This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.
what's the difference launched as Canonical List of Subtle Trope Distinctions: From YKTTW
reorg/clarify The Fonzie Ensemble Darkhorse launched as Canonical List of Subtle Trope Distinctions: From YKTTW
Working Title: Canonical List Of Subtle Trope Distinctions: From YKTTW
arks: What about Butt-Monkey and Chew Toy. Is a Butt-Monkey a character that other characters like beating up on while a Chew Toy is one creators like beating up on? or is the difference in audience reaction? My interpretation is the former, but it's not clear. If it is the latter. The Woobie is another subtle distinction.
Bicornis: Would Genre Savvy vs Medium Awareness be worth of mention? I can see them getting confused sometimes. (A Genre Savvy person reacts to story conventions, a Medium Aware one to the mechanics of the medium.)
- Luc: Sounds valid. Go right on ahead and add it.
What's the difference between a Cute Bruiser and a Badass Lolita ? m~ Sneebs
- PS: Definitely a valid question. I think the main difference is that Cute Bruiser is mostly about the physical abilities of the character (very strong cutie) while Badass Lolita is more of a characterization thing (very ruthles cutie).
CA Lieber: How is a Strawman Political different from a FOX News Liberal, and how many of eath does it take to change a light bulb?
Tanto: A Strawman Political is a slanted depiction of a political viewpoint. A FOX News Liberal is a character who nominally has a political viewpoint opposing the author's, but since the author can't figure out how to make a person with that viewpoint sympathetic, instead is a member of the author's viewpoint in all but name.
Strawmen Political would rather we sit around in the dark; and none, since they're apologizing to the audience for their viewpoint while the real heroes change the lightbulb.
CA Lieber: Thank you. Next question: is there any value in distinguishing Justified Trope from Truth in Television? I think I do know this one—within the continuity versus Real Life—but it took some thinking and I can see people getting confused.
That Other 1 Dude: Four distinction request:
-
Crossover vs. Fusion vs. Intercontinuity Crossover -
Filler vs. Padding vs. Wacky Wayside Tribe -
Bus Crash vs. McLeaned vs. Written-In Absence
SamCurt:One request:
Morgan Wick: And another:
Ethereal Mutation: Here's one:
Author Avatar v. Author Stand-In(Stand In now redirects to Avatar)
Keenath: I edited the "All Myths Are True vs. Mythological Kitchen Sink" explanation to be a little more clear on what distinguishes those two, because the names are misleading. "All myths are true" means only that all the myths of the story's universe are based on actual events, while a Mythological Kitchen Sink means all of our myths are true and exist in the story's universe. (Thus harpies live alongside mummies and yeti despite those coming from vastly different mythological sources.)
The Stray: Distinction Request:
onyhow: Another Request:
KJMackley: I did entries for all of those. I like working on this index, most pages are like "fill in the blank" puzzles, while this is more of a logic puzzle. It requires a bit more critical thinking.
Wild Mass Guess v. Epileptic Trees v. Everyone is Jesus in Purgatory. I find hard to tell which crazy hypothesis (a theory has to be sufficiently/mostly proved) would fit where.
Reign of Terror v. The Thermidor.Took a stab at it.
Yoshi348: With the recent launch of the Laconic version, I've noticed that although many of the Laconic versions are too short on details to make a proper main page entry, most of them are actually a ton easier to read, and perhaps more useful, than the main page entries. I'm definitely going to go through and pare down some of the needlessly wordy examples, but I'd wonder if we should switch to the bullet point method of presentation. This was questioned on the YKTTW of the Laconic version, but it seemed to me that maybe many of the voters were thinking that option meant replacing the current entries with the proposed versions. I'm thinking of using the bullet presentation, but not shortening the explanations to an extreme. (Although some of them COULD be used here, really... compare the Accidental Innuendo line, which could pretty much just be ported here, to the Adaptation Decay line, which could not.)
Jonny D: Changing the format could help some cases. Some explanations that go back and forth between the different tropes might be more confusing in bullet form. I'd like to try and keep the two lists distinct though, rather than just have entries that are copies of one another. I think having the cononical go into more detail on the specifics of each trope, while the laconical just focus on the differences in a concise way is a good way to split it.
Shockz: I've noticed (and admittedly experienced) a bit of confusion about the distinction between Bittersweet Ending and Earn Your Happy Ending; I'm putting it up on the list of distinctions based on my understanding of the difference.
Frank75: We need a clearer distinction between Badass Boast and Badass Creed. The former, as far as I understand it, would be something like "I! AM! BEOWULF!", while the other one would be like "semper fi".
—- Missapplied Phlebotinum v. Forgotten Phlebotinum v. Holding Back the Phlebotinum .
I'm sure these are each quite distinct tropes and have some idea how they might be, but their main pages are pretty bad at conveying that. The Fantastic Aesop page for example does a better job of explaining what Missapplied Phlebotinum and Holding Back the Phlebotinum are than either of their main pages, which make them sound only vaguely distinct from Forgotten Phlebotinum.
