdly, I changed the "Britain's political setup is ancient and barely altered" bit because this is a romanticised view and, like most such views, not actually true. Britain has retained (or rather inherited from the old Kingdom of England) a lot of political tradition but there have been numerous uphevals (in the 17th century especially) which changed some things drastically (when Queen Anne died her 54-odd closest relatives were refused their monarchical "right" to claim the throne by Parliament, there's a reason for that).


Flanker66: Tell me if it's just patriotic fervour rearing its very ugly head again, but last I checked, Britain was very much a credible military power. Falklands War, anyone?

Flanker66: If no one has any objections I'll edit the line.