Archived Discussion

This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.

From YKTTW Working Title: In Everything But Name

Dragon Quest Z: It is a form of ripoff where the work seeks to be almost a copy of the trope, not just taking major elements. That is a trope. Look at Saints Row 2. That was a deliberate intention to make a copy of GTA. The reason to limit to accusations is to prevent people just confusing this with a ripoff, as you did.

And, as noted, some of these are not ripoffs, but works by the same people when they lost the rights to the other works, see Wonderboy and Adventure Island. That is not a ripoff at all.

Madrugada: I agree with DQZ; there's no reason to cut this. It's a notable and fairly common if not particularly imaginative, aspect of storytelling.

thatother1dude:But if it's a Spiritual Successor because the creator's lost the right to the franchise than it is still a Spiritual Successor; in fact that's a major reason to have a Spiritual Successor instead of just a regular sequel.
If it's someone else deliberately trying to make a game similar because they wanted to make one, it's Spiritual Licensee, but specific to when it's intentional.
If it's someone simply being unoriginal, it is either plagiarism (which does not have examples for a reason) or The Same, but More of Follow the Leader. Everything on here is already covered by a different page, which does a better job of it, and there's very little reason why these should all be on one page when they're all only linked together by this one figure of speech.

Dragon Quest Z: Spiritual successor does not require an exact copy. Perfect Dark is not a copy of Goldeneye. This trope does.
The Same, but More means there are no other elements to set it apart from the trope other than the degree. Not only does this have the other elements like Spiritual Successor, but being an exact copy and being a follower is not about degree. It's about form.
"which does a better job of it" is your opinion. And there is a difference. It's like many store brand products are actually surplus product other companies make and allow the stores to sell at lower cost. It's the same product, but the brand name is taken off. That's an example of this trope, but it's neither a ripoff, not a spiritual successor.

thatother1dude: OK, then this isn't The Same, but More of Follow the Leader (which is about a major work leading to the creation of other works with a similar premise/setting), but it's still all those other things (I also realized Recycled In Space as well); If part of this trope is differentiated from Spiritual Successor by being an exact copy instead of just similar, then it is The Same, but More.
And what is an "exact copy"? Unlike store-bought products, none of these works are literally the same thing, but in different packaging. People can draw parallels between two works of fiction until they're blue in the face, that doesn't make them the exact same thing.

Dragon Quest Z: Fast Eddie just declared it example-less (which I kind of agree with after the poor examples). So it's just to explain the concept now.

thatother1dude: Good enough for me.