Archived Discussion

This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.

Trouser Wearing Barbarian: Removed How I Met Your Mother. The reason why there's so many arguments over who's who is because it doesn't fit in the first place. Quit using this trope for Entry Pimps, guys.


Taelor: I have some issues with the firefly entry. First off, there's nine of them. Secondly, Mal as The Hero, Zoe as The Lancer are Jayne as The Big Guy are the only ones who really fit. I don't just don't think the series lasted long enough for any of the other characters to settle into distinct roles. For example, While Kaylee might posses a lot more technical knowledge then the rest, she's also extremely Chicky. Wash, as the sarcastic Non-Action Guy Mission Control also has some claim to The Smart Guy, but like Kaylee, is also extremely Chicky If anyone's going to be The Smart Guy, it would probably be Simon, in that he is the smartest (non-insane) member of the crew who serves as the "Idea Guy" for several of their more lucrative ventures. He's also the best foil to The Big Guy Jayne. However, nearly all of his screen time is in relation either River or Kaylee, so he rarely gets any opportunities to show of his independence. There's also Inara, who has some Chickiness to her, but as she's not actually a part of the crew, you could also make a case for the Sixth Ranger. And then there's River, who seems to activly resist being put into one particular role. She's rather Chickish in "Safe" and "Ariel", but goes Smart Guy in the latter half of "Objects In Space". And then she becomes almost the secondary Hero in The Movie.

Taelor: Gave the issue some thought, and realized that the series really tells two stories, Mal's and River's. Hence, have split the Firefly entry into two distinct but overlapping Five Man Bands: one organized around Mal as The Hero, and one organized around River as The Hero.

Parcae: I don't agree with the Buffy section. Cordelia was never "the chick" - that's the person who resolves disputes and serves as the emotional center for the team, and (awesome though she was) she was far too abrasive for that. Oz wasn't a "sixth ranger" (his allegiances when in human form were never in doubt). Nor was he "the big guy" - not strong enough, and season 4, when he cheats (horribly out of character though that was), is a strange time to start calling him strong-willed. Joyce wasn't really a "team" mom - she barely interacts with Willow or Xander. Willow was arguably the Lancer from the beginning, but putting her there in Season 6, when her erratic behavior mirrored Buffy's rather than contrasting with it, is odd. Xander in Grave was being the Chick (emotionally savvy), not the Smart Guy (intellectually savvy). Dawn was not a Sixth Ranger in Season 7 (but probably was in Season 5); she's been around a long time by that point, and we knew where her allegiances lay. And you've left out Xander twice. (He shared the functions of the Chick with Dawn in the last few seasons - he was the emotional center, and she got kidnapped).

I don't think Buffy fits into these categories after the first season.

Dausuul: Agreed on Buffy. If you squint a bit, you could argue that Buffy is The Hero, Willow is The Lancer, Giles is The Smart Guy, Xander is The Chick, and the role of The Big Guy is filled by Faith in season 3 and Spike in seasons 5-7... but Willow has too much overlap with The Smart Guy, Giles is a mentor figure more than an actual band member, and seasons 1, 2, and 4 are lacking The Big Guy entirely (no, The Big Guy is not optional; if you don't have five members, you can't have a Five-Man Band). What we have here is a classic case of Square Peg, Round Trope, with people struggling to tack on two extra members to the Buffy/Willow/Xander Power Trio.

To sum up, I deleted the Buffy section. I think the Firefly section probably ought to go, too - when you're doing stuff like trying to split a nine-character Ensemble Cast into two separate Five Man Bands, it's pretty clear the show isn't a good fit and you should quit trying.