Trouser Wearing Barbarian: Cut for sheer amount of ignorance. (Although this is far from the first time I've seen stuff like this on this wiki, sadly.)
- Camp Gay vs. Flamboyant Gay:
- Flamboyant Gay is your typical stereotypical gay character, so cliché now it's mostly used for parody.
- Camp Gay is that turned Up To Eleven.
- While the Flamboyant Gay is stereotypical enough to be offensive, a Camp Gay is so over the top it can't be done straight— it has to be for a parody or instantly inflame viewers... well, non-redneck viewers, anyway.
PS: Distinction request:
Dalantia: Distinction request:
Calling Alameda: I've attempted this one, but if anyone can improve it, be my guest.
This Unknown Troper: How about helping to distinguish these two, since the latter seems to be the former But More:
Can anyone clarify what the difference between Petting-Zoo People and Funny Animal is? It's not really obvious...
Rhomega request:
Calling Alameda: Breakout Character and The Fonzie are the same, one article was simply renamed the other. I've put the other one on the page, though.
Second request: Mental World vs. Journey to the Center of the Mind Even more: Modern Major General vs. General Failure
CA Lieber: Meaningful Name vs Steven Ulysses Perhero
- Because Destiny Says So vs You Can't Fight Fate I've always been confused between these two. They seem the same.
CAD: Hmm... seems to be the same thing, but executed differently. Because Destiny Says So is executed as a character movtive, and You Can't Fight Fate is executed as a plot twist (like You Already Changed the Past).
So should it be added to the list? The differences seem subtle to me.
Storyyeller: Distinction Request
I asked about this one on the forums and there seems to be disagreement- Peteman: I think the difference is one is the former badass in spite of their disability, while the latter is badass because of it (due to their other senses getting supercharged).
Earnest: I also have a distinction request: Character Derailment vs. Out of Character
- Calling Alameda: The former is when it happens in canon, the latter is when it happens in Fan Fic or the like.
Peteman: Distinction Request: Hannibal Lecture vs. "The Reason You Suck" Speech.
Johnny E: Request - Enemy Mine vs Strange Bedfellows.
- I think Enemy Mine refers to situations (when two enemies crash on a planet and need to work together to survive) while Strange Bedfellows is supposed to be an explicit threat (when two enemies have to ally against a third, more powerful faction).
Nithael We should delete this part:
as they have all merged into one (or I think).- PS
- Indeed, I removed that section.
LE Xicon 712: Request - Gag Boobs vs. Boobs Of Steel vs. Most Common Superpower
- I'll run with it.
LE Xicon 712: Thank you. Can anyone else do Captain Ersatz vs. Lawyer-Friendly Cameo vs. No Celebrities Were Harmed vs. Writing Around Trademarks?
Also, we need a clearing up of Götterdämmerung vs. And Man Grew Proud vs. Here There Were Dragons vs. The Magic Goes Away vs. The Time of Myths.
- Considering that some of those are in discussion for renaming, it might be worth holding off for a bit.
Random Surfer: Request - Real Life vs Truth in Television
CAD: This one might not need an entry. Real Life is Real Life. Truth in Television means that a trope has a basis in Real Life. It is our way of reminding readers that tropes are not automatically false.
Lizzie: Request: Fatal Attractor vs Cartwright Curse
Vuther AC: Request - Possession Implies Mastery vs. Instant Expert.
Sam Curt: Request - Ditzy Genius vs Genius Ditz vs Smarter Than You Look
Riti Troll: Request - Chivalrous Pervert vs. Handsome Lech (I can name at least FIVE characters who's on both lists. Can we please decide whether Edgar, Zack, Irvine, Zidane, and Zelos are one or the other. Well, okay, Zidane's in two games and so you can argue he's on both lists.)
- Willbyr - This should probably also include The Leisure Suit Larry and Casanova; I'm thinking of Ryoji Kaji specifically since he could qualify for all of them depending on how you interpret the character.
girlyboy: Request - Reed Richards Is Useless vs. Misapplied Phlebotinum. In both cases, powerful Applied Phlebotinum is not being used to its full potential within the setting, and there's no clear reason why (or at best, a Hand Wave). The former seems to have more of an emphasis on fantastic tech not being used to solve real-life problems, and only dramatic, fantastical ones, while the latter seems to emphasize the use of a particular technology not being taken to its logical conclusion within a show, even when there's no good reason why the characters wouldn't use it for a lot more than they already do. But this distinction does seem quite subtle, and it appears many examples could fit under both tropes... unless I am missing something? I'm not confident enough to add this myself, anyway.
Cameoflage: I think the difference is that they're basically the same phenomenon but the former describes a character who could be improving the world but isn't and the latter describes a piece of technology that could be put to better use (which includes both being more effective in a fight and solving real-world problems) but isn't. But I'm not too confident about that either, so I'm not gonna put it on the main page.
Cameoflage: Can somebody explain the difference between Evilly Affable and Laughably Evil? They both seem to be about villains who're horrible people in every way, and a genuine threat, yet still amusing to watch.